[ULTRAZLS1]

Originally Posted by ChefBorOzzy

Yup. .I've never heard more excuses than I have on the Mustang forum. Honestly, I'm glad I bought my Mustang second hand and didn't give the monies to Ford. LOL. Now I want a new Camaro or a Scat Pack Charger.

Charger over challenger?

You like 4 doors better ? Might as well if it's that big I guess. Just think the chally looks better.

Honestly the coyote is impressive and I considered selling my camaro for a few days back in 2011. It always goes back and forth. But I NEVER turned into a whiny little troll with excuses and speculation as a defense. I give credit where it is due.

Just lost what respect I had for a lot of the owners over the past few months. I know both sides do it. But they have a cheerleader for god sake and lately I can't even visit the forum. They take it to another level.
It seems like close to half of them have lost it...

On a serious note and giving credit. The car will perform. The numbers are decent. But it's a far cry from the threats and extreme speculation that's been rampant lately. If this doesn't at least beat the z28 on a track they are really going to look dumb...the r version without a back seat or even a radio should be able to... I hope

[ChefBorOzzy]

Originally Posted by ULTRAZLS1

Charger over challenger?

You like 4 doors better ? Might as well if it's that big I guess. Just think the chally looks better.

The only reason I'd get the Charger is if I were to turn both of my cars in and have one daily driver. I love the look, power, and transmission is damn good. Should be comfortable overall as well. I do enjoy getting in the Mustang and rowing the gears though.

I'll see what I'll do as time goes by.

[ULTRAZLS1]

Originally Posted by IOMike

I believe the Z/28 Ls7 makes a few more torque vs the z06 due to its headers, but I haven't followed it closely enough to know all the facts.

As it stands, the LS7 is more impressive. I agree on a mild tweak of the LT-1 will rub their face in the dirt just like the LT-1 is going to do to the new Coyote 5.0.

Looks like an SS will be a good drag race for a GT350 as I believe, but am not sure, that it's only the GT350R that's losing weight. I heard 5 or 600lbs, but in typical Ford fashion it will be 150lbs tops (but it will feel like 5-600 according to the Mustang boys due to the CF Wheels)

Thought I read 130 lighter than standard gt350. Not sure how much it weighs in the first place... Maybe more than a regular gt.... It has gigantic brakes

The cf wheels lose like 13 lbs each. That's rotational weight on the wheels. It will help a lot more than weight taken out of the car itself.

The r version will be the performer no one will want ( the people bragging about them) and will be over 60k.
All this will be lost in ford fanboy smoke and mirrors and they will consider the car a 47k wonder of the world ( even though it's 50 with gg tax). It's limited production as well. I think you even need to spend like another 7 grand to even get some nice features. Smart move and the ford crowd falls for it every time...

It's not as cheap as it looks and the real performer is a track only car. Z28 had problems selling with a back seat and a radio...


All so apples to apples to an ss

[chain777]

It's amazing how different the reaction is here compared to anywhere else. So you think the numbers aren't impressive, the high revs are a joke, and the LT1SS is going to be all you need to match it. Remember how badly the Boss beat the SS in the quarter? That was with 82 less horsepower and 49 fewer torques. The weight will be within a hundred pounds or so and the R will probably be lighter than the Boss.

I think your under-estimating the benefits of high revs and a broad power-band in an engine designed for the track. It's not just the peak numbers that matter.

[LesserO2Evils]

Originally Posted by chain777

It's amazing how different the reaction is here compared to anywhere else. So you think the numbers aren't impressive, the high revs are a joke, and the LT1SS is going to be all you need to match it. Remember how badly the Boss beat the SS in the quarter? That was with 82 less horsepower and 49 fewer torques. The weight will be within a hundred pounds or so and the R will probably be lighter than the Boss.

I think your under-estimating the benefits of high revs and a broad power-band in an engine designed for the track. It's not just the peak numbers that matter.

