Troubleshooting help........ possible car problem....... vibration.......

[PQ]

Originally Posted by JusticePete

The wheel in the video didn't look good. It wasn't terrible, but it didn't look good. In spec can cover a lot of ground. Coils suspension springs are considered to be in spec with a tolerance of +/- 15mm or 5/8s of an inch. Pedders spec is +/- 1mm. Everything is relative.

Are all four of your wheels like the one in the video?

3 of the 4 are.

[Doc]

Originally Posted by PQ

You talking about these. Here are all 4 tires. You sure this isn't an expiration date. The rear tires were put on my car in April. lol

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Ok those tires are BRAND NEW lol. After looking at that video I'd say it's the rims. That much movement (especially the farther away from the center you get like on a 22) has to be the problem. Speed would only make it worse which fits what you describe is the symptom.

I'm not familiar with those rims, are they forged? On mine (Nutek) they spun them on a measuring device and they were dead smooth with no wobble or variance. If those are 2 or 3 piece forged they shouldn't be wobbling like that at all.

[PQ]

Originally Posted by Doc

Ok those tires are BRAND NEW lol. After looking at that video I'd say it's the rims. That much movement (especially the farther away from the center you get like on a 22) has to be the problem. Speed would only make it worse which fits what you describe is the symptom.

I'm not familiar with those rims, are they forged? On mine (Nutek) they spun them on a measuring device and they were dead smooth with no wobble or variance. If those are 2 or 3 piece forged they shouldn't be wobbling like that at all.

lol. Not sure why it says my rear tires were made this month when they've been on my car for almost 4 months. haha

But, my wheels are 3 piece aluminum wheels. Savini.

I know it's a wobble that is noticeable but Savini says it's not the problem. Apperently anyway. Like you guys, I believe it's the wheels, but if the machine says they are good, how can it be the wheels?

[JusticePete]

Originally Posted by PQ

lol. Not sure why it says my rear tires were made this month when they've been on my car for almost 4 months. haha

But, my wheels are 3 piece aluminum wheels. Savini.

I know it's a wobble that is noticeable but Savini says it's not the problem. Apparently anyway. Like you guys, I believe it's the wheels, but if the machine says they are good, how can it be the wheels?

Good within what tolerance??? Good is relative. The run-out appers to be significant, but the road force will show just how much. You could use a run-out gauge and measure that way as well. Get your own documentation or just send the wheels back for new ones. I would prefer to have my own documentation and when I spoke with the people at Savini would tell them the run-out must be less than X or they will vibrate on my car. My guess is that the wheels are on the outer range of being just within the specification but so what? You are vibrating and you shouldn't be so get your own documentation and ask them if they can meet your requirements. They may say no problem or they may say we can't do any better. Either way, your problem should be solved.

[Doc]

Originally Posted by PQ

lol. Not sure why it says my rear tires were made this month when they've been on my car for almost 4 months. haha

But, my wheels are 3 piece aluminum wheels. Savini.

I know it's a wobble that is noticeable but Savini says it's not the problem. Apperently anyway. Like you guys, I believe it's the wheels, but if the machine says they are good, how can it be the wheels?

The tires marked July 2010 (0710) have been on your car since March?? Are you sure the tires aren't switched? Because 2 of them show a manufacture date of March 2010. Those dates are required by law by the Department Of Transportation (DOT).

If those are 3 piece forged aluminum then there shouldn't be any wobble like that. When Jim at Nutek spun mine they were dead true; they were perfectly round within 1000th of an inch. Either the centers are out of round, or the outer and/or inner rims are. The whole point of spending the money for a 3-piece forged rim is to get the very best fit, finish and quality. That video looks like a cast rim to be honest. 3-piece are assembled by hand specifically to NOT have variances like that.

Those aren't cheap, $150 off-the-shelf cast rims. For what you've probably paid for those, tell them you want new ones that spin true.

