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Old 10-26-2020, 02:42 PM   #15
CamaroCracka

 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff9962 View Post
Sebring is my home track and it is rough on brakes. I'll be running time trials with NASA this weekend, last event of the season. My car is a 2014 1SS and I'm still running the stock 4 pots with no cooling. Power wise I'm bone stock but I'm typically seeing low 130's coming into turn 17. I tried the stock Brembo pads one weekend and that was a no go. I've been running dedicated race pads and rotors with Motul RBF660 fluid with great success. My setup is Hawk DTC70's up front and DTC60's on the rear. I've been running the Centric high carbon rotors for years so I stayed with them on this car. No need to spend the money for slotted rotors in my opinion.

I would try another event with race pads,good rotors and fresh Motul fluid but try a different braking strategy. I'm an instructor and what I see with my students is a tendency to get on the brakes early, ease up on the brakes a bit when they realize it but continue to brake up to the turn in. This process generates a lot of heat and can transfer too thick of a film onto the rotors causing the shake or the shake can just be the pads going beyond their operating range. My suggestion is to get on the brakes hard, keep steady pressure on the pedal and if you get your braking completed early then release the pedal. This is the hard part mentally. Cover the gas pedal so that you're all set for a nice smooth roll on the throttle when the car takes a bite somewhere around the apex of the turn.

I was at Daytona two weeks ago with this setup and saw speeds up to 159 mph coming into the turn one braking zone. Zero issues but there is a lot of time for brakes to cool off at Daytona.
Thanks Jeff, do you mean pn CENTRIC 32062124C?
https://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/...hub,rotor,1896

Second question, did you replace the rear rotors because they seem ok?
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Old 10-26-2020, 04:30 PM   #16
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Here are the pics. It did rain on the way home.
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Old 10-26-2020, 11:48 PM   #17
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Pat in the Z28 section 3D printed some ducts that incorporate the Z28 kit for 3” hoses.

Here’s the discussion;

https://www.camaro5.com/forums/showt...457968&page=24
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Old 10-27-2020, 07:00 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CamaroCracka View Post
Kit number was S4KF1080
It was the "Stage 4" kit.

Link on Amazon is https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Front tires are Dunlop Maxx 305/30/20
Rear tires are Michelin Sport Cup 2s 325/30/20

Tires were sticking pretty good, as in I went into some corners at what I felt was too fast because the brakes faded, but I just turned it and prayed and it went around the corner.
From the info I found, those pads are ceramic. Ceramic is not to be used on the track. Not to be confused with carbon ceramic matrix pads (Z/28), they are an entirely different material.

https://ebcbrakes.com/product/redstuff-brake-pads/

I'm not seeing any blotches of uneven pad deposits, but what is odd is the pad not making full contact on the rotor. Must be some pad taper going on or bearing deflection. How many miles are on your car?
Is the inner rotor surface showing a similar pattern?

At the rear, as long as you are not using drilled rotors (no drilled for the track, f or r) the OE or a quality name brand will be good. Centric is a quality brand. The slots can give a little bit more initial bite and may help with pad outgassing removal, but most high quality pads don't have the outgassing problem any more. I'm still using my original OE rears, 38k miles on the car and have been using the same ST43 rear pads since 2016. Street and track. Rotor wear is minor and still well within spec.

Did you run with the stability control on? When you do, it can, depending on your driving, engage. When it engages one of the ways it settles the car is to apply one of the rear brakes. If it engages enough it is possible the rear brakes will start to see elevated temps. Check your rear brakes also for uneven pad deposits or signs of overheating.
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Old 10-27-2020, 08:24 AM   #19
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How many miles are on your car?
Is the inner rotor surface showing a similar pattern?


Did you run with the stability control on?
28k on the car. I'll try to get a look at it all this weekend.

I did leave the traction control on, so I will check the rears as well.
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Old 10-27-2020, 08:29 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by olblue75 View Post
Pat in the Z28 section 3D printed some ducts that incorporate the Z28 kit for 3” hoses.

Here’s the discussion;

https://www.camaro5.com/forums/showt...457968&page=24
If those go in the fender liner, what are you using for a hose mount at the caliper?
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Old 10-27-2020, 08:53 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CamaroCracka View Post
28k on the car. I'll try to get a look at it all this weekend.

I did leave the traction control on, so I will check the rears as well.
There’s a lot of your problem. With that amount of power, the system is engaging a lot more than you think it is. You should see blue/purple on your rear rotors since you ran with traction control on.

My first track day I ever did was in the rain, so instructors said to keep it all on. First session my rear rotors were toasted from from it. I ran in competition mode the rest of the time. I ran the second track day in competition mode, but I could tell it was interfering since now it was dry and I was pushing the car harder.
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Old 10-27-2020, 09:55 AM   #22
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Caliper Hose Mount

Quote:
Originally Posted by CamaroCracka View Post
If those go in the fender liner, what are you using for a hose mount at the caliper?
At the moment nothing but with being almost like a nozzle an using the 6th Gen kit I think it would work very well but I’m working it from another angle as well getting some kind of knuckle hose mount.
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Old 10-27-2020, 10:00 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by CamaroCracka View Post
Thanks Jeff, do you mean pn CENTRIC 32062124C?
https://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/...hub,rotor,1896
I don't have any experience with the Centric coated ones but I've been running these: https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo...98417&jsn=1982

Quote:
Originally Posted by CamaroCracka View Post
Second question, did you replace the rear rotors because they seem ok?
I've been running the Centric high carbons on the rear too but I'm not sure it's necessary. The rears really don't take much abuse. I put the Centric rotors and Hawk DTC60's on in April 2019 and have daily driven them, run 6 weekends at Sebring and one at Daytona. They're getting thin now and will probably survive this weekend at Sebring but that will finish them off.