Idk what reaction YOU have seen but over on Mustang6inchesinThePill.com, they are even concerned. "Broad powerband"? Did you even SEE the dynosheet!?
Will a stock 16 SS beat it in 1/4? Incredibly doubtful. But it wont be a trouncing. Esp factoring a sizeable price difference and all the hype Ford has blown out there bout this car. Few mods- I say, yes. The Z28!? That will be decimation.

[GretchenGotGrowl]

Originally Posted by LesserO2Evils

Idk what reaction YOU have seen but over on Mustang6inchesinThePill.com, they are even concerned. "Broad powerband"? Did you even SEE the dynosheet!?
Will a stock 16 SS beat it in 1/4? Incredibly doubtful. But it wont be a trouncing. Esp factoring a sizeable price difference and all the hype Ford has blown out there bout this car. Few mods- I say, yes. The Z28!? That will be decimation.

Another hard "pill" to swallow I bet. I quit visiting that forum because of our "friend" over there.

[13vertss]

Originally Posted by ULTRAZLS1

Thought I read 130 lighter than standard gt350. Not sure how much it weighs in the first place... Maybe more than a regular gt.... It has gigantic brakes

The cf wheels lose like 13 lbs each. That's rotational weight on the wheels. It will help a lot more than weight taken out of the car itself.

The r version will be the performer no one will want ( the people bragging about them) and will be over 60k.
All this will be lost in ford fanboy smoke and mirrors and they will consider the car a 47k wonder of the world ( even though it's 50 with gg tax). It's limited production as well. I think you even need to spend like another 7 grand to even get some nice features. Smart move and the ford crowd falls for it every time...

It's not as cheap as it looks and the real performer is a track only car. Z28 had problems selling with a back seat and a radio...


All so apples to apples to an ss

Ford said the R is 130lbs lighter then a track pack GT350. My guess is the gt350 TP will come in at 3750lbs and the R will be about 3620lbs.

[ULTRAZLS1]

Originally Posted by chain777

It's amazing how different the reaction is here compared to anywhere else. So you think the numbers aren't impressive, the high revs are a joke, and the LT1SS is going to be all you need to match it. Remember how badly the Boss beat the SS in the quarter? That was with 82 less horsepower and 49 fewer torques. The weight will be within a hundred pounds or so and the R will probably be lighter than the Boss.

I think your under-estimating the benefits of high revs and a broad power-band in an engine designed for the track. It's not just the peak numbers that matter.

???

Even in a place where it can do no wrong I'm seeing plenty of negative/ concern.

We've seen exactly what higher revving can do. Now that the 5.0 is almost as heavy as a 5th gen... It is also up 10 hp on the ls3... They run close to equal ss ls3 vs 5.0 manual. Edge to 5.0 because of 10 more hp and slightly lighter. In the same exact car just switching motors it doesn't look like any benefit... At the drag strip at least. Maybe even worse.

Granted the gt 350 revs even higher... But tuned coyotes get up there too. Also the lt1 is better than the ls3 in every way as well...

Looks like a good battle between pushrod and ohc

Btw I wouldn't think an lt1 could match it. I think the point some are making is that a 6 speed manual is a lot harder for the average person. An lt1 a8 could be trouble for a bad driver in a 6 speed manual gt 350 at the dragstrip.
Just like any car with a bad driver in a manual.

Also inferring that a modified lt1 could compare. Which I don't think is out of the question either...

[ULTRAZLS1]

Originally Posted by 13vertss/r's

Ford said the R is 130lbs lighter then a track pack GT350. My guess is the gt350 TP will come in at 3750lbs and the R will be about 3620lbs.

Sounds possible...we shall see...

[NASTY99Z28]

Originally Posted by LesserO2Evils

Im trying to figure out where exactly the advantage is to all that high revving they have been bragging about. Peak HP@7500 isnt a significant jump from the Coyote. Esp when the TQ falls off before 5k.

Look again. It holds over 400ftlb's for a long time. Not to mention that once it's out of first its maybe gonna drop 1000-1500rpm between shifts and that is a sweet spot of that engine so don't sell it short just yet.

