Wheel weights on my Camaro's calipers

[SWHCPA]

Originally Posted by richardhoggard

Seriously guys... You are going crazy about NOTHING! You only even notice that they are there if you are looking for them. Remember last night when I said I didnt have them? It's because I couldnt see them. I personally don't know what they are for, but I don't really care either. Maybe I will if they become a problem, but until then, I know that the people that put them there know much much more about this car than I do and I trust their knowledge.

[2002b4c]

I checked out the link on Automotive News - It takes you to an article from July 2008 - nothing on this subject.

Tony

[scomaro22]

Originally Posted by Airborne

I forwarded the pics to Brembo. Just got an email back from them. They state that..
“It’s likely they’re used for noise defeat.
These will often defeat harmonic distortion a.k.a brake squeal.”

All i know is that i had an '06 Volvo S60R and it had Brembos on it, and they worked real well, buuuuut, squealed like no other. It was awful and embarrassing when they did. I brought it back to the dealership 4 or 5 times over the life of the lease and their techs had nothing to say but " Brembos just squeal" . It was beyond annoying and a half assed excuse. This Camaro is too beautiful of a car to have the brakes squealing like they did on that R, so if those weights are what have to be on them for now, ill suck it up and deal till it gets resolved, bc i will not want to drive that car with the brakes making as much noise as i remember the, making on the other car.

[UCF w00t]

I don't understand how people are saying this is harmonic related. That doesn't make sense to me. The breaks barely move. In order to have a harmonic issue, they need to be moving in a constant fashion (e.g. spinning) causing an imbalance which creates noise at a frequency. Breaks don't move at any sort of frequency! It's not like these are on the rotor or something. Squealing breaks isn't caused by some sort of harmonic imbalance it's caused by friction. That's why break pads aren't made out of some plain ol metal as they would squeal like a mofo every time you tapped the breaks. Obviously this is a bandaid for something but a harmonic imbalance, I think not.

[Tran]

Again, this thread was not created by the OP so that it can be a complaint thread. It was created to be a useful discussion thread to get to the bottom of what these weights' purpose may be. If you have something technical to add, please do so. Otherwise, sorry, but off-topic posts will continue to be deleted so that people following this thread can concentrate on the reasons for the weights.

[Rogue Leader]

I love the expert talk assuming these are just tape weights like you would put on a wheel to balance it and will melt off.

Come on, It seems like noone can give them 1 iota of a benefit of the doubt.

[GTAHVIT]

Originally Posted by UCF w00t

I don't understand how people are saying this is harmonic related. That doesn't make sense to me. The breaks barely move. In order to have a harmonic issue, they need to be moving in a constant fashion (e.g. spinning) causing an imbalance which creates noise at a frequency. Breaks don't move at any sort of frequency! It's not like these are on the rotor or something. Squealing breaks isn't caused by some sort of harmonic imbalance it's caused by friction. That's why break pads aren't made out of some plain ol metal as they would squeal like a mofo every time you tapped the breaks. Obviously this is a bandaid for something but a harmonic imbalance, I think not.

I do see your point. But Harmonic resonances can come from any system under pressure. like hydraulic brakes squeezing pads against a rotating disk.

I'm reaching way back to my days in the Navy here so bear with me. But, Hydraulic systems are extremely prone to pressure related squeals, vibrations, or even howls based on many different forces. It's possible that under a common brake pressure and a common vehicle speed that the brakes themselves squeal when everything is at that exact point to cause the resonance. It does make sense that adding weights will reduce the frequency at which the resonance occurs changing the dynamic of the forces causing it. It's always better to reduce the cause of the resonant frequency than to cover it up for sure. But I'd prefer to add weight than to say add a bushing that just hides the vibration. Adding the weight actually reduces the vibration. Even though the brakes don't rotate like the rotor does, it still is affected by the rotor and pressure.

For what it's worth.

[Davis]

They look different from the wheel weights to me. Mine will be staying on until we know for certain.

