why do people say the 5th won't be worth much?

[gajagfan]

Our '69 sold for about $3K when bought new. We bought it in 1985 for about $3K. It has had a bunch of love and $$$$ poured into it and it is worth somewhere in the upper $20K range right now (conservatively). It has not been a money making venture, as there were years that up to $10K was spent on it during heavier race years. As has been mentioned, cars are not a good investment, and the more unique the better the value will be held. As far as gen 5's, in 30 years or so Z/28's > ZL1 > 1LE > SS > V6, but very likely not worth what was paid new for it.
It should also be noted that there was a huge kick in 60's car values as the baby boomers got to the age they could afford the cars they had always wanted as young people. That matched with the fact that what Detroit was making at the time was junk. Those days are behind us I believe as cars seem to be on the upswing (getting better each year). Now a change in government regulations (like what hit Detroit in the early-mid 70's) could change that story a good bit.
The lesson, drive the damn cars and enjoy them. If you want to keep it because you enjoy it, do so. If you want to trade it in because the new version is better, do so. Just don't bank your financial future on a GEN 5 being of some great value, because it will most likely be a huge disappointment for you.

[CamaroCracka]

I assure you it does not take three days to change an oil pan gasket on these cars. I find them easier to work on in a lot of ways. When I bought my truck in 02 I thought I would not be able to modify. Now my wife wishes I was not able to modify it.

As for how many will be around in 46 years, I can tell you mine probably won't be because the odds of it surviving my old age are slim.

Originally Posted by elektrik

And the numbers posted above, 700,000 1st gen yenkos or grand national Camaros were produced, right? The 'run-of-the-mill' Camaros produced that are still around command a fairly decent price if they were maintained/restored correctly.

Oh, and P.S. Yenkos *were* mass produced (SS models)-how else do you think they became Yenkos???

POS Gen 1s that can only be used for parts cars sell for about the same as the cars sold for new.

[ChocoTaco369]

Originally Posted by myold88

ChocoTaco369-
your so right. Drive and enjoy.
I recently saw a red 2002 Camaro 35th edition conv sell
at the Mecum auction for $20,000. And thats near new condition with low mileage.
NADA retail now $20,400. New the car's MSRP was $35,000+

This is how it goes:

http://www.joshuakennon.com/the-impo...ilding-wealth/

I bought my SS when I was 27. I took out a loan because the interest rates were so stupid low thanks to the irresponsible Fed it was free money and I'd get a better return investing my capital - but I could've bought the entire car cash if I WANTED to. IMO, if you can't afford to buy the car for straight cash - at least 75% down - you can't afford the car. These guys financing 90+% of their cars, it blows my mind. How will you afford a mortgage if you can barely afford the car? IMO your vehicle's depreciation rate shouldn't matter to you. If it does, you can't afford the car. There is no shame buying a used Ford Escort and driving it into the ground. Cars are huge losers financially. To this day I wonder if I should've bought a POS and sunk the extra $25K into a house or a rental property

[ChocoTaco369]

Originally Posted by elektrik

I'm going to go out on (not much of) a limb and assume the Op wasn't referring to trade-in value, rather the value in 40 some-odd years when it will be considered a 'classic'.

If you have a Copo, it may be a classic one day. Anything else will just take up space.

Even if it did somehow appreciate in value, your returns will blow. The average stock market return, worst-case scenario, historically, in a 30-year window is 8%. Take your $40,000 and stick it in a basic S&P 500 mirroring index fund at 8% for 40 years, which takes nearly zero effort and a few mouse clicks. It takes no research, no financial advisor and fees are about 0.1% in a simple ETF ticker like 'SPY'. What do you get?

$868,980.86

And that's worst-case scenario based on historicals. Unless you buy the original Batmobile, no car on Earth will appreciate that quickly. And you did it all while taking away zero garage space. Seriously, cars are universally a horrific investment. I drive my car because the financial losses are less than the joy I get out of it, and I'm still able to invest 20-30% of my salary.

[gajagfan]

Originally Posted by ChocoTaco369

This is how it goes:

http://www.joshuakennon.com/the-impo...ilding-wealth/

I bought my SS when I was 27. I took out a loan because the interest rates were so stupid low thanks to the irresponsible Fed it was free money and I'd get a better return investing my capital - but I could've bought the entire car cash if I WANTED to. IMO, if you can't afford to buy the car for straight cash - at least 75% down - you can't afford the car. These guys financing 90+% of their cars, it blows my mind. How will you afford a mortgage if you can barely afford the car? IMO your vehicle's depreciation rate shouldn't matter to you. If it does, you can't afford the car. There is no shame buying a used Ford Escort and driving it into the ground. Cars are huge losers financially. To this day I wonder if I should've bought a POS and sunk the extra $25K into a house or a rental property

We own three homes, all with good amounts of positive equity, and I finance eveyr car I have ever bought (less trade if that was involved) 100%. As you said in most cases, especially as of late, loaned money has been cheep. Why tie up capital that can be used in other ways to make money in a car that is depreciating like a rock dropped into the ocean? We can afford what we drive and the three homes, so I am not sure I agree with your theory.

[ChocoTaco369]

Originally Posted by gajagfan

We own three homes, all with good amounts of positive equity, and I finance eveyr car I have ever bought (less trade if that was involved) 100%. As you said in most cases, especially as of late, loaned money has been cheep. Why tie up capital that can be used in other ways to make money in a car that is depreciating like a rock dropped into the ocean? We can afford what we drive and the three homes, so I am not sure I agree with your theory.

I think you misread my quote.

