2010 camaro SS vs. 2009 nissan skyline

[Donked]

Just remember, that if you take your GTR racing, and the tranny blows (as it tends to do)...they have no warranty anymore...So they're spending 20k for a transmission...

[THE EVIL TW1N]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

You seem to equate a fast track to a power track. Not quite. Handling doesn't become irrelevant above 100 mph, if anything it becomes more important.

Suppose there is a series of esses on a particular track. Because of its better grip and handling, one car can go through them 10% faster than another. At 50 mph, thats a 5 mph advantage and is pretty easy to make up for in the up coming straight. Another set is a lot more open and the cars can each go twice as fast through them. You now have a 10 mph gap at 100. You'd practically need a rocket to try and make that up on a straight away of any reasonable length.

youre acting like the GTR being built to actually handle at high speeds is a fault....

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by THE EVIL TW1N

youre acting like the GTR being built to actually handle at high speeds is a fault....

huh? I gave an example to show how valuable it can be.

[THE EVIL TW1N]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

huh? I gave an example to show how valuable it can be.

that high speed handling it what makes the GTR superior in this case

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by THE EVIL TW1N

that high speed handling it what makes the GTR superior in this case

So, are you somehow saying that it isn't the handling that gave it a faster time than the Z06?

[THE EVIL TW1N]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

So, are you somehow saying that it isn't the handling that gave it a faster time than the Z06?

nope. check the argument. it is the combination of being nearly as fast plus the advantage of being a better engineered car that makes the GTR superior to the z06. Exotics like the GTR shouldnt be judged based solely on speed in a straightline, doing so overlooks the bigger picture of how great of an all around car it is.

[Mr CLuTcH]

Originally Posted by THE EVIL TW1N

nope. check the argument. it is the combination of being nearly as fast plus the advantage of being a better engineered car that makes the GTR superior to the z06. Exotics like the GTR shouldnt be judged based solely on speed in a straightline, doing so overlooks the bigger picture of how great of an all around car it is.

Dude, are you comprehending what exactly your saying? Your saying being "nearly as fast", with the addition ofyour opinion that the GTR is a better engineered car, is what makes it a better car than the Z06. That's ridiculous,....and ignorant of you to say. Your putting forward a false premise; what makes a GTR a better engineered car than a Z06 when a Z06 outperforms it?! What, it's AWD system and the fact that it's overweight?!

I'm seriously beginning to think you are a troll. Seems like you think the GTR is better simply because it isn't a Chevy, while showing no reason as to why. Sorry, being "nearly as fast" doesn't make the slower car the better car. You keep overlooking the fact that a Z06 destroys a GTR in straight line acceleration, every time. A GTR isn't even "nearly as fast" as a Z06,....check the mph different between the two; it's more than simply "car lengths" apart. A handling advantage doesn't make one car superior than the next, when it's actually a slower car.

Slower cars with better or equal handling = superior. - Evil Twin

[Speed74SS]

Originally Posted by THE EVIL TW1N

nope. check the argument. it is the combination of being nearly as fast plus the advantage of being a better engineered car that makes the GTR superior to the z06. Exotics like the GTR shouldnt be judged based solely on speed in a straightline, doing so overlooks the bigger picture of how great of an all around car it is.

I go to the road track about twice a month and the Z06's at the track are faster than the 2 GTR's that run with full race slicks. It may be the drivers of the GTR's may not want to push it because they are afraid its going to break something that they don't have the cash to fix. I have ridden in a couple of the Z06's and they can handle the corners just fine I can hang with them on the straights as well but the weight kills you in the corners and the GTR has a lot more weight going through the corners compared to the Z06. If I were going to get a pure track car, I would buy a Z06. I also would be less worried about breaking something in the corvette vs the GTR.

[THE EVIL TW1N]

Originally Posted by Mr CLuTcH

Dude, are you comprehending what exactly your saying? Your saying being "nearly as fast", with the addition ofyour opinion that the GTR is a better engineered car, is what makes it a better car than the Z06. That's ridiculous,....and ignorant of you to say. Your putting forward a false premise; what makes a GTR a better engineered car than a Z06 when a Z06 outperforms it?! What, it's AWD system and the fact that it's overweight?!

