01-11-2021, 04:28 PM | #1 |
How much boost before changing ring gap?
I'm just doing some exploration, but I was thinking about twin turbos, and I'm wondering how much boost can you add to a stock bottom end car (intake has never even been off) before you have to take it apart and adjust ring gap?
I tried to look through the existing threads but couldn't find this being discussed. Thanks
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01-11-2021, 05:46 PM | #2 |
Served USN - Atomic Chimp
Drives: 13 Camaro LSX434 TT M6, 21 ZLE A10 Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Fort Collins, CO
Posts: 1,600
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You're going to be limited by cylinder pressure and the strength of the thin ring lands on a stock LS3/L99 (which ain't that robust), and the aluminum block. If you're going to be taking apart the motor, might as well beef up the pistons/rods with forged components and you'll be able to make a few more hundred HP. That being said, numbers I have seen and experienced range from 700-850rwhp on the SBE motor, and 850-1000rwhp with forged components. Your longevity will depend on your tune and the continuous amount of power you're pushing.
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In excess of 1,000WHP LSX434 | AGP 65/65 TT | BTR Equalizer Intake | Trickflow 245cc cathedral | BTR custom cam | Cortex EBC | n2mb WOT | ID-1700x | Brisk GR12S | RPM Lv 7 TR6060 | AGP's Triple 525LPH Fore Fuel | Monster LT1-S Triple | 4.11 DSS Proform 9", CF driveshaft, 1400hp axles | Hurst Line Lock | MGW Retro Short Throw w/old skool Hurst T-handle | ADM solid subframe mounts | Prothane Motor Mounts | Revshift Poly Trans insert | Moreno camber/caster plates |
01-12-2021, 02:37 PM | #3 |
Drives: 2012 camaro 2ss rs L99 Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: North Sioux city SD
Posts: 446
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For what its worth: I asked the guys at GPI the same question and they told me they see guys all the time running just fine with 12psi but that was the limit. (Thats what I am doing)
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2012 2SS/RS, L99, no cats/mufflers, Ported intake manifold, fuel rail upgrade, ID1050x injectors, Vmax throttle body, 25% UDP, GPI DOD delete, GPI SS3, GPI cnc heads, GPI – 5/16″ Hardened Pushrods, BTR trunion upgrade, BTR .660 springs, pcv revamp w/dual catch cans, Circle D 3800, full BMR suspension & bushings. ZL1 fuel pump, HPT programmed fpcm. JMS bap, Snow VC-50 methanol setup. custom 4gal methonal tank, vs7875 turbo, FMIC, precision 46mm WG, 50mm BOV, 3bar map, SJM line lock, Innovate SCG-1, Hurst shifter with tap shift mod, ×2 Holley 14" fans Diy E85, Diy auxiliary pump
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01-19-2021, 08:50 AM | #4 |
Thanks for the replies.
Tarendor - I was reading through some of your build threads and I was wondering, did you ever get that thing to the dyno? I'm also curious, are you still using that ZL1 pump? I was wondering if you'd run out of fuel with it at 12psi in the upper RPM range.
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-Rad Air CAI
-GPI SS3 Cam & BTR Springs -2" Texas Speed Headers -AEM Wideband AFR -3" Full Exhaust w/Hi-Flow Cats & Single Chamber Flowmasters -McLeod RXT twin-disc w/Aluminum Flywheel -Yukon 4.11 -Nitto 555 G2 |
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01-21-2021, 01:18 PM | #5 |
Drives: 2012 camaro 2ss rs L99 Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: North Sioux city SD
Posts: 446
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I have not gotten to the dyno, I am down for winter.
When I talked to the guys at GPI when I was looking to buy my injectors they were confident that with the ZL1 pump (fpcm programmed by me using HPT) AND the ID1050x plus methonal that I would be good to 12psi with no issues. (SAID the methonal was optional too) I have not even turned on the methonal yet. However I am adding a msd bap. that I got in a trade because....why not? lol. I have not ran out of fuel at all, but in tuning I only got up to 8psi before crappy weather hit and I parked him.
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2012 2SS/RS, L99, no cats/mufflers, Ported intake manifold, fuel rail upgrade, ID1050x injectors, Vmax throttle body, 25% UDP, GPI DOD delete, GPI SS3, GPI cnc heads, GPI – 5/16″ Hardened Pushrods, BTR trunion upgrade, BTR .660 springs, pcv revamp w/dual catch cans, Circle D 3800, full BMR suspension & bushings. ZL1 fuel pump, HPT programmed fpcm. JMS bap, Snow VC-50 methanol setup. custom 4gal methonal tank, vs7875 turbo, FMIC, precision 46mm WG, 50mm BOV, 3bar map, SJM line lock, Innovate SCG-1, Hurst shifter with tap shift mod, ×2 Holley 14" fans Diy E85, Diy auxiliary pump
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01-22-2021, 01:18 AM | #6 |
Seems logical :-)
It will be summer before I'm ready to add boost, so please keep me posted. I'm curious to hear how things go as you turn the PSI up!