[PQ]

Originally Posted by JusticePete

Good within what tolerance??? Good is relative. The run-out appers to be significant, but the road force will show just how much. You could use a run-out gauge and measure that way as well. Get your own documentation or just send the wheels back for new ones. I would prefer to have my own documentation and when I spoke with the people at Savini would tell them the run-out must be less than X or they will vibrate on my car. My guess is that the wheels are on the outer range of being just within the specification but so what? You are vibrating and you shouldn't be so get your own documentation and ask them if they can meet your requirements. They may say no problem or they may say we can't do any better. Either way, your problem should be solved.

Will do. Thank you for all your help thus far. Tomorrow I will be busy. lol

Originally Posted by Doc

The tires marked July 2010 (0710) have been on your car since March?? Are you sure the tires aren't switched? Because 2 of them show a manufacture date of March 2010. Those dates are required by law by the Department Of Transportation (DOT).

If those are 3 piece forged aluminum then there shouldn't be any wobble like that. When Jim at Nutek spun mine they were dead true; they were perfectly round within 1000th of an inch. Either the centers are out of round, or the outer and/or inner rims are. The whole point of spending the money for a 3-piece forged rim is to get the very best fit, finish and quality. That video looks like a cast rim to be honest. 3-piece are assembled by hand specifically to NOT have variances like that.

Those aren't cheap, $150 off-the-shelf cast rims. For what you've probably paid for those, tell them you want new ones that spin true.

I don't see a reason for them to switch them. But yes. These have ALL been on my car since March. I took these to Camaro5 Fest. So either they have been switched, or they had the wrong dates stamped on them. My TPMS sensors have been switched. I can't get my refund until I get the original ones I was sold. And what I sent back to Nine Ball were NOT the original ones.

And they aren't gonna and weren't EVER gonna make new ones. They say these are the best they can do. So I guess I know what I gotta do. AFTER I do all of my tests. ON MY DIME.

[Doc]

Originally Posted by PQ

Will do. Thank you for all your help thus far. Tomorrow I will be busy. lol

I don't see a reason for them to switch them. But yes. These have ALL been on my car since March. I took these to Camaro5 Fest. So either they have been switched, or they had the wrong dates stamped on them. My TPMS sensors have been switched. I can't get my refund until I get the original ones I was sold. And what I sent back to Nine Ball were NOT the original ones.

And they aren't gonna and weren't EVER gonna make new ones. They say these are the best they can do. So I guess I know what I gotta do. AFTER I do all of my tests. ON MY DIME.

They may have remounted the tires thinking it was a tire/wheel combo causing the problem. Bummer about all these "issues" including TPMS. If you are able to get your money back take a look at the styles Nutek has to offer; they have a pretty good selection now and I know for a fact that Jim will make your wheels right. Nine Ball is a dealer for them too. Nutekwheels.com.

I know these kinds of things aren't unusual when modding but it sure sucks the enjoyment out of it especially when you have a lot of money riding on the mod.

Good luck!

Oh I just thought of something. I know this may sound dumb but sometimes the obvious can get overlooked. Are the tires mounted to roll in the right direction? The arrows on the side point towards the front of the car? Just a thought; trying to think of anything that might help.

[PQ]

Originally Posted by Doc

They may have remounted the tires thinking it was a tire/wheel combo causing the problem. Bummer about all these "issues" including TPMS. If you are able to get your money back take a look at the styles Nutek has to offer; they have a pretty good selection now and I know for a fact that Jim will make your wheels right. Nine Ball is a dealer for them too. Nutekwheels.com.

I know these kinds of things aren't unusual when modding but it sure sucks the enjoyment out of it especially when you have a lot of money riding on the mod.

Good luck!

Oh I just thought of something. I know this may sound dumb but sometimes the obvious can get overlooked. Are the tires mounted to roll in the right direction? The arrows on the side point towards the front of the car? Just a thought; trying to think of anything that might help.

lol, yup. Mounted correctly. Thanks. I'll keep everyone updated in what I find.

[revron]

Could you try switching out just the front pair with the old tires and wheels that are ok, and see if it still vibrates and then switch the back pair and maybe you could narrow it down to the front or rear, tire/wheel.
Tire pressures ok??
Luggnuts all torq the same and correctley??
Sorry I'm just trying to come up with some ideas.

