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Old 03-19-2007, 01:57 PM   #113
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Do you mean the trend of high HP cars, or increasing HP in cars? agree that Hp will remain high, but I really have to wonder how high they will go. IMO 425-450 hp is boarderline rediculous for anyone who who does not have any intentions in using this car to race in some way (not street racing). Of course Iwill still get one even though i think it is rediculous (counterintuitive, i know).
I meant the trend of continuously increasing HP in cars in general... HP in general ONLY translates into higher top speeds... you need exponentially greater power to go faster.

If I remember right, the power required to go faster rises by the cube, so to go twice as fast it takes 8 times the power! So IF it takes 80hp to go 80mph, then it would take 640hp to go 160mph! Since cars with less than 640hp can go 160, we can assume that it takes much less than 80hp to go 80mph...

In any case we should be happy with the fun we've got... the future is just going to be better, and we'll just have to wait for it.

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Old 03-19-2007, 02:15 PM   #114
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Absolutely...I have thought over the idea of electric sports cars, Camaros, Corvettes, Ferrari's, and anything else that comes to mind. It's crazy, but I don't think I'd mind anymore.

The year that GM introduces an electric-drive train Camaro, I will keep an open mind.

I wanted to bring this up...to show that the future may not be so bleak as some might think(as I thought). The Chevrolet Volt is said to produce approx. 120 kilowatts (160hp) of power. The Tesla roadster, which is built for speed, gets 189 kilowatts (253 hp), and can go from 0 to 60 in 4 seconds. So the Volt will probably have very generous acceleration as well. the numbers really aren't that far off.

For those of you who like torque no.'s, the Volt has 236 pound-feet, and the Roadster has about 210 pound-feet. I'm liking the way the numbers are working out in the future of electric cars.
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Old 03-19-2007, 09:58 PM   #115
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“How much horse power is too much for the street”? In my opinion it comes down to what each individual is capable of handling. Oh yes here it comes, wait for it, wait for it, “COMMON SENSE”… “The problem with common sense is it ant so common”… :eek:
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Old 03-20-2007, 03:21 AM   #116
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“How much horse power is too much for the street”? In my opinion it comes down to what each individual is capable of handling. Oh yes here it comes, wait for it, wait for it, “COMMON SENSE”… “The problem with common sense is it ant so common”… :eek:


Ain't that the truth!
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Old 03-20-2007, 08:10 AM   #117
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“How much horse power is too much for the street”? In my opinion it comes down to what each individual is capable of handling. Oh yes here it comes, wait for it, wait for it, “COMMON SENSE”… “The problem with common sense is it ant so common”… :eek:
In principle, I absolutely agree. But if you give _anyone_ that much power, someday they _might_ try to use it. Regardless of training, experience, etc...

The question was more related to the actual _physics_ of using all that power. There simply isn't anyplace to actually use these monstrous amounts of power on the street! 550hp? Can-Am cars had that much power. NASCAR stockers are pretty close to that! Thats almost twice what every WRC car has!

If I were a betting man, I wager that the new Supra is going to have a hybrid drivetrain, and will 'only' make about 325hp, but it will probably make ~400lbft of torque at 0 rpm. Combine that with a really good traction contro system, and you have a nearly unbeatable street-combo. Great performance, great mileage, and a 'clear conscience' (which seems to count for so much these days... hipocrits).

Anyway... sorry to pull this thread off topic.

~LSx
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Old 03-20-2007, 08:36 AM   #118
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In principle, I absolutely agree. But if you give _anyone_ that much power, someday they _might_ try to use it. Regardless of training, experience, etc...

The question was more related to the actual _physics_ of using all that power. There simply isn't anyplace to actually use these monstrous amounts of power on the street! 550hp? Can-Am cars had that much power. NASCAR stockers are pretty close to that! Thats almost twice what every WRC car has!

If I were a betting man, I wager that the new Supra is going to have a hybrid drivetrain, and will 'only' make about 325hp, but it will probably make ~400lbft of torque at 0 rpm. Combine that with a really good traction contro system, and you have a nearly unbeatable street-combo. Great performance, great mileage, and a 'clear conscience' (which seems to count for so much these days... hipocrits).

Anyway... sorry to pull this thread off topic.

~LSx


Good call!

Interestingly enough I was reading somewhere (I forget where) that they are considering having somekind of a driving course requirement for anyone that purchases the new s/c corvette. I found this pretty interesting as I can not think of any other mass-produced car that requires this. However, when you can now purchase a 650HP car for around the six figure mark, a part of me wants to think that there should be some other criteria for ownership other than just having a fat wallet.
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Old 03-20-2007, 03:47 PM   #119
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Originally Posted by LSxcellent View Post
In principle, I absolutely agree. But if you give _anyone_ that much power, someday they _might_ try to use it. Regardless of training, experience, etc...

The question was more related to the actual _physics_ of using all that power. There simply isn't anyplace to actually use these monstrous amounts of power on the street! 550hp? Can-Am cars had that much power. NASCAR stockers are pretty close to that! Thats almost twice what every WRC car has!

If I were a betting man, I wager that the new Supra is going to have a hybrid drivetrain, and will 'only' make about 325hp, but it will probably make ~400lbft of torque at 0 rpm. Combine that with a really good traction contro system, and you have a nearly unbeatable street-combo. Great performance, great mileage, and a 'clear conscience' (which seems to count for so much these days... hipocrits).