[boxmonkeyracing]

Originally Posted by UCF w00t

I don't understand how people are saying this is harmonic related. That doesn't make sense to me. The breaks barely move. In order to have a harmonic issue, they need to be moving in a constant fashion (e.g. spinning) causing an imbalance which creates noise at a frequency. Breaks don't move at any sort of frequency! It's not like these are on the rotor or something. Squealing breaks isn't caused by some sort of harmonic imbalance it's caused by friction. That's why break pads aren't made out of some plain ol metal as they would squeal like a mofo every time you tapped the breaks. Obviously this is a bandaid for something but a harmonic imbalance, I think not.

Guess u r right. Friction does cause vibrations which can cause harmonic tones. (Hint of sarcasm)

Since the rotors spin as fast as the wheels turn and the callipers are stationary. Even a slight friction between the two could in essence cause a harmonic tone.

Or they're there to stop the vibrations from reaching somewhere else on the car when u apply the brakes.

Point is who knows none of us designed the suspension and braking systems for this car.

Brembo stated it might be for the harmonic balancing but u seem to doubt them to.

[kdbolt70]

Originally Posted by boxmonkeyracing

Guess u r right. Friction does cause vibrations which can cause harmonic tones. (Hint of sarcasm)

Since the rotors spin as fast as the wheels turn and the callipers are stationary. Even a slight friction between the two could in essence cause a harmonic tone.

Or they're there to stop the vibrations from reaching somewhere else on the car when u apply the brakes.

Point is who knows none of us designed the suspension and braking systems for this car.

Brembo stated it might be for the harmonic balancing but u seem to doubt them to.

Got this interesting response from my father (GM manager):

Hmmm... Harmonic Resonance Dampers? Original Camaro had a last minute gel filled canister that went into the trunk to dampen a resonance they could not engineer out.

So his take was that it was for harmonic dampening. Who knows for sure though...

[1_2Many]

Originally Posted by UCF w00t

I don't understand how people are saying this is harmonic related. That doesn't make sense to me. The breaks barely move. In order to have a harmonic issue, they need to be moving in a constant fashion (e.g. spinning) causing an imbalance which creates noise at a frequency. Breaks don't move at any sort of frequency! It's not like these are on the rotor or something. Squealing breaks isn't caused by some sort of harmonic imbalance it's caused by friction. That's why break pads aren't made out of some plain ol metal as they would squeal like a mofo every time you tapped the breaks. Obviously this is a bandaid for something but a harmonic imbalance, I think not.

You are incorrect. Let me explain:

This has nothing to do with "harmonic imbalance". Something doesn't have to be spinning to have a resonant frequency...and everything has a natural resonant frequency. If the brake calipers have a natural frequency in the range of the vibration caused by the friction of the rotor against the pads then they will "squeal".

Brake calipers must be an engineering nightmare because not only are they very light compared to the massive rotor...they are actually shaped like a tuning fork which is exactly what you don't want when trying to control vibration.

I should know...I'm a vibration test engineer! I've worked here for the last 8 years and my whole job is to control resonant frequencies. http://www.baughneng.com

Using lead weights to control noise is a very feasable idea. Lead is very dense and relatively soft which is great for noise dampening. We use what we call "Q-Damp" to dampen vibration and although I'm not at liberty to tell you what it is made of I can tell you that it basically does the same job as the lead weights appear to be doing.

In my opinion, GM should not replace these calipers. They do not need to spend anymore wasted money, but instead they should have a solid painted lead weight to replace the generic wheel weights.

[fdjizm]

Hmmm... Harmonic Resonance Dampers? Original Camaro had a last minute gel filled canister that went into the trunk to dampen a resonance they could not engineer out.

gell filled canister? pics? lol that sounds interesting

[UCF w00t]

That makes sense. I know everything has a resonant frequency but they aren't moving so I didn't see how they could reach that frequency. I guess the friction from stopping could cause it to achieve that but it still seems odd to me. But I'm just a techie so I'll defer to the vibration test engineer .

[kdbolt70]

Originally Posted by fdjizm

gell filled canister? pics? lol that sounds interesting

http://www.chevy-camaro.com/faq/chev...l-shakers.shtm

working on pics. They were called "cocktail shakers"