ProCharger or Vortech

[calbert1999]

Considering, it's spring many Camaro owners are completing the most amazing performance mod there is "Forced Induction"; Now that there is more information available on the many models and systems I know within my circles more people are going with the centrifugal superchargers instead of the tried and true old school roots style.

I decided to go with the ProCharger system, and I am very pleased with the results, ease of installation, maintenance free setup, no drilling, no meth, no coolant redirection, no hassles, and the 3yr. warranty and if you decide to forge / stroke the engine in the future you can easily excercise upgrade options available from ProCharger to the larger F-series head units.

If you have installed a ProCharger or Vortech SC, it would be great to share pics., dyno charts, track results (if you drag or road course your vehicle), and read about all of your experiences.

[HufferSS]

I'd rather see a time slip than a dyno sheet any day of the week.

[Tshepp]

So jealous! I want to put a s/c on my SS but I just cant pull the trigger and drop $6-8k on the setup.

Time slips are nice but they are all driver subjective. I do not really take my car to the 1.4 mile much myself although I plan on throwing in some decent money into it to get around 475-500 which is much more than any daily driver needs, but hey I like the power!

[calbert1999]

Originally Posted by HufferSS

I'd rather see a time slip than a dyno sheet any day of the week.

I'm quite the opposite because timeslips are based on a huge number of other facttors (rims, tires, driver skill, fuel type, track conditions, vehicle weight, etc...) were as the dyno displays the power gains based on some very basic mods (SC, CAM, stock or non-stock bottom end).
Regardless, though, it's relevent so I'd like to see some of those as well.

Originally Posted by Tshepp

So jealous! I want to put a s/c on my SS but I just cant pull the trigger and drop $6-8k on the setup.

Time slips are nice but they are all driver subjective. I do not really take my car to the 1.4 mile much myself although I plan on throwing in some decent money into it to get around 475-500 which is much more than any daily driver needs, but hey I like the power!

I agree on both points, it wasn't easy to shell out the g's, and if done right you have to spend much more than just the 7-8k on the blower. As for timeslips, as far as I'm concerned they're only relelevent to people who go to the dragstrip. I prefer to see the numbers.

[Padre]

I like timeslips.

If/when I go FI, what I can put down at the track is what matters. That includes issues like traction, how it will work with an automatic with high-stall torque converter, heatsoak and cooling, etc.

Guys at the track with icebags on their Whipples and waiting 30 minutes are steering me away from that.

As for the ProCharger in the picture above, what are the real world and track IATs? Does the placement of the Intake harm IATs?

Padre

[calbert1999]

Originally Posted by Padre

I like timeslips.

If/when I go FI, what I can put down at the track is what matters. That includes issues like traction, how it will work with an automatic with high-stall torque converter, heatsoak and cooling, etc.

Guys at the track with icebags on their Whipples and waiting 30 minutes are steering me away from that.

As for the ProCharger in the picture above, what are the real world and track IATs? Does the placement of the Intake harm IATs?

Padre

Believe it or not the IAT's are not affected by the placement of the intake filter. We ran the vehicle on the dyno several times (cold engine, and hot engine), IAT's were fine. One of the benefits of the ProCharger is it does not contribute to the engine heat, and does not get affected by hot engine oil or hot coolant, and regarless of were the intake is located the intercooler does an amazing job of cooling the air prior to intake. One thing I'm planning to do next is relocation of the heater hoses, we think the result of that will provide about 10 more hp's.

Thinking logically; If a roots style SC is sharing hot engine oil, and hot coolant, plus sits on top of your engine, and further contributes to heat soak while it does it's own revolutions it only makes sense that it will affect IAT's and pull timing.

One thing my techs quickly realized from their experiences of installing the roots SC vs the centri SC, is that the environmental air temps are always less than the fluids running through an engine and therefore the air will be cooler even on a scorching hot day. This was examined many times after performing dyno pulls with Maggies' vs ProChargers (on hot / humid days last summer). Now if I really wanted to increase performance I could do like the Maggie setups and implement a meth. kit, but that would be strictly to get some more power by using it as a fuel supplement. Thing is I don't even have to do that, because I can simply change pulleys if I want to increase the boost. So, meth is useless in this scenario.
The ProCharger is surely a superior product and believe me, I've got all the instant torque I can handle in the lower RPM ranges, anything more would be overkill.

[Asylum]

To the guy who posted about Times on the track..

You are aware at 700+ RWHP, applying it to the ground is the hardest part. Regardless of the type of SC you chose?


When asked what is the BEST supercharger? The debate is Coke vs Pepsi. And the answer is simple;

Which one do YOU like best.

I, like Chris like the procharger, I am also a fan of the Kenny Bell system. But to me, the BEST system is the SYSTEM I SPENT MONEY ON.... Period.

