AUTO RESTRUCTURING FACT SHEET

[SS 376]

Originally Posted by gtahvit

In my opinion they are better qualified than the federal government. And I don't mean political party. I mean Feds. I've worked for the feds for over 15 years. They don't understand profit and loss, profit before taxes, marketing, revenue, etc. The Feds deal quite literally in monopoly money. They don't see the end to end flow of money that companies and corporations have to deal with on an hourly basis in most cases.

Ok. What would be your prescription for GM? What, if anything, do you think is wrong with GM and what should be done about it?

Personally, I think the benefit structure set up by GM has to go away. That really can only be done through bankruptcy or at least the threat of it. I think Chevy and Cadillac are viable entities; I think Hummer, Saturn, etc. largely are not. The best way to preserve Chevy, and by extension the Camaro, is through this process. I think it could've been avoided but there was no way any bank would ever lend to GM to finance a reorganization, not given the banks' financial troubles and not given GM's already shaky financial status. If this was happening in 1999 or 2002, no way would the government need to get involved. The private free market would've solved the problem.

I do not think a protracted court battle that takes place for the next 3-4 years is a good idea because 1) the outcome is unpredictable, which would further damage GM's reputation with consumers if anything actually survives, and 2) a bankruptcy court judge is as not well-equipped to do a reorganization (as opposed to just liquidating the whole thing) as a group of people, private and public (people forget that debtholders, management and other stakeholders have a large say. Even if Wagoner was deposed, these groups are definitely not just along for the ride. They would've raised unholy hell if they were cut out of the process).

btw I also work for the federal government. The lawyers here are a damn sight sharper than a lot of private attorneys I know personally. That's why I have more confidence in the government than most people here.

[67camaro99]

I dont see where they are forcing a change in the line up. Common sense tells you that you need to shift your product line to the new reality. One that came to us last year at $5 a gallon...
One where GM had a 50% market share, is below 25%...
I am not GM bashing, I am saying that some restructering will do it some good. Having all those brands adds to cost.
On a different thread, someone asked about a strip'd down Camaro, (no power windows, no ac... etc), and Fbod quoted Millions in development costs, to engineer such a car.

Total Sales through FEb:
Saturn Aura - 2,800
Malibu- 21,000
Pontiac G6- 10,000

Crossovers:
Outlook: 1,960
Traverse: 11,632
Arcadia: 7,991
Enclave: 6078

So, your telling me that GM should build whatever they want at a loss??? Thats 1900 Units for Saturn Outlook... Annualize that, and thats 12,000 units...

Stop GOV't bashing, and wake up to the reality that GM does need to restructer its brands... because its the right thing to do, not because of Gov't.

[cyberbro]

Originally Posted by ZombieEatsYou

Just heard on Fox from Stuart Varney: Govt is telling GM to kill the Volt along with 11 of it's 20 most profitable vehicles. Which 11; trucks and SUVs. Varney's take: political considerations will now override economics. GM will be forced to build small, fuel efficient vehicles that the government wants us to drive.
My opinion now. Question is, how are they going to force us to buy them? Rest assured, there will be "force" of some kind.

It's always nice to see the free market sytem at work.

[67camaro99]

BTW, post 30, was in response to post 9 and 10...
I agree with what you said, can-am...

[Kyle2k]

Seriously....do they seriously want the Volt dead?....Seriously? (I feel like Kyle from a SP episode more than I do myself today)

[67camaro99]

Agreed.... In other news....

GM launched its "Total Confidense" program today...
Equity protection
Job Loss Payment Protection

GM has some DAMN good vehicles... hopefully sales increase

Step in right direction...

[JaysonAych]

Originally Posted by azfan

It's nearly worthless to quote any reporter about cars. Yesterday, MSNBC's Chris Matthews posed the question, "when are we going to catch up to the Chinese on cars?"

Agreed. I haven't seen another person or another news source anywhere that's said the government is looking to have direct control over the product lineup. Until there is independent confirmation, this is just wild speculation.

[rmyers]

Originally Posted by Hylton

I guess it boils down to those who believe "the people" have a right to state what happens with "their" money and those who believe "the people" should just hand over the cash and get out of the way.

And then there are those of us that have consistently said GM should have NEVER been given the money to begin with. Now we will have lost billions of dollars and bankruptcy will still occur.

[fastball]

As far as the Volt is concerned, I have to agree the 40k price point is too much when Insights and Prius' will be going for the mid-20s. I don't think the govt. is telling them to kill it because they don't want it, they are telling them to kill it because it is right now as we speak costing GM big bucks in R&D, and there is no time to waste to take a "wait and see" attitude. If GM were to sell those at a loss, that's more govt. money GM is wasting.

I really do see the economics. It's dissheartening if in fact GM does kill the Volt due to expense, but perhaps they can take what they've already learned and already got and turn it into something they can sell in the low-mid $20k range and make a profit at the same time.

[GTAHVIT]

Originally Posted by Can-Am

Ok. What would be your prescription for GM? What, if anything, do you think is wrong with GM and what should be done about it?

Let me be clear, I said that I believe GM is better qualified, as a company, than the Federal Gov. is to make GM sustainable. I am certainly not qualified.