Originally Posted by chain777

It's amazing how different the reaction is here compared to anywhere else. So you think the numbers aren't impressive, the high revs are a joke, and the LT1SS is going to be all you need to match it. Remember how badly the Boss beat the SS in the quarter? That was with 82 less horsepower and 49 fewer torques. The weight will be within a hundred pounds or so and the R will probably be lighter than the Boss.

I think your under-estimating the benefits of high revs and a broad power-band in an engine designed for the track. It's not just the peak numbers that matter.

Exactly!!! Ford loves to over gear the mustang and I'm sure they will do the same to match the engine's power band. This car will walk away from a stock SS given both cars have good drivers. Personally I'd rather have a lt1 poweband but for a track car you can't deny the high revs. Just look at how fast some imports are with lower HP but super high revs compared to other cars.

[NASTY99Z28]

Originally Posted by ULTRAZLS1

???

Even in a place where it can do no wrong I'm seeing plenty of negative/ concern.

We've seen exactly what higher revving can do. Now that the 5.0 is almost as heavy as a 5th gen... It is also up 10 hp on the ls3... They run close to equal ss ls3 vs 5.0 manual. Edge to 5.0 because of 10 more hp and slightly lighter. In the same exact car just switching motors it doesn't look like any benefit... At the drag strip at least. Maybe even worse.

Granted the gt 350 revs even higher... But tuned coyotes get up there too. Also the lt1 is better than the ls3 in every way as well...

Looks like a good battle between pushrod and ohc

Btw I wouldn't think an lt1 could match it. I think the point some are making is that a 6 speed manual is a lot harder for the average person. An lt1 a8 could be trouble for a bad driver in a 6 speed manual gt 350 at the dragstrip.
Just like any car with a bad driver in a manual.

Also inferring that a modified lt1 could compare. Which I don't think is out of the question either...

Don't forget the aggressive gearing the stang has over the camaro. And I complety agree with the auto vs manual battle. Auto cars hurt a lot of feelings even with less power. We all know the coyote can turn 7500-8000rpm with a tune.now imagine what the voodoo will do once tuned. I'm thinking closer to 9k maybe more. One things for sure its gonna sound NASTY screaming by at WOT!!!

[ULTRAZLS1]

Originally Posted by NASTY99Z28

Don't forget the aggressive gearing the stang has over the camaro. And I complety agree with the auto vs manual battle. Auto cars hurt a lot of feelings even with less power. We all know the coyote can turn 7500-8000rpm with a tune.now imagine what the voodoo will do once tuned. I'm thinking closer to 9k maybe more. One things for sure its gonna sound NASTY screaming by at WOT!!!

It would be a blast at the track for sure! Winding it up banging gears... I get it.

Just thinking around town seat of the pants feel of lt1 auto might be a surprise. Having a ton of torque everywhere is fun also.

Once you cam an ls and assuming the new lt1... You get over 7k rpm depending on cam choice/ aggressiveness.
My rev limiter was set at 7200 rpm with my g6x3 cam ls3. Still made 464 rwtq. Best of both worlds once you cam them if you ask me

It does sound good for a factory car. It's really hard to beat a cammed lsx with proper exhaust. Many are saying the lt1 sounds even better. I still prefer the sound of the old pushrod...

[DrkPhx]

I honestly thought it would be closer to 550 hp, but still not bad numbers. You can help the low end with aggressive trans and rear end gears which I have to be are aggressive because the car has the gas guzzler tax. Also consider this thing is still well over 500 hp at the red line. That's pretty bad ass imo and I'm sure it revs super fast with great throttle response. That is a recipe for a great track motor. Let's see what it does on the track.

[ULTRAZLS1]

The gearing advantage is a necessity due to a relative lack of torque to hp. Building peak hp at a high rpm.
Car needs to be brought up to peak power quicker. Gearing and rpm vs torque.
The 5.0 is geared more aggressively as well. They use 4-5 gears getting down the 1320 we use 3-4.

Once again different approaches. Both get results.