[PQ]

Originally Posted by revron

Could you try switching out just the front pair with the old tires and wheels that are ok, and see if it still vibrates and then switch the back pair and maybe you could narrow it down to the front or rear, tire/wheel.
Tire pressures ok??
Luggnuts all torq the same and correctley??
Sorry I'm just trying to come up with some ideas.

Don't be sorry. I appreciate any ideas no matter how obvious they may seem.

Ya, lugs all torqued the same and to the right tightness.

Tire pressures are good.

Yes, I have done stock wheels on front and these on back, and it vibrated. I have done stocks on back and these on front and it vibrated. I've done all stocks and no vibration.

[Info@PeddersUSA.com]

Trying to watch the tire video crashes my computer. Not sure why. So I cannot look at it. Seeing the ages as being different, does not bother me. They were, however, made at different plants, which is pretty common. The tire age issue is finally becoming a hot topic as it should be. I think there are some government actions coming down on this topic. I have seen 6 and 7 year old brand new tires being sold at some smaller discount tire stores, and you should stay away from these tires as if they had the plague!!

For a reference, the Tire Rack has done a great job in making a post for all to be able to figure out the age of your tires. Here is the link

Tire Rack Tire Age Link

It is possible there are differences in the tires from one plant to another. GM does have a spec to measure and compare tire diameters. Take a car or truck. mark the all the tires at 6 oclcock, then drive PEREFECTLY straight for 10 tire revolutions. The tires must be within 1/2 around inches of each other. for a passenger car. I had a AWD Denali that was taking out front differentials, 3 of them in 12,000 miles, that had 2 different build dates and plants. turns out there was nearly 2 inches difference in diameter doing this test. The tire manufacturer stepped up and got him a matched set, and his differential damage was taken care of. This is not something you see much and in fact would really have little affect on a Camaro, but can show you that tires can be different from one plant to another

Pete has appropriately asked and suggested going back to the "lo hanging fruit. If someone says it is in specs, be it GM or a tire or wheel manufacturer, to be really honest, I do not ever accept that. Selling 30 to 50 sets of custom wheels and tires a month, with literally the best and most accurate machiens and equipment in the world to do it, it all does not mean anything if stuff is being checked to a tolerance level that is not good enough. My required spec for passernger car stuff was 15lbs or less for road force. GM is a little higher. But I chose 15lbs because that is what Porsche uses. But know one really knows what the specs are, other than you have been told the are "within specs" I bet I have helped 500 car enthusiasts this year alone on alignment and tire wear concerns on a variety of platforms. And in all cases where there was a problem and the alignment was in spec, they were not correct for the customer's driving habits and conditions. I am going on and on about this, but is it important to follow the outstanding guidelines GM made for road force checking. I was selling $250,000 a year in 305/40R22 tires. At one point, they were all Pirellis. But I continued to have problems with vibrations. Pirelli sent an engineer to my place. I had the engineer fromn Hunter there at the same time. There are a lot of different versions of the 9700. I had the absolute highest state of the art unit that they made. It would even pick up the tire and wheel so the tech did not have to do it. The bottom line was in order to get an accurate balance to my specs that assured that I would not have a comeback, the tire did have to make at 15 more freeway run. That was too costly for me to do. So I dropped them and went to other Toyo, and Falcon, which I had much better results.

So if you want to eliminate with 100% accuracy, all technical possibiliites with your tires, you truly need to follow the GM bulletin I posted you to the tee, and get documentation of the actual road force number. The tires and wheels must be indicated off the lug nuts on the machine as well.


Hope this helps

mike

[JProberts]

Yeah man I feel your pain but it sounds like you may have the answer already. And although those wheels look great and I remember all the stuff you went through, can't forget that finger snappin' video, it's time to try to get Savani to "make it right by you". Whatever that may be for you.

It doesn't seem like others who have those same model Savani's are having the same problem so it must be an anomily? But it is what it is.

Anyway think of all those other wheels that you saw after you put on your Savani's that made you think.....man those wheels would look even better than the ones I have right now......and get something even better than the wheels you have now. It's the D2forged wheels for me.....

