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Old 04-22-2015, 09:46 AM   #1
MADNE55
 
Drives: 2011 Camaro 2SS
Join Date: Apr 2015
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Can I upgrade my SC?

Hello everyone...just want to say first that I have gotten alot of good information from this forum over the last year...thank you all for that!!!

My question is what is the most HP you guys have seen an aluminum LS3 block handle without distortion (or how long until distortion took place), or without the head gasket/block going out?

I have a 2011 Camaro 2ss with a Kenny Bell 2.8LC SC amongst alot of other upgrades. All the internals are upgraded and I believe forged as well. On a mustang dyno the car is making 753rwhp. I want to get it to 850-900 rwhp without having to change the block. So what I want to do is put on a 3.6LC or 4.7LC KB SC on it. My speed guy said he doesnt mind pushing the engine as long as I know the potential consequences that comes along with that. He also cant find any information on what that block can actually take. Ive seen a thread or two on here where 900 rwhp was mentioned being done on this block but there just isnt much out there.

Any suggestions guys? I have an addiction to speed so when he told me that he wouldnt go much higher I felt like I went straight into withdrawls haha

Thank you everyone and much respect!
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Old 04-22-2015, 11:02 AM   #2
Unreal


 
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1000-1100 isn't un common on forged ls3 blocks. Hardest thing is typically keeping the heads on it, but some good thick deck heads, good studs/gaskets seem to do the trick.
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Old 04-22-2015, 11:41 AM   #3
cc-rider

 
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Did you buy the car used and already built like that? Reading your posts, it seems so. You should get more details on exactly what you have already done to that engine. But the Kenne Bell manifold will accept the bigger KB superchargers for sure.
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Old 04-22-2015, 12:12 PM   #4
MADNE55
 
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I am just getting my feet wet in this HP world so please forgive me for being a newb...but I am having a blast learning as much as I can!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unreal View Post
1000-1100 isn't un common on forged ls3 blocks. Hardest thing is typically keeping the heads on it, but some good thick deck heads, good studs/gaskets seem to do the trick.
This is just a stock aluminum LS3 block with forged internals. The block itself isn't forged...are you saying on a "forged" block it would be safe?

We just put on a 255 LS3 head, took out the meth injection and converted it to flex fuel so I can run E85.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cc-rider View Post
Did you buy the car used and already built like that? Reading your posts, it seems so. You should get more details on exactly what you have already done to that engine. But the Kenne Bell manifold will accept the bigger KB superchargers for sure.
You are correct sir. I bought the car with almost all the upgrades on it already. I had no idea what I was getting into. We were actually out looking for an SUV for my girl and when we pulled up they had this Camaro sitting out with the hood up and all I could see was chrome muscle. I bought it on the spot and like a fool believed everything they told me about the car....its a good thing that they actually didn't lie to me this time I do have a list of all the upgrades to the car. As it sits right now I don't have to upgrade anything but maybe the tranny (already been upgraded twice) for it to be able to handle more HP.

It has a ford 9" rear end in it and all Hotchkiss suspension w/bracing. Upgraded fuel rails. Full kooks exhaust. The shop I have doing the work to it has done all the previous work to the car so that is how I know what all I have in the car. The block is in perfect condition as of right now.

To switch to the 3.6 or 4.7 KB I will have to put KBs bigger manifold on it. The manifold for the 2.9 is to small.

Am I right by being concerned about the block or does the manifold help with that? I was thinking that the block would be under the stress regardless of the manifold...and of course KB couldn't offer me any advice lol

Thanks for the replies guys
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Old 04-22-2015, 12:31 PM   #5
cc-rider

 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MADNE55 View Post
I am just getting my feet wet in this HP world so please forgive me for being a newb...but I am having a blast learning as much as I can!



This is just a stock aluminum LS3 block with forged internals. The block itself isn't forged...are you saying on a "forged" block it would be safe?

We just put on a 255 LS3 head, took out the meth injection and converted it to flex fuel so I can run E85.



You are correct sir. I bought the car with almost all the upgrades on it already. I had no idea what I was getting into. We were actually out looking for an SUV for my girl and when we pulled up they had this Camaro sitting out with the hood up and all I could see was chrome muscle. I bought it on the spot and like a fool believed everything they told me about the car....its a good thing that they actually didn't lie to me this time I do have a list of all the upgrades to the car. As it sits right now I don't have to upgrade anything but maybe the tranny (already been upgraded twice) for it to be able to handle more HP.

It has a ford 9" rear end in it and all Hotchkiss suspension w/bracing. Upgraded fuel rails. Full kooks exhaust. The shop I have doing the work to it has done all the previous work to the car so that is how I know what all I have in the car. The block is in perfect condition as of right now.

To switch to the 3.6 or 4.7 KB I will have to put KBs bigger manifold on it. The manifold for the 2.9 is to small.

