ZL1 vs '13 GT500 Solution for GM

[Black GT]

Originally Posted by SixGracing

No it won't be looked at as a "flagship" car. It will be looked at as a car not to F**K with on the street. I'm not into to titles, just making the competition look stupid.

You can't put a saddle on a camaro, but you can certainly put one on a Mustang... Just sayin.

Well there's already hundreds of 600+ hp GT500's on the street, and I'm sure after the first year there out, there will be plenty 600+ hp ZL1's out there also.

[SixGracing]

Originally Posted by Black GT

Well there's already hundreds of 600+ hp GT500's on the street, and I'm sure after the first year there out, there will be plenty 600+ hp ZL1's out there also.

That's fine, but they will be few and far between. But, in all reality, the HP is just something the wife and I enjoy as an adrenaline rush. We plan on making the car a family project with racing at the local strip.

I'm only being a smart ass and have actually owned 2 mustangs. I love all American muscle cars and love the rivalry's that are created because of it. Besides, it forces Chevy, Ford and Dodge to continually improve products for competition. In the end, us guys, the consumers, are the benefactors.

[f ê r]

Originally Posted by SixGracing

Here's an idea, one that I'm in process of completing, drop $10-13K in a Gen 5 V8 and expect over 600RWHP. Still costs less than a ZL-1 or anything Ford has to offer and have no issues with them seeing anything but your tail lights. Plus, you will have spent less overall then it would have cost to buy a ZL-1 or a GT500. I will have about $53K into my car by March and there won't be any production Ford or Chevy other than a ZR-1 that will have a chance...

Bench racing FTW!!

[SixGracing]

Originally Posted by f ê r

Bench racing FTW!!

Won't be bench racing for long. Vidoes and pics to follow soon..

[7CAMARO7]

Originally Posted by hightower

None of this would ever happen.



I'm in agreement that the Z28 should have come before the ZL1, but that doesn't change anything. Chevy will not change the name of their car just because it seems right.

I guess the SS & Z28 never swapped roles in the past. I guess the Z28 did not come out as the handler before("hugger") and the SS was the drag strip car. I guess that for the 4th gens they didn't just completely reverse all that. My bad.

I guess the Impala muscle car from way back is still a rwd muscle badass today huh?

I will leave it at that.

_____________________________

Also everybody I am not a strictly Chevy guy any more. I am still at heart, but I like whatever is badass. I'd own most Camaros, but a few mustangs. Mustangs like the 70s fastbacks, 03-04 Terminators, & that's about it. I also love the ford gt. I love almost anything rwd chevy & fast.

I must admit... That '13 gt500 has my attention. Takes a lot for me to say that after seeing one of those '06-'08 gt500s at the strip running slower than my bolton ls1 SS. This one is running with the big boys.

They say a similar 0-150 compared to the GT. That to me says they're putting the power down just fine. It just does not feel right that this car will possibly out perform our top muscle car. I know we have the ZR1, but I want the Camaro to get the job done.

Something still says the ZL1 will be the better road race car as far as confidence, and the '13 GT500 will probably have that viper feel(raw, real man's car feel)/(1 mistake & you die) lol

[2012ZL1]

Originally Posted by tooslow

I expect the 2013 with both the PP and TP, to end up under $60K. Base will likely be in the low $50's. You're dreamingif you think it will eclipse $60K base.

haha...WRONG again...60 plus EASY. Ford has only stated it will keep it under 100....

[f ê r]

Originally Posted by SixGracing

Won't be bench racing for long. Vidoes and pics to follow soon..

Nah dude, I believe you will mount a beast of a car. I dont have a doubt about that.

Sorry, I'll explain myself better in case some of you guys missed the point. What I was trying to say is that I can put $20,000 on a EVO IX, still be under $50,000 and would be hella faster than your $53,000 Gen 5 V8, the ZL-1 and maybe the GT500. That last dude is harder to beat if the words of SVT Chief engineering are true ('13 GT500 faster that a FGT on a road curse).

Anyways, we're comparing factory cars vs factory cars, not what you can do with less money on a car while producing better performance out of it.

