Trifecta Tune and Tapshift

[rtcat600man]

Originally Posted by jagan323

Hey rtcatman, (imo you should tell me ur first name, it's weird to type ur username LOL)

I talked to Vince, I trust him. I could forward you his email to me through PM. But as of this thread, I'm not going to start saying people are wrong or right. Just wanted to tell ppl how excited I am =D

Actually im just going to PM you anyways lol

Mike (AKA: catman, rt, rtman, rtcatman, rtcat600man)
No problem on the Vince message. I have emailed him a few times myself to get my trans where it is at today.

Originally Posted by jagan323

I believe Ted thinks I'm driving a car like a manual without rev matching, therefore hurting the syncros and transmission. Usually the internal parts cant take too much stress like changing gears without any rev matching...

They think it will blow up! =O lolz

Interesting.

Originally Posted by jagan323

okay, for some reason, I cant PM you RTcatman =/

Interesting. That must be part of the probation I am on for a minor issue I got into trouble with 2 months ago. You can find me over at bowtie v6 com. We can discuss things more easily over there.

Originally Posted by jagan323

Nah man, I believe the Tapshift is boolean pass, which just means On or Off... doesnt matter if you hold the button down, it won't change how it shifts. And yes, the paddles were ONCE too close, and I could not upshift, since the paddle was holding the button down. I got the thing optimized now. so its fine.



I can't really tell if it sounds the same. I actually don't hear your firm shifts engaging. But it could just be the camera. Let me ask you this. Before your and after your TCM tune, did u hear and feel the difference?

Rtcatman claims he can't feel the difference. Maybe I should get my transmission serviced LOL...

When I shift, I can hear a slight noise. But it's just the clutches engaging/disengaging. I know that for sure. But the noise is so subtle... I dont think you or I can pick it up on camera. I can try though. I still plan on making a video about it. But I dont think the camera's can pick up on that. Especially with the engine and exhaust roaring at the higher RPMs.

-EDIT: Btw, I love your second video. The breeze, sun and everything looked perfect. But I lol'd when that Miata just slammed itself infront of u. Damn those nimble things! lol.

I can feel the difference for sure. I just don't know about the rev. portion. I spend most of my time on the highway to and from work. So I don't have allot of time to play with the tap shift. But the few times I have I like what is going on with it.

[jagan323]

Originally Posted by Beauwulf

Yea, I thought the switch was "momentary" but I never tried holding the button to see...

If the clutches are slipping to the point that there is a free rev in between shifts, it's not the programming. It could be low fluid level but I'm thinkin its cooked clutch discs. If your still under warranty, I'd take it in. I would, however, unflash the tune before you try to get service....

I could maybe tell better from a video what's going on with it....

BTW, I got a neat little cover from "Windcutter" for my cam to try to get some better audio. I haven't tried it yet but everyone seems to rave about the stuff!

http://tinyurl.com/4xtmo5e

Sweet stuff man. I need a better mic on my GoPro camera... THat thing comes with crap mic... lol. Thanks for the URL!

I HIGHLY HIGHLY doubt it's low fluid or cooked clutch discs. However, I am taking it into GM for a Fluid flush and filter change (Hadn't done it at all after my break-in) My tranny is notchy on coldstart though. But it's really cold here... Still.. like 32 degrees lol. But it's fine when the tranny is warm. I just can't help but think it's full of metal shavings!

Originally Posted by rtcat600man

Mike (AKA: catman, rt, rtman, rtcatman, rtcat600man)

I can feel the difference for sure. I just don't know about the rev. portion. I spend most of my time on the highway to and from work. So I don't have allot of time to play with the tap shift. But the few times I have I like what is going on with it.

Yep! I love the firm shift. Maybe i OVER exaggerated on the Rev thing.. it's not like it skips 1k RPM or anything. I would say theres a 200 RPM rev before the next gear is engaged, so 1/5th from number to number of the Tacho. And this is instant... talking about split seconds here. But definately noticable, and definately different from the un-tuned tranny.

[rtcat600man]

Originally Posted by jagan323

Sweet stuff man. I need a better mic on my GoPro camera... THat thing comes with crap mic... lol. Thanks for the URL!

I HIGHLY HIGHLY doubt it's low fluid or cooked clutch discs. However, I am taking it into GM for a Fluid flush and filter change (Hadn't done it at all after my break-in) My tranny is notchy on coldstart though. But it's really cold here... Still.. like 32 degrees lol. But it's fine when the tranny is warm. I just can't help but think it's full of metal shavings!



Yep! I love the firm shift. Maybe i OVER exaggerated on the Rev thing.. it's not like it skips 1k RPM or anything. I would say theres a 200 RPM rev before the next gear is engaged, so 1/5th from number to number of the Tacho. And this is instant... talking about split seconds here. But definately noticable, and definately different from the un-tuned tranny.

I will check for it tomorrow when I head out in the morning to get some quick driving in before I start some more mods, assuming it is not raining otherwise it might be a few days.

[Will@AdkinsPerformance]

I asked if vince would set me up with some firmer shifts or do what you mentioned in regards to torque management and the reductions that you mentioned in your past posts jagan. He strongly reccomended against all of it, so I held off. It will be nice once we get the piggy back system set up on my car in a couple weeks with the turbo to actually get it dyno tuned from now on. I love Vince, but I feel strongly about being able to tune my car at the most trusted local shop on the spot. Be careful with your tranny jagan.

[Blade]

Originally Posted by Will@AdkinsPerformance

I asked if vince would set me up with some firmer shifts or do what you mentioned in regards to torque management and the reductions that you mentioned in your past posts jagan. He strongly reccomended against all of it, so I held off. It will be nice once we get the piggy back system set up on my car in a couple weeks with the turbo to actually get it dyno tuned from now on. I love Vince, but I feel strongly about being able to tune my car at the most trusted local shop on the spot. Be careful with your tranny jagan.