I'm seriously beginning to think you are a troll. Seems like you think the GTR is better simply because it isn't a Chevy, while showing no reason as to why. Sorry, being "nearly as fast" doesn't make the slower car the better car. You keep overlooking the fact that a Z06 destroys a GTR in straight line acceleration, every time. A GTR isn't even "nearly as fast" as a Z06,....check the mph different between the two; it's more than simply "car lengths" apart. A handling advantage doesn't make one car superior than the next, when it's actually a slower car.

Slower cars with better or equal handling = superior. - Evil Twin

how is it NOT better engineered when the GTR isnt as fast in a straightline as a z06 yet the GTR is simply a faster car than it around the track? When it comes to evaluating an exotic like the GTR, we cant simply base its usefulness on speed alone and call it crap when another car is faster is faster in a straight line. Anybody can throw a big block into a crap car and be faster than both these cars in question, but that wouldnt make these cars crap. Speed is a big part of the equation but isnt the answer to everything, otherwise the z06 would have a better nurburgring time

[DGthe3]

Twin, your arguments are making less and less sense. You somehow went from claiming the Nurburgring is a power track and not a handling track, to 'proving' the GTR is better engineered than the Z06. I won't say much about engineering, other than performance of a task is only one element of engineering. If you have something that accomplishes a task with nearly equal effectiveness, yet is more expensive and breaks more often, is it really better engineered?

Back to the 'ring we go.

You have yet to give a good explanation as to why the Nurburgring is a power track. Essentially, there are only 2 ways to make a car faster around any track. Either get it to change its speed faster in a straight line, or have it hold a faster speed in a turn. A power track would favour the former, a handling track favours the later. At speed, the Z06 has a large acceleration advantage over the GTR. That advantage is bigger than the handling advantage of the GTR over the Z06. Therefore, on a power/acceleration track it should win every single time. 'Superior engineering' doesn't change the fundamentals of whats required to go fast on a circuit. The way I see it, either my understanding of the laws of physics is wrong, or your claim that its a power track is wrong.

[Mr CLuTcH]

Originally Posted by THE EVIL TW1N

how is it NOT better engineered when the GTR isnt as fast in a straightline as a z06 yet the GTR is simply a faster car than it around the track? When it comes to evaluating an exotic like the GTR, we cant simply base its usefulness on speed alone and call it crap when another car is faster is faster in a straight line. Anybody can throw a big block into a crap car and be faster than both these cars in question, but that wouldnt make these cars crap. Speed is a big part of the equation but isnt the answer to everything, otherwise the z06 would have a better nurburgring time

No one here is by any means calling the GTR crap,...it's just that it's not a better performance car than a Z06. A Z06 outruns the GTR, traps higher speeds, and has a superior power-to-weight ratio than the GTR; the only thing it would seem the GTR has going for it in a comparison to the Z06 is handling.

And yes, if someone were to throw a big block on some crap car and output more speed and power than either the Z06 or GTR, I think that would qualify it as a faster car, regardless if it looks like crap or not. Anyway, you seem to don't want to come to terms with the fact the a Z06 is a better car than a GTR, the numbers don't lie. Oh well, people are entitled to they're opinions, rather they be based on emotion or distaste for a particular brand.

Originally Posted by DGthe3

At speed, the Z06 has a large acceleration advantage over the GTR. That advantage is bigger than the handling advantage of the GTR over the Z06. Therefore, on a power/acceleration track it should win every single time. 'Superior engineering' doesn't change the fundamentals of whats required to go fast on a circuit. The way I see it, either my understanding of the laws of physics is wrong, or your claim that its a power track is wrong.

[All-Or-Nothing]

Here is a summary of this thread.....

[gm2376]

Originally Posted by THE EVIL TW1N

i think youre better off throwing that money into the GTR, you end up with a cooler car to boot.

The gtr is big and boxy and looks as bad as a gt500!

[Mr CLuTcH]

Originally Posted by gm2376

The gtr is big and boxy and looks as bad as a gt500!

UH! The nail in the coffin! lol.