Am I right by being concerned about the block or does the manifold help with that? I was thinking that the block would be under the stress regardless of the manifold...and of course KB couldn't offer me any advice lol

Thanks for the replies guys
There is no such thing as a forged block. Only the internals. You either have aluminum blocks....or iron blocks. The LS3/L99 engines have the aluminum block. The LSX block is the iron block and capable of huge power. But the aluminum LS blocks can take 1000 hp too as already stated. But you need to beef up everything else. Which you may already have. Get the details from your shop on the pistons and rods that are in there (compression ratio too). And if they did an upgraded crank too.
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Old 04-22-2015, 12:33 PM   #6
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And keep asking questions! That's what the forum is for. We all started somewhere...so the only dumb question is the one that is not asked!
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Old 04-22-2015, 12:38 PM   #7
MADNE55
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cc-rider View Post
There is no such thing as a forged block. Only the internals. You either have aluminum blocks....or iron blocks. The LS3/L99 engines have the aluminum block. The LSX block is the iron block and capable of huge power. But the aluminum LS blocks can take 1000 hp too as already stated. But you need to beef up everything else. Which you may already have. Get the details from your shop on the pistons and rods that are in there (compression ratio too). And if they did an upgraded crank too.
Thank you for the lesson! I will grab the list when I get home tonight and get the details. I believe all the internals have been upgraded. Crank/pistons/cam/pushrods.

Are we talking about 1000rwhp or flywheel hp?

What I would like to do is buy an iron block and build it myself but I just don't know enough about engines to be able to do that at the moment.
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Old 04-22-2015, 12:45 PM   #8
cc-rider

 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MADNE55 View Post
Thank you for the lesson! I will grab the list when I get home tonight and get the details. I believe all the internals have been upgraded. Crank/pistons/cam/pushrods.

Are we talking about 1000rwhp or flywheel hp?

What I would like to do is buy an iron block and build it myself but I just don't know enough about engines to be able to do that at the moment.
Make sure to ask if they put a stroker kit in it too (which would increase the displacement with a longer rod).

Talking wheel HP. Search here on the forum for a thread that contains a roll call of sorts for those who have hit 1000 rwhp. There is a pretty good list with the parts they used to get there.
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Old 04-22-2015, 12:46 PM   #9
cc-rider

 
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Found the thread for you. Take a read through this...

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showth...ight=1000+rwhp
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Old 04-22-2015, 12:55 PM   #10
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There is such a thing as a forged block, Dart makes a nice billet forged LS block but it is $25k for just the block.

Anyways, I was referring to forged as in the internals, with a stock ls3 block. Plenty have made 1000+ with good pistons/rods.
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Old 04-22-2015, 01:18 PM   #11
MADNE55
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cc-rider View Post
Found the thread for you. Take a read through this...

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showth...ight=1000+rwhp
I appreciate you finding that thread for me. I read up till page 2 but had to get some work done so I will read more tomorrow. Looks like there was one LS3 that was above 1000hp on that first page. This makes me very happy! Now Im wondering if it would be a better idea to just put a new block in with twin turbos or just upgrade the SC and be happy with 1000rwhp. Im the kind of guy that always wants more lol

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unreal View Post
There is such a thing as a forged block, Dart makes a nice billet forged LS block but it is $25k for just the block.

Anyways, I was referring to forged as in the internals, with a stock ls3 block. Plenty have made 1000+ with good pistons/rods.
Thank you for the reply man...makes me wonder how long the LS3 could withstand that sort of power before distortion occurs. I havnt got into racing yet...as for now I just love going fast and scaring the shit out of my girl

Everyone runs with a certain group of friends and as of right now Im the only one out of any of my friends that have something like this which makes it harder to meet guys who love this sort of thing and can help me learn it...hence why I am here.
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Old 04-22-2015, 01:39 PM   #12
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Friend here made 1090rwhp on a Ysi combo, stock cube ls3 block with good pistons and rods. Beat the hell out of it, raced everything, 20k+ miles. Finally had a cam fail which took the cam bearings out so he is swapping blocks but nothing wrong with the block at that point.
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Old 04-22-2015, 02:10 PM   #13
MADNE55
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Unreal View Post
Friend here made 1090rwhp on a Ysi combo, stock cube ls3 block with good pistons and rods. Beat the hell out of it, raced everything, 20k+ miles. Finally had a cam fail which took the cam bearings out so he is swapping blocks but nothing wrong with the block at that point.
Thats a hell of alot more driving than I do and alot harder. Thank you very much for the info!!

Since the car is already at 750rwhp would you suggest upgrading the SC or switching to twin turbos? Im not sure if you can control boost on a SC. I think the 4.7KB would push it past 1000rwhp based on their claims of throwing it on a stock motor and it making 1000hp
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Old 04-22-2015, 02:26 PM   #14
cc-rider

 
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C'mon Unreal....let's hear you recommend a SC upgrade instead of turbos. Shock the world!!!! (Just messing with you)

To the OP:
Unreal is a huge turbo guy and promotes turbo's big time on this website. He used to work for AGP and maybe still does. So I'm just messing with him because we all already know his answer. And he's justified in promoting turbo's. They make huge power and probably the only way to go if you want 1000 HP. Most of the people making that power are doing so with turbo's. The superchargers start to become touchy and needy at those levels. Belts slipping. Huge investments to keep intake temps down. The 1000hp mark is no joke. You should really understand what you are getting into by wanting that. Better have some race gas available to you...

PD superchargers are great for street banging. Their advantage is huge power and torque almost off idle. But for achieving a HP mark, turbos will always win. But you will have lag compared to a PD blower. So you need to really decide what you REALLY want here.
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