email today from chevy

[actireman]

This is all too funny, I have been in the tire business all my life. Do you guys think these tires only travel in heated semis? Do you think a tire warehouse is heated? Do you know what cost it would be to heat an entire warehouse just for these tires? Are you kidding me? Come on guys, just like the other post, common sense has to prevail at some point. Look at the Firestone problem 15 years ago, do you thing Goodyear is going to kill every ZL1 owner in a northern state. The fact is All performance tires harden over time, that is why race teams always want fresh tires. ALL tires have less grip in cold weather and no grip in very cold weather. The bottom line is, if you drive these cars alot your going to probably go thru a set of tires every year and the common sense thing to do is get the new ones in the spring, and ask for fresh ones. There is a date code on every tire example 1811, this tire was built the 18th week of 2011. Every performance tire we buy in the spring we demand fresh ones for our customers and do to the fact they won't accept last years tires.

[f5journal]

I doubt any tire manufacturer says "don't drive this tire in the winter" It's simply that the temperature, wear and traction ratings only apply above certain temperatures. Period.

[Shurenuff]

Originally Posted by actireman

This is all too funny, I have been in the tire business all my life. Do you guys think these tires only travel in heated semis? Do you think a tire warehouse is heated? Do you know what cost it would be to heat an entire warehouse just for these tires? Are you kidding me? Come on guys, just like the other post, common sense has to prevail at some point. Look at the Firestone problem 15 years ago, do you thing Goodyear is going to kill every ZL1 owner in a northern state. The fact is All performance tires harden over time, that is why race teams always want fresh tires. ALL tires have less grip in cold weather and no grip in very cold weather. The bottom line is, if you drive these cars alot your going to probably go thru a set of tires every year and the common sense thing to do is get the new ones in the spring, and ask for fresh ones. There is a date code on every tire example 1811, this tire was built the 18th week of 2011. Every performance tire we buy in the spring we demand fresh ones for our customers and do to the fact they won't accept last years tires.

This sure does make sense to me. I've always known about certain operating temps for performance tires, but never knew about certain storage temps permanently degrading the compound of the tire.

I won't drive enough (at least I don't think) to warrant new tires every year, so I think I'll just take my chances on continuing to use the tires in that were stored in the winter for the spring/summer/fall driving season.

[IOMZL1]

Originally Posted by actireman

This is all too funny, I have been in the tire business all my life. Do you guys think these tires only travel in heated semis? Do you think a tire warehouse is heated? Do you know what cost it would be to heat an entire warehouse just for these tires? Are you kidding me? Come on guys, just like the other post, common sense has to prevail at some point. Look at the Firestone problem 15 years ago, do you thing Goodyear is going to kill every ZL1 owner in a northern state. The fact is All performance tires harden over time, that is why race teams always want fresh tires. ALL tires have less grip in cold weather and no grip in very cold weather. The bottom line is, if you drive these cars alot your going to probably go thru a set of tires every year and the common sense thing to do is get the new ones in the spring, and ask for fresh ones. There is a date code on every tire example 1811, this tire was built the 18th week of 2011. Every performance tire we buy in the spring we demand fresh ones for our customers and do to the fact they won't accept last years tires.

Race teams also notice when tire certain compounds go through a heat cycle and lose more grip than they should. This is one reason why different constructions and compounds are tested back to back under controlled conditions at the track. The combinations that can't hold their grip are rejected. The best combinations are selected for future use.

Winter tire compounds are designed to have more grip in colder temperatures and are therefore useless in warm temperatures. This is one example of grip getting worse with higher temperature.

http://www.wheels.ca/Tire%20Talk/article/785674

I’m sure the tires are exposed to vast temperatures in storage before they’ve been installed. This isn’t to say once the tires have been used [heat cycled] the compound will react differently to storage temps. It is clear that the tire properties change after having been used so it is reasonable to assume they might react differently to storage temperatures after the fact. GM didn’t waste time adding that disclaimer in for fun.

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/techpage.jsp?techid=66

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/techpage.jsp?techid=155

http://www.discounttiredirect.com/direct/brochure/info/tmpInfoHeatCycling.jsp

http://www.tyre-technology.com/index.php/heat-cycling

[Overflow]

Congrats!!!

[Rice Killer]

The only thing I'd add to the cold temperature tire storing debate is moving your car forward and back while in storage. This should be done in warm weather too if sitting for an extended period of time to prevent flat spots, especially on soft compound tires.