Anyway... sorry to pull this thread off topic.

~LSx
I see what you’re getting at and I’m sure all of us have asked our self that exact same question over the past few years with all the HP gains. Are you saying, If diver A has 400 + horse power then they are defiantly going to use it and destroy something, kill someone, or worse yet, take over the world. Whereas, if driver B has only 150 horse power they will obey all traffic laws with their hands in the 3 and 9 o’clock position?

150 MPH is 150 MPH no matter how much horse power it took to get there... Just as, reckless driving is reckless driving no matter if it is performed in “Super Car” or a “4 banger”…

On a side note, here’s how I would use my 400 + HP:
Drive to work.
Drive to the grocery store as well as other errand running .
A kitty magnet (meow)…
A nice summer Sunday drive threw the WM county back roads with the windows down.
A nice cruse to some of the scenic light houses and piers we have in West Michigan.
Cruses and car shows, Woodward, 28th St. GR, and so on...
Roasting the back tires in a cloud of smoke.
Speeding on the freeway.
Slamming threw the gears as needed…
Track time, both Road and Drag strip.
And last but not least to enjoy my life.
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Old 03-20-2007, 03:56 PM   #120
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I see what you’re getting at and I’m sure all of us have asked our self that exact same question over the past few years with all the HP gains. Are you saying, If diver A has 400 + horse power then they are defiantly going to use it and destroy something, kill someone, or worse yet, take over the world. Whereas, if driver B has only 150 horse power they will obey all traffic laws with their hands in the 3 and 9 o’clock position?

150 MPH is 150 MPH no matter how much horse power it took to get there... Just as, reckless driving is reckless driving no matter if it is performed in “Super Car” or a “4 banger”…
Just as I said eariler, you can turn a 100 hp car into just as deadly of a weapon as you can a 400 HP car.

I think what it really comes down to is the type of personality a 400 HP car attracts. For example: You can put my wife in a 1000 HP car or her 100HP car and she will inevitably drive them both the exact same way; going no more than 10 over the speed limit and gently accelerating at stop lights. Put me in that situation and as I said before, i will go through a tank of gas and a set of tires in 30 minutes.

My point is that high horse power cars, in my opinion, attract the type of people who are naturally going to be more adventurous and risk takers, which leads to wreckless driving and accidents. Since you are going to attract people like this (i.e. me) horsepower becomes an issue becasue we will continually push a car to its limits; sometimes in places where it should not be done (next to a mustang at a red light )
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Old 03-20-2007, 04:04 PM   #121
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My point is that high horse power cars, in my opinion, attract the type of people who are naturally going to be more adventurous and risk takers, which leads to wreckless driving and accidents. Since you are going to attract people like this (i.e. me) horsepower becomes an issue becasue we will continually push a car to its limits; sometimes in places where it should not be done (next to a mustang at a red light )
Right, but that’s where your better judgment and “COMMON SENSE” is suppose to kick in. You’re 25 now, no more having any fun behind the wheel Mr.…
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Old 03-22-2007, 02:28 AM   #122
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150 MPH is 150 MPH no matter how much horse power it took to get there... Just as, reckless driving is reckless driving no matter if it is performed in “Super Car” or a “4 banger”…
Speed IS speed, but a typical 4 banger running 150 mph is no where near as stable as a super car designed with the aerodynamics, suspension, and braking to still be responsive at high speed.

I'm just nitpicking I guess, but some cars are more dangerous at high speeds than others.

Which also proves the point I guess. A factory that produces a 400 hp car would probably design it to satisfactorily harness that power. Hopefully, not to the point where 400 hp is just a number and electronic controls keep it from ever really reaching its potential.


Anyway, I think we are getting into an era where engines are more powerful than the muscle cars of yore.

Back in the day most muscle cars had 300-400hp, and 350-450 tq. Though many were underrated for insurance reasons, they were also based on gross engine ratings. Not to mention that even with all the power from the factory old muscle cars were still 13 and 14 second rides out of the factory.
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Old 03-23-2007, 03:01 PM   #123
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Just thought I'd give this a BUMP in celebration of the 5 week mark before we officialy get some information on the LS3

I was, once again, reading on the corvette forums and apparently there are some people that have it on very good authority (someone's brother works at the St. Catherines Powerplant factory--wonder if you know him 3Whiterag) that we are all going to be very pleasantly suprised because the LS3 is in fact rated at 450HP, not 425 hp like most people are suspecting.

We will all see for sure in 5 weeks!
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Old 03-24-2007, 10:14 AM   #124
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Forgive me, but what's in five weeks(?), I think I'm outta the loop on this one.

Oh and BTW, I posted a thread that gives directions to some preliminary info on the LS3's foundation, the L92 truck engine.

I found it kinda interesting.....
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Old 03-24-2007, 02:11 PM   #125
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Forgive me, but what's in five weeks(?), I think I'm outta the loop on this one.

Oh and BTW, I posted a thread that gives directions to some preliminary info on the LS3's foundation, the L92 truck engine.

I found it kinda interesting.....
The unveiling of the 2008 Corvette is in 5 weeks at the Corvette museum. That is when they release all of the specifications and information on the new model, which will have the LS3.
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Old 03-24-2007, 09:18 PM   #126
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I see
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