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-Rad Air CAI
-GPI SS3 Cam & BTR Springs -2" Texas Speed Headers -AEM Wideband AFR -3" Full Exhaust w/Hi-Flow Cats & Single Chamber Flowmasters -McLeod RXT twin-disc w/Aluminum Flywheel -Yukon 4.11 -Nitto 555 G2 |
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01-22-2021, 10:31 AM | #7 |
Drives: 2012 camaro 2ss rs L99 Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: North Sioux city SD
Posts: 446
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At 8psi its very sketchy hahaha I can't wait to see the final result myself. (I have full suspension and good tires but its sketchy still and I am not going to put slicks on him)
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2012 2SS/RS, L99, no cats/mufflers, Ported intake manifold, fuel rail upgrade, ID1050x injectors, Vmax throttle body, 25% UDP, GPI DOD delete, GPI SS3, GPI cnc heads, GPI – 5/16″ Hardened Pushrods, BTR trunion upgrade, BTR .660 springs, pcv revamp w/dual catch cans, Circle D 3800, full BMR suspension & bushings. ZL1 fuel pump, HPT programmed fpcm. JMS bap, Snow VC-50 methanol setup. custom 4gal methonal tank, vs7875 turbo, FMIC, precision 46mm WG, 50mm BOV, 3bar map, SJM line lock, Innovate SCG-1, Hurst shifter with tap shift mod, ×2 Holley 14" fans Diy E85, Diy auxiliary pump
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01-22-2021, 12:38 PM | #8 |
Dan
Drives: 2010 Camaro 2SS IOM Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Georgia, USA not the other one
Posts: 1,040
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I am around 13psi on the SBE but running E85 and two pumps on 105lb injectors.
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Dan
2010 IOM SS YSI-B, Pat G Cam, Ported CTS-V Heads, ARH LTs MBRP 3" exhaust http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showth...&highlight=ysi |
01-22-2021, 12:39 PM | #9 |
Drives: 2014 Camaro SS/RS 1LE 1967 Camaro Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Fort Wayne, IN
Posts: 873
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I'm sure you have done your research on the forum but just for nothing...back in September I installed a BTR stage 2TT camshaft along with the AGP twin kit. Turbos are 57/57's, Injectors are AUS 1000's and I have a JMS voltage booster for fueling,all else is stock. On a loaded hub dyno I made 650 RWHP and 619 RWTQ on 8lbs of boost. I did not have my 1LE dynoed before the install but assuming the low end of what I have seen on this forum (370 RWHP), I am making 35hp per pound of boost. Just take this for what it's worth we all know dynos are just a tool. I'm sure you are already amazed at the power, it's stupid fun!!
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01-22-2021, 01:25 PM | #10 |
Drives: 2012 camaro 2ss rs L99 Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: North Sioux city SD
Posts: 446
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As funny as it may seem...I don't care about the hp numbers.
What I want is 12psi of boost at a solid lambda and decent timing. Then I am going to add the methonal and add more timing...its all relative...compared to when I got the car its crazy lol. Their will always be faster cars out there but I plan on hurting some feelings this summer for sure.
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2012 2SS/RS, L99, no cats/mufflers, Ported intake manifold, fuel rail upgrade, ID1050x injectors, Vmax throttle body, 25% UDP, GPI DOD delete, GPI SS3, GPI cnc heads, GPI – 5/16″ Hardened Pushrods, BTR trunion upgrade, BTR .660 springs, pcv revamp w/dual catch cans, Circle D 3800, full BMR suspension & bushings. ZL1 fuel pump, HPT programmed fpcm. JMS bap, Snow VC-50 methanol setup. custom 4gal methonal tank, vs7875 turbo, FMIC, precision 46mm WG, 50mm BOV, 3bar map, SJM line lock, Innovate SCG-1, Hurst shifter with tap shift mod, ×2 Holley 14" fans Diy E85, Diy auxiliary pump
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01-23-2021, 09:23 PM | #11 |
Thanks for the insights!
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-Rad Air CAI
-GPI SS3 Cam & BTR Springs -2" Texas Speed Headers -AEM Wideband AFR -3" Full Exhaust w/Hi-Flow Cats & Single Chamber Flowmasters -McLeod RXT twin-disc w/Aluminum Flywheel -Yukon 4.11 -Nitto 555 G2 |
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01-27-2021, 09:07 AM | #12 | |
Drives: BLUE CAMARO ZL1 1LE M6 Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: ON THE DYNO WATERBURY CT.
Posts: 15,215
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Quote:
You could butt the rings by overheating the engine all stock. You can make 800 Wheel and never butt the rings. It is all about temps and ring growth. Ted.
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Celebrating 37 years Performance parts, Installation, Fabrication, Dyno tuning, Remote custom tuning, and alignments. 203-753-7223 Waterbury CT. 06705 email tedj@jannettyracing.com |
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01-27-2021, 10:08 AM | #13 |
Drives: 2012 camaro 2ss rs L99 Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: North Sioux city SD
Posts: 446
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Ted,
Do you reccomend converting to the 4 corner steam port vs staying with the factory 2 corner to help prevent hot spots?
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2012 2SS/RS, L99, no cats/mufflers, Ported intake manifold, fuel rail upgrade, ID1050x injectors, Vmax throttle body, 25% UDP, GPI DOD delete, GPI SS3, GPI cnc heads, GPI – 5/16″ Hardened Pushrods, BTR trunion upgrade, BTR .660 springs, pcv revamp w/dual catch cans, Circle D 3800, full BMR suspension & bushings. ZL1 fuel pump, HPT programmed fpcm. JMS bap, Snow VC-50 methanol setup. custom 4gal methonal tank, vs7875 turbo, FMIC, precision 46mm WG, 50mm BOV, 3bar map, SJM line lock, Innovate SCG-1, Hurst shifter with tap shift mod, ×2 Holley 14" fans Diy E85, Diy auxiliary pump
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01-28-2021, 07:18 AM | #14 |
Drives: BLUE CAMARO ZL1 1LE M6 Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: ON THE DYNO WATERBURY CT.
Posts: 15,215
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All of our high powered engines have 4 corner, but not always possible with all combinations.
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www.jannettyracing.com
Celebrating 37 years Performance parts, Installation, Fabrication, Dyno tuning, Remote custom tuning, and alignments. 203-753-7223 Waterbury CT. 06705 email tedj@jannettyracing.com |
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