[2012ZL1]

Originally Posted by SixGracing

Here's an idea, one that I'm in process of completing, drop $10-13K in a Gen 5 V8 and expect over 600RWHP. Still costs less than a ZL-1 or anything Ford has to offer and have no issues with them seeing anything but your tail lights. Plus, you will have spent less overall then it would have cost to buy a ZL-1 or a GT500. I will have about $53K into my car by March and there won't be any production Ford or Chevy other than a ZR-1 that will have a chance...

not as good as a ZL1 though...

[7CAMARO7]

Also, yea the ZL1 has more technology than the '13 GT500, but so does a prius. lol Technology only improves performance, sometimes.

[GM4lyfe]

For all we know GM thought it was best to design the ZL1 with 580hp. They could have simulated the ZL1 with more power and thought it was not useable. More power isn't everything.

[tooslow]

Originally Posted by 2012ZL1

haha...WRONG again...60 plus EASY. Ford has only stated it will keep it under 100....

Quoted for future reference. And I will come back and make sure to point out how wrong you are. On the other hand, I will also be willing to admit it if it turns out I am wrong. Will you do the same?

I get the feeling that some people want it to MSRP in the $60's so, if it is the case that the 2013 GT500 outperforms the ZL1, they can always point out that it should because it costs X dollars more than the Z. If that's the case, that's pretty pitiful.

So, can you point to the video/article that quotes anyone at Ford stating anything like what you quoted? Nah, didn't think so.

[2012ZL1]

Originally Posted by 72MachOne99GT

Here's the thing... You don't know that, I can't deny it.

There's just so much garbage spewed out as fact. I'm in no way suggesting a little heated debate isn't good for the mind (and adrenaline), but there are obvious faults in blindly spouting off.

For instance, some dude who claims to have a tire connection doesn't know times, a Ford dealer knows nothing about msrp, and a guy who has a ZL1 on order can't predict what a car that isn't even announced yet will do on the track compared to a car that's not released.

Ford knows where the ZL1 is, what it costs, and how it performs. They aren't going to BASE their GT500 anywhere near 60,000 if they want to pretend to be competitive. (delete my account if I'm wrong as I won't order a '13 if it's over 53,000... Financially that's my max.)

I don't follow where The Shelby has to be competitive with the ZL1 price. Its Shelby's market that ZL1 was aiming at. Not vice -versa.

Shelby is not going to draw away any ZL1 guys simply by adding a little more power.

Also, there is a lot to add to a current Shelby to gain competitive status with the ZL1.
If the current Shelby is 48k, the bigger engine and blower gotta cost at least 7k, the needed suspention tweaks and mods another 3 k, then you have to pay for all the diff cooling etc etc that doesn't come standard on the Shelby, theres another 2k or so?..so now I'm up to 60, which is the minimum in my honest opinion that Ford can offer the 2013 500 for, and that is probably minimum profit as well.

[GM4lyfe]

Originally Posted by 7CAMARO7

Technology only improves performance, sometimes.

Prime example ZL1 to the CTS-V. Simular weight and power. But the ZL1 dominated the CTS-V by a long shot.

[2012ZL1]

Originally Posted by tooslow

Quoted for future reference. And I will come back and make sure to point out how wrong you are. On the other hand, I will also be willing to admit it if it turns out I am wrong. Will you do the same?

I get the feeling that some people want it to MSRP in the $60's so, if it is the case that the 2013 GT500 outperforms the ZL1, they can always point out that it should because it costs X dollars more than the Z. If that's the case, that's pretty pitiful.

Yeah I'll be fine with being wrong, why not? its only a lot of spirited guessing anyway.... and like I just said, you gotta add some options to the Shelby to make it comparable to the ZL1 anyway. All the coolers for example. Not included in Shelby base, included in ZL1 base...etc.
It does in some ways come down to bang for the buck anyway. For example, If you can take a current GT500, and for 6000.00 make it beat a ZL1 in all around performance and value, then you have a point. If you can't then it just comes down to personal preference between the Shelby and the ZL1.