[hognutz]

Originally Posted by IOMZL1

Yes the transition temperature is not likely 20.000 degrees F and there is probably some room for error built in, but the fact of the matter is tire compound properties change from temperature cycles. This can be from hot to cold or cold to hot depending on the compound. I’d imagine the effects will worsen the colder the temperature the tire is exposed to and it is probably lower than 20 degrees where the transition starts.

If these tires are optimized for warm weather the cold could very well have an adverse effect on the compound even if the car isn’t driven. Does this mean the tire is going to fall apart or have a blow out? No, but it means the tire’s performance won’t be as good as it was. Will everyone driving the ZL1 notice this? No, but those tracking the car possibly will notice a change. I’d say given the performance nature of the vehicle it is in GMs best interest to maintain that performance. Tires are a big part of performance. If the tires degrade and the ZL1 suffers because of it GM looks bad - hence the disclaimer. You don’t see this on most cars because the tires aren’t as susceptible at temperatures that will likely be seen and nobody is doing performance driving on the OEM tires.

Same theory as ‘best by’ dates on food or beer. You won’t die if you eat the food after the date but you might not buy it again if it is your first time eating it because it just didn’t taste as good as it could have. Not to pile on the food analogies, but do all leftovers taste the same after a temp cycle? Ever notice storage temperatures on chemicals – paints, solvents, wax… almost anything? Now tell me storage temperature doesn’t matter. Why would tires be immune to the laws of physics?

You are exactly right the one thing your argument is missing is the cold temperature "transition" point of this specific compound.

also Temparature cycling if you re-search it is one extreme to another and it is a way to accelrate age on any substance. usually like -40 to 120+. this is not what happens to a tire in storage. I simplys stays cold during the winter and then warms up as the seans come so it isn't always shocked from 0 to 100 in the same day. Cold storage can lengthen the life of somethings as long as it is not too cold.

one other thing is how cold does your garage get at the coldest point of the year? my garage is attached to my house and always is warmer than the outside them

If it concerns you I would call goodyear themselves they know way more about tires than any of us and will tell you the physics behind it if cold storage is a real concern of this tire.

IF it is honestly just sell these tires and get different tires. they are very expesive summer tires and would sell easy. My garage never gets to 20 degress so it is a non issue on my end. I will never drive a car with these kind of tires in cold temps (32f or colder) either because the grip sucks so bad. If I was planing on driving this vehicle in colder temps than that I would get different rubber.

[OldJedi]

Originally Posted by actireman

This is all too funny, I have been in the tire business all my life. Do you guys think these tires only travel in heated semis? Do you think a tire warehouse is heated? Do you know what cost it would be to heat an entire warehouse just for these tires? Are you kidding me? Come on guys, just like the other post, common sense has to prevail at some point. Look at the Firestone problem 15 years ago, do you thing Goodyear is going to kill every ZL1 owner in a northern state. The fact is All performance tires harden over time, that is why race teams always want fresh tires. ALL tires have less grip in cold weather and no grip in very cold weather. The bottom line is, if you drive these cars alot your going to probably go thru a set of tires every year and the common sense thing to do is get the new ones in the spring, and ask for fresh ones. There is a date code on every tire example 1811, this tire was built the 18th week of 2011. Every performance tire we buy in the spring we demand fresh ones for our customers and do to the fact they won't accept last years tires.

But... just to be on the safe side, you should really consider sending your cars to Camaro5 members in Florida, just in case.

[Oneslowz28]

actireman is correct. it is not recommended by the mfg. to drive on these tires when its cold. they are covering their butt especially the uhp tires. They are only for summer dry driving. Some of them dont even handle well in the rain.

[IOMZL1]

The fact is only the tire compound engineer at Goodyear who worked on these tires can answer these questions in an accurate manner. Everyone else, myself included, is guessing given what information we have at our disposal.

...wait... what was this thread supposed to be about?

[hairtrigger]

Originally Posted by IOMZL1

The fact is only the tire compound engineer at Goodyear who worked on these tires can answer these questions in an accurate manner. Everyone else, myself included, is guessing given what information we have at our disposal.

...wait... what was this thread supposed to be about?

11/29/2011 - (3000) Order accepted by production control. Parts being ordered and production process is underway. How did it get so off track?
Oh BTW, in all my racing experience with stickies stored over the winter, the thing that hardens them the most is exposure to air, wrapped they are good in the spring no matter what temp they saw in the winter. As far as the warning about the F1's in colder temps than 40f/5c that is when your rearview mirror temp will flash ICE and that is when you need snowflake branded tires not summer Supercar tires. Remember all rules/warnings/speed limits etc. are engineered to keep the lowest common denominator in our society safe. Use your common sense everyone and it's all good.