Is recommending against because you are trying out the twin turbo boost? Or for right now when your car does not have FI?

Because Vince has never recommended against reducing torque management and firmer shifts on my car.

If it is for the turbo tune I can understand. You are already maxing out the power that the tranny can handle, so no need to reduce the torque management and have firmer shifts to deliver more power quickly.

[scrming]

My understanding is the RPMs should never go UP on and UPSHIFT! Sound like you have perhaps a mild case of flaring... but mild or not, I definitely wouldn't want my tranny doing it!

[JANNETTYRACING]

jagan323, Everything here is subject to interpretation, Your explanation of your shifts indicates what is known in the transmission world as a Shift Flare.

A Shift Flare is when there is a noticeable hesitation in the the gear change, or a Space between the shifts where the RPMs on the engine are allowed to rise between the shifts.

The Same as shifting a Manual with your right foot to the floor and just using the clutch only to shift, The RPM will Rise between shifts.

Now Don't Confuse this with Torque management which Drops out timing while the transmission shifts or a long smooth shift where the RPM does not change for a split second then falls.

I am only responding to your Explanation, and your explanation indicates a problem.

Maybe a Video would be a better way to show your shifts.

Ted.

[JANNETTYRACING]

Originally Posted by gatorlover

ted,
I have your tune and if feels like it does the rev match as well. Maybe not as dramatic as the op describes but, it does seem to do that. Can you elaborate on this?

Mone seems more noticable on the 3rd to 4th gear shift.

Like I said everything is subject to interpretation, and I doubt very much you have the same issue.

Call me.

[Blade]

Jagan man........next time just say "When I upshift the the RPM needle flares up while completing the shift" Your original explanation had me so confused and panicked that something was wrong with my car.

But like Ted and Scrming are explaining, if you are having flare ups on the rpm needle when upshifting, that is an issue needing to be examined by a shop.

[scrming]

Originally Posted by Blade

Jagan man........next time just say "When I upshift the the RPM needle flares up while completing the shift" Your original explanation had me so confused and panicked that something was wrong with my car.

But like Ted and Scrming are explaining, if you are having flare ups on the rpm needle when upshifting, that is an issue needing to be examined by a shop.

Most likely the flare can be addressed with adjustments to the TUNE... that being said, I have seen things like this happen on trannys with only 25,000 miles on the fluid and putting in fresh fluid solved the issue...

[rtcat600man]

Originally Posted by scrming

Most likely the flare can be addressed with adjustments to the TUNE... that being said, I have seen things like this happen on trannys with only 25,000 miles on the fluid and putting in fresh fluid solved the issue...

Those are both good things to know.

[KMPrenger]

Ehh, I guess this whole thing confuses me a bit. I mean, I THINK I understand how Vince tunes the torque management, but maybe not.

To me, if TQ management is reduced, well that means that somehow the transmission is going to shift harder. The only way I can imagine that happening is by the clutch of the gear your shifting from disengaging faster and the next gear engaging faster than stock, thus creating that "snap" you feel when it shifts.

Is this correct?

But what you are all saying, is that even with these harder/faster shifts, there should still be no in-between time where no gear is engaged? (aka..no neutral time where the engine is free to spin)

[jagan323]

Originally Posted by scrming

My understanding is the RPMs should never go UP on and UPSHIFT! Sound like you have perhaps a mild case of flaring... but mild or not, I definitely wouldn't want my tranny doing it!

Okay! I'll be sure to check it out again today.

Originally Posted by JANNETTYRACING

jagan323, Everything here is subject to interpretation, Your explanation of your shifts indicates what is known in the transmission world as a Shift Flare.

A Shift Flare is when there is a noticeable hesitation in the the gear change, or a Space between the shifts where the RPMs on the engine are allowed to rise between the shifts.

The Same as shifting a Manual with your right foot to the floor and just using the clutch only to shift, The RPM will Rise between shifts.

Now Don't Confuse this with Torque management which Drops out timing while the transmission shifts or a long smooth shift where the RPM does not change for a split second then falls.

I am only responding to your Explanation, and your explanation indicates a problem.

Maybe a Video would be a better way to show your shifts.

Ted.

Yeah, I plan on making a video... whether it is a problem OR not.

Originally Posted by Blade

Jagan man........next time just say "When I upshift the the RPM needle flares up while completing the shift" Your original explanation had me so confused and panicked that something was wrong with my car.

But like Ted and Scrming are explaining, if you are having flare ups on the rpm needle when upshifting, that is an issue needing to be examined by a shop.

LoL... yeah, I'll make sure I sort that out.

Originally Posted by scrming

Most likely the flare can be addressed with adjustments to the TUNE... that being said, I have seen things like this happen on trannys with only 25,000 miles on the fluid and putting in fresh fluid solved the issue...

My car is only at 4800 miles. Never been to track or strip yet. Just driven hard on small occasions. Like I have said, I still plan on getting a fluid flush and filter change for the break-in period. We'll see if that helps =D

[Will@AdkinsPerformance]

Originally Posted by Blade

Is recommending against because you are trying out the twin turbo boost? Or for right now when your car does not have FI?

Because Vince has never recommended against reducing torque management and firmer shifts on my car.

If it is for the turbo tune I can understand. You are already maxing out the power that the tranny can handle, so no need to reduce the torque management and have firmer shifts to deliver more power quickly.

When I specifically asked regarding the torque management he recommended against it, even before I told him about running boost. We're doing a single turbo by the way. I'd have to hunt through old emails to find out the reasoning he gave, he definitely did reccomend me against it...I know I thought it was odd too.