I said you should be able to afford at least a 75% cash down payment on your car.

With today's overly (irresponsibly) cheap, excessive liquidity of leveraged capital, it makes way more sense to finance at <3% interest (inflation or less) and invest your current capital in appreciating investments. To buy a $40,000 car, you should have $30,000 in cash just lying around. I didn't say you have to use it!

I take a similar approach to college debt. Your total debt shouldn't exceed your first year's working salary. If you are projected to make $60,000/year and you owe $100,000 in loans, it's gonna be a rocky road.

[Red2014SS]

Originally Posted by SuperSport2011

Why do people say the 5th gen camaro won't be worth much in a few decades due to too many being made. Out of all 5 gens the 5th is the least produced, beats gen 1 by near 200,000 makes and they sell pretty well.

I don't know why people say that these cars will not become collectible. No one knows what will happen and anything said is just a wild guess. There are a bunch of factors that will come into play.

I do know one thing.. I have been around since the early 1960's. I have never seen a more complimented car than the 5th gen Camaro. It seems like everyone who looks at these cars gets a big smile on their face and gives the owner a thumbs up. GM knocked it out of the park with these cars. That alone, will most surely affect future values.

As was said, many are being wrecked and lots are being heavily modded. Expect more of this as the price of used ones drops to a level where young people can afford them. Nice ones will become rare a lot quicker than most people imagine.

I believe prices will steadily drop for 5-10 years, then you'll see a slow, steady climb. No car is a good investment, but if I had to bet on a current model quickly bouncing back from bottom price level, it would be the 5th Gen Camaro. The public loves these cars. They've already won back-to-back awards from KBB for best resale value... and they're still making them. Wait until the only ones for sale are used...

But that's just a wild guess. No different than any other opinion on this thread.

[JLSuperfly]

Originally Posted by ChocoTaco369

I take a similar approach to college debt. Your total debt shouldn't exceed your first year's working salary. If you are projected to make $60,000/year and you owe $100,000 in loans, it's gonna be a rocky road.

Good thing when I graduated chemical engineering in 1997, the company that hired me which I still work for today paid my student loan. If not, it would have been a hard start in life.

[joeybsyc]

The difference is, in 69 people didn't sit around and debate on how valuable their cars would be if they quit driving them and "saved" them for 20 years. If they did, those cars wouldn't be worth as much today. There are so many people with 5th gens who think they're going to be worth lots of money in the future (and therefore aren't driving them and are "saving' them) that there will ALWAYS be more 5th gens out there are "collectors" of such cars. No one bought a Yenko or a ZL1 in 69 and stashed it away as an investment... today, thousands of people do just that...I bet there will still be TONS of 2014/15 Z28's, ZL1's, COPOs, "Special Editions", etc. sitting virtually untouched with a few hundred miles on them (or less) in 20 years.

[ChocoTaco369]

Originally Posted by JLSuperfly

Good thing when I graduated chemical engineering in 1997, the company that hired me which I still work for today paid my student loan. If not, it would have been a hard start in life.

WOW. That is AWESOME dude

[Drumminxx]

Originally Posted by Red2014SS

I don't know why people say that these cars will not become collectible. No one knows what will happen and anything said is just a wild guess. There are a bunch of factors that will come into play.

I do know one thing.. I have been around since the early 1960's. I have never seen a more complimented car than the 5th gen Camaro. It seems like everyone who looks at these cars gets a big smile on their face and gives the owner a thumbs up. GM knocked it out of the park with these cars. That alone, will most surely affect future values.

As was said, many are being wrecked and lots are being heavily modded. Expect more of this as the price of used ones drops to a level where young people can afford them. Nice ones will become rare a lot quicker than most people imagine.

I believe prices will steadily drop for 5-10 years, then you'll see a slow, steady climb. No car is a good investment, but if I had to bet on a current model quickly bouncing back from bottom price level, it would be the 5th Gen Camaro. The public loves these cars. They've already won back-to-back awards from KBB for best resale value... and they're still making them. Wait until the only ones for sale are used...

But that's just a wild guess. No different than any other opinion on this thread.

Well said

I had a 1985 Z28 that I paid around $14k for brand new. I looked at some for sale today that apparently have been garage queens all these years with low miles going for over $20 so I agree they will depreciate over the next 10 years and then who knows. but the 5th gen is much nicer and faster than the 3rd Gen and they went up in value. Condition will be a big factor.

[joeybsyc]

Originally Posted by Drumminxx

Well said

I had a 1985 Z28 that I paid around $14k for brand new. I looked at some for sale today that apparently have been garage queens all these years with low miles going for over $20 so I agree they will depreciate over the next 10 years and then who knows. but the 5th gen is much nicer and faster than the 3rd Gen and they went up in value. Condition will be a big factor.

You do realize that a $14,000 car from 1985 that's worth $20,000 in 2015 did not appreciate...not by a long shot when you factor in inflation and the cost to own, store, and just maintain a car for 30 years...and to be honest, while some may be "asking" 20 grand, I don't think too many 1985 Z28s are changing hands for that kind of coin...even low mileage garage queens.

[Tpimike]

Pretty sure our cars will be collectable at some point. But at that point most on this site right now will be dead and gone. Drive it!

[Wizard1183]

I think they'll be worth something. Probably around $100k in about 50-60 yrs since all you'll be driving then are shoeboxes. But as stated most of us will be dead lol. So I guess our kids can reap the rewards. I don't care much. I keep mine as clean asi can for it to last. It doesn't have too much crap that I can't fix myself. Though anything HVAC related I won't touch. Everything else I can probably handle using my service manuals