Good Luck Bro!

[PQ]

Originally Posted by Mike.White@PeddersUSA.com

Trying to watch the tire video crashes my computer. Not sure why. So I cannot look at it. Seeing the ages as being different, does not bother me. They were, however, made at different plants, which is pretty common. The tire age issue is finally becoming a hot topic as it should be. I think there are some government actions coming down on this topic. I have seen 6 and 7 year old brand new tires being sold at some smaller discount tire stores, and you should stay away from these tires as if they had the plague!!

For a reference, the Tire Rack has done a great job in making a post for all to be able to figure out the age of your tires. Here is the link

Tire Rack Tire Age Link

It is possible there are differences in the tires from one plant to another. GM does have a spec to measure and compare tire diameters. Take a car or truck. mark the all the tires at 6 oclcock, then drive PEREFECTLY straight for 10 tire revolutions. The tires must be within 1/2 around inches of each other. for a passenger car. I had a AWD Denali that was taking out front differentials, 3 of them in 12,000 miles, that had 2 different build dates and plants. turns out there was nearly 2 inches difference in diameter doing this test. The tire manufacturer stepped up and got him a matched set, and his differential damage was taken care of. This is not something you see much and in fact would really have little affect on a Camaro, but can show you that tires can be different from one plant to another

Pete has appropriately asked and suggested going back to the "lo hanging fruit. If someone says it is in specs, be it GM or a tire or wheel manufacturer, to be really honest, I do not ever accept that. Selling 30 to 50 sets of custom wheels and tires a month, with literally the best and most accurate machiens and equipment in the world to do it, it all does not mean anything if stuff is being checked to a tolerance level that is not good enough. My required spec for passernger car stuff was 15lbs or less for road force. GM is a little higher. But I chose 15lbs because that is what Porsche uses. But know one really knows what the specs are, other than you have been told the are "within specs" I bet I have helped 500 car enthusiasts this year alone on alignment and tire wear concerns on a variety of platforms. And in all cases where there was a problem and the alignment was in spec, they were not correct for the customer's driving habits and conditions. I am going on and on about this, but is it important to follow the outstanding guidelines GM made for road force checking. I was selling $250,000 a year in 305/40R22 tires. At one point, they were all Pirellis. But I continued to have problems with vibrations. Pirelli sent an engineer to my place. I had the engineer fromn Hunter there at the same time. There are a lot of different versions of the 9700. I had the absolute highest state of the art unit that they made. It would even pick up the tire and wheel so the tech did not have to do it. The bottom line was in order to get an accurate balance to my specs that assured that I would not have a comeback, the tire did have to make at 15 more freeway run. That was too costly for me to do. So I dropped them and went to other Toyo, and Falcon, which I had much better results.

So if you want to eliminate with 100% accuracy, all technical possibiliites with your tires, you truly need to follow the GM bulletin I posted you to the tee, and get documentation of the actual road force number. The tires and wheels must be indicated off the lug nuts on the machine as well.


Hope this helps

mike

I will follow it as you prescribe. I'm still a little confuse with it, but I'll figure it out. I may even just go to my dealer.

Originally Posted by JProberts

Yeah man I feel your pain but it sounds like you may have the answer already. And although those wheels look great and I remember all the stuff you went through, can't forget that finger snappin' video, it's time to try to get Savani to "make it right by you". Whatever that may be for you.

It doesn't seem like others who have those same model Savani's are having the same problem so it must be an anomily? But it is what it is.

Anyway think of all those other wheels that you saw after you put on your Savani's that made you think.....man those wheels would look even better than the ones I have right now......and get something even better than the wheels you have now. It's the D2forged wheels for me.....

Good Luck Bro!

I know there's no way I could like another wheels that I like as much as these. And it really sucks. I could eat crow and have Iconz clone me some.

But I can't. I'll have Tony take care of me.

[SSmoothie]

Originally Posted by PQ

I know there's no way I could like another wheels that I like as much as these. And it really sucks. I could eat crow and have Iconz clone me some.

My Pictures again.