I'm only getting two weekends out of the DTC70's on the front so I'm using the brakes hard. At $300+ for a set of pads it's a pretty big consumable. They haven't let me down but I'm sure the 6 piston ones wouldn't require as much pedal effort and probably be more gentle on a set of pads. If you stick with this and start getting faster, especially with your horsepower, you're going to need to think about a brake upgrade.

Here's a few laps from June and my personal best but you can watch JC in his green 6th gen SS blow by me on the back stretch somewhere around the 4:45 mark in the video. He's putting 540 hp to the wheels with an E85 tune on a modified naturally aspirated LT1. I would think about dialing yours back to somewhere around that neighborhood. He's running full slicks and 6 piston brakes as well.

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Old 10-27-2020, 11:01 AM   #24
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Ya, I'm thinking my best bet is the 6 pot calipers with ducting and try it again next year. About the only way I can think to dial the power back is remove the mechanical boost controller and limit boost to 10 pounds. I already had a 3.73 gear on the way, which will hopefully make power under 3k less obnoxious so I can just stay in 3rd and 4th throughout the track.
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Old 10-27-2020, 12:50 PM   #25
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Ya, I'm thinking my best bet is the 6 pot calipers with ducting and try it again next year. About the only way I can think to dial the power back is remove the mechanical boost controller and limit boost to 10 pounds. I already had a 3.73 gear on the way, which will hopefully make power under 3k less obnoxious so I can just stay in 3rd and 4th throughout the track.

That's a great choice on the brakes.
The 6 piston setup has better total heat capacity, leverage and more availability on track pads. Go for the C7 Corvette ZO6/GS iron calipers which have vented pistons. That is what I have and it slows the heat transfer into the fluid. I repainted mine with G2 caliper epoxy and applied ebay decals. A little bit of aero helps evacuate the ducted air out of the wheel/wheelhouse better, I have the ZL1 fender deflectors and my own extensions to create a low pressure area at the outside of the wheel.

I also run Girodisc titanium shims to help slow heat transfer into the caliper. Yes, the rotor will see more heat, but the correct choice of pad that has a high limit on temps will keep fade away.

Get some air to the rotor, find a more aggressive pad, sweat the details, keep fresh fluid in the calipers, and lay eyes on everything before every track day.

I run the ST43s on the street and track. They are well known for their durability. And, as demonspeed mentioned, their noise on the street, haha. They are one of the more expensive choices, but Porterfield and Raybestos-Racing.com both offer discounts. When you take into account that they wear excellent, then their cost is easier to accept. Their wear won't be quantified in just two events. They'll go longer than that. My observed rotor wear shows the ST43s are easy on them. You'll toss a set of front rotors due to heat checking before they reach minimum thickness. Non-corrosive brake dust, high temp limits. Very good torque. On the street, even when the transfer layer is wiped off, they have excellent cold bite.

You'll get alot of opinions on pad choice. See what the more experienced Gen 5 and 6 owners are running, like Jeff9962, or even the fast Mustang guys. Look for similar weight cars to bring the opinions on an even level.
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Old 10-27-2020, 09:22 PM   #26
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I run the ST43s on the street and track. They are well known for their durability. And, as demonspeed mentioned, their noise on the street, haha. They are one of the more expensive choices, but Porterfield and Raybestos-Racing.com both offer discounts. When you take into account that they wear excellent, then their cost is easier to accept. Their wear won't be quantified in just two events. They'll go longer than that. My observed rotor wear shows the ST43s are easy on them. You'll toss a set of front rotors due to heat checking before they reach minimum thickness. Non-corrosive brake dust, high temp limits. Very good torque. On the street, even when the transfer layer is wiped off, they have excellent cold bite.
I feel as though the ST43’s have better cold bite than even these Street/AutoX pads do. I just couldn’t get past the howling piercing screams from street braking. I also got tired of saying “they’re race pads” and my wife not wanting to ride in it
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Old 10-27-2020, 10:32 PM   #27
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I feel as though the ST43’s have better cold bite than even these Street/AutoX pads do. I just couldn’t get past the howling piercing screams from street braking. I also got tired of saying “they’re race pads” and my wife not wanting to ride in it
lol, I feel your pain on the noise! But, I kinda dig it and my wife doesn't ride in the car that often.

When I was running the DBA rotors with slots, I often felt the cold bite was too much, they were too touchy. Pretty amazing considering they are an true race pad. The Raybestos ST43's were used at one time, used on some NASCAR Cup cars at intermediate tracks.
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Old 10-30-2020, 01:23 PM   #28
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Late to the conversation but yeah what the others said. The ZO6 brakes are real nice. I have been running them for 3 seasons. I have the Z28 ducts with out extensions and haven't had any fade issues. I run Castrol SRF brake fluid.

I'm curious why you are running different tires front and rear. Being different compounds can cause issues.
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