So with that in mind, I feel that GM's plan was the right one. And In my defence, No one had a problem with GM's plan until the current administration decided to intervene. So, yes I question the decision of the federal Gov. to get involved in the restructuring of GM. I understand that CEO and BOD sometimes must take the fall. After having served in the Navy, and watching a highly decorated Capt. of an aircraft carrier, who didn't loose a single sailor, or plane, had Zero collateral damage to non military targets, get relieved of command because his LT was on the bridge when a 19' pleasure boat got too close and was capsized by the carrier's wake. The Capt. was taking a nap after being on the bridge for 36 hours straight... He had to take responsibility for what happened... Is it fair? No. So, I get it that Wagoner and the board were removed. I don't agree that it is the government's place to make that call. But that is irrelevant at this point.

Originally Posted by Can-Am

Personally, I think the benefit structure set up by GM has to go away. That really can only be done through bankruptcy or at least the threat of it.

I agree and GM's plan to restructure accounted for that very problem.

Additionally, You must have cooperation from the Unions to address that. Much like the AIG bonuses. GM is under contract to pay out those benefits. Without the Union's acceptance of the "threat" the Gov is placing upon them it's just a threat with no real teeth.

And since when did a threat become a viable strategy against any organization this size of the Union or GM... Everyone involved in this knows that threats are to get the observer to form an opinion. It has nothing to do with getting the goals accomplished. Do we really think the Union and GM are going to cave to threats now? So, in that we disagree. Save the threats and just send them to bankruptcy if that is what the gov wants. I'd rather have that then a federal approach to restructuring a private company.

Originally Posted by Can-Am

I think Chevy and Cadillac are viable entities; I think Hummer, Saturn, etc. largely are not. The best way to preserve Chevy, and by extension the Camaro, is through this process. I think it could've been avoided but there was no way any bank would ever lend to GM to finance a reorganization, not given the banks' financial troubles and not given GM's already shaky financial status. If this was happening in 1999 or 2002, no way would the government need to get involved. The private free market would've solved the problem.

I agree completely. However, this is bigger than our camaro. I'd easily sacrifice the camaro to see our government stick to what it does best. I know that sounds harsh but I truly feel that way.

Originally Posted by Can-Am

I do not think a protracted court battle that takes place for the next 3-4 years is a good idea because 1) the outcome is unpredictable, which would further damage GM's reputation with consumers if anything actually survives, and 2) a bankruptcy court judge is as not well-equipped to do a reorganization (as opposed to just liquidating the whole thing) as a group of people, private and public (people forget that debtholders, management and other stakeholders have a large say. Even if Wagoner was deposed, these groups are definitely not just along for the ride. They would've raised unholy hell if they were cut out of the process).

I want structure and therefore I place the bankruptcy laws way ahead of a Gov. appointed committee handling the survivability of GM.

Again, my preference is Let the new CEO and BOD get a chance to continue down the road on their own. Then go to bankruptcy, then get the Congress and Senate involved, then bring in the white house... That is how this is supposed to work. But the white house being directly involved is not the way our federal system is designed. I'm not going to speculate here why the white house has jumped ahead of the line. But I don't like it.

Originally Posted by Can-Am

btw I also work for the federal government. The lawyers here are a damn sight sharper than a lot of private attorneys I know personally. That's why I have more confidence in the government than most people here.

I have exceptional confidence in our government, even when I don't agree with them. But, my confidence is limited to what they are designed to do. Not a situation like this. Just putting powerful people in charge of a problem is no guarantee that it will fix the problem... More often than not well informed people will fix it. As I've said throughout. My opinion is that GM is the most well informed at this time. Again, Nobody was against their plan until the white house got involved. When did they become experts? Just because you have the power, doesn't mean you should always use it.

Again this is all my opinion.

[SS 376]

Hey... we just had an intelligent conversation about politics!

On the union point, they will eventually cave. They have no leverage here, except threatening not to vote for Dems & President Obama in 2010 & 2012, which isn't much of a threat, if you ask me.

At this point, let's just hope this all works and the gov't can sort it out, get out of the auto business (and the finance business) and let whatever becomes of GM restore itself to its former prominence.

[Justin]

Does anybody have a link to this? I'd rather not set my pants on fire until it's more than an economist possibly speculating on a TV news channel.

[Suskam]

Originally Posted by Justin

Does anybody have a link to this? I'd rather not set my pants on fire until it's more than an economist possibly speculating on a TV news channel.

Here is the link: It's on the GMsupplyPower website, not an economist view.

http://www.gmsupplypower.com/apps/r4...act033009.html

[syr74]

This is really simple. We live in what is supposed to be a free market society, and in a free market society when a company goes bankrupt it, well, goes bankrupt. If said company can manage through a Chapter 7 reorganization then it will survive relatiely intact. If not, the old girl gets split up and, more often than not, verious entrepueners and entities take the leftover parts and make something better out of the wreckage. In the case of GM, like every other private company on earth, that is exactly what should have been allowed to happen. It would have been better for the people of the United States and it would have been better for GM which likely would have continued on in worthwhile, if distinct, entities even after Chapter 11..

Now GM fans will face the worst of all possible outcomes, a GM run by the government.....an entity completely incapable of running a company in the first place for myriad, obvious reasons.......and not only run by the government but run by a government controlled be an extremely left leaning political party. Welcome to the American version of GAZ guys. If GM is the only victim of the current administration we'll be extremely lucky.