When you have 10+g's to invest into your car, you literally have the pick of the litter.. so why not pick the one you REALLY REALLY want.

[HufferSS]

Originally Posted by calbert1999

I'm quite the opposite because timeslips are based on a huge number of other facttors (rims, tires, driver skill, fuel type, track conditions, vehicle weight, etc...) were as the dyno displays the power gains based on some very basic mods (SC, CAM, stock or non-stock bottom end).
Regardless, though, it's relevent so I'd like to see some of those as well.



I agree on both points, it wasn't easy to shell out the g's, and if done right you have to spend much more than just the 7-8k on the blower. As for timeslips, as far as I'm concerned they're only relelevent to people who go to the dragstrip. I prefer to see the numbers.

Sorry guys but timeslips are the truth. Dynos can be manipulated......ets are driver dependent but mph tells the real story.

[HufferSS]

Originally Posted by Asylum

To the guy who posted about Times on the track..

You are aware at 700+ RWHP, applying it to the ground is the hardest part. Regardless of the type of SC you chose?


When asked what is the BEST supercharger? The debate is Coke vs Pepsi. And the answer is simple;

Which one do YOU like best.

I, like Chris like the procharger, I am also a fan of the Kenny Bell system. But to me, the BEST system is the SYSTEM I SPENT MONEY ON.... Period.

When you have 10+g's to invest into your car, you literally have the pick of the litter.. so why not pick the one you REALLY REALLY want.

If you are addressing me...then thank god you told me this....I never knew that traction would be an issue.

Charlie Sheen comes to mind.

I don't have a dog in the fight...I've run all kinds of forced induction from Vortech's to Prochargers to screws to nitrous.....and when anyone starts bragging about their dyno queen then the same comment will come from me....and that is what does it run.

I don't care about the ET....any simpleton knows that ET doesn't tell much of a story but mph is the truth. It can be corrected for altitude and weather conditions and is the only consistent measurement in my opinion....still not perfect but way better than a dyno sheet.

Regardless of brand.

[Padre]

Originally Posted by calbert1999

Believe it or not the IAT's are not affected by the placement of the intake filter. We ran the vehicle on the dyno several times (cold engine, and hot engine), IAT's were fine. One of the benefits of the ProCharger is it does not contribute to the engine heat, and does not get affected by hot engine oil or hot coolant, and regarless of were the intake is located the intercooler does an amazing job of cooling the air prior to intake. One thing I'm planning to do next is relocation of the heater hoses, we think the result of that will provide about 10 more hp's.

Thanks for the information. I can see you're excited about your build, congrats! I may have more questions.

Originally Posted by calbert1999

I'm quite the opposite because timeslips are based on a huge number of other facttors (rims, tires, driver skill, fuel type, track conditions, vehicle weight, etc...) were as the dyno displays the power gains based on some very basic mods (SC, CAM, stock or non-stock bottom end).

This is a common misconception. Between two diff cars and two diff drivers, yes the track will appear variable because of all the factors. But same car, same driver, testing a mod at a time, I can repeat numbers to within a quarter-MPH and quarter-tenth - back to back runs. I can also generally predict times based on known factors like DA and experiential factors like track and track prep.

Track R serious bizness for some of us.

Padre

[calbert1999]

Originally Posted by HufferSS

Sorry guys but timeslips are the truth. Dynos can be manipulated......ets are driver dependent but mph tells the real story.

Yup. More mods, more tuning, more MPH, more speed. I'm excited enough using the added power, and learning how to handle it. Eventually, I'll see some track #'s this summer but for now the driving experience is enough for me especially when nobody can keep up to me.

Originally Posted by HufferSS

If you are addressing me...then thank god you told me this....I never knew that traction would be an issue.

Charlie Sheen comes to mind.

I don't have a dog in the fight...I've run all kinds of forced induction from Vortech's to Prochargers to screws to nitrous.....and when anyone starts bragging about their dyno queen then the same comment will come from me....and that is what does it run.

I don't care about the ET....any simpleton knows that ET doesn't tell much of a story but mph is the truth. It can be corrected for altitude and weather conditions and is the only consistent measurement in my opinion....still not perfect but way better than a dyno sheet.

Regardless of brand.

If I had to guess, I'd say my vehicle is probably just as fast as any other that is configured similarily within some measure of correction. And, more tuning, tweaking can always be done to get better speed, quickness, TQ / HP's, etc....

I think for most, it's more about the driving experience than sitting on a race track waiting your turn with a bag of ice on the roots SC to get a piee of paper. My understanding of racing is man vs machine which equates to "driver skill" with similar vehicles. In my case a slower car with a better driver can and will surely beat me at the track. I do understand though for some folks their mod goals are to achieve certain #'s at the track, but that was not my focus when I stared my mod plans. For me having the dyno queen #'s simply shows the level of skill of the technicians and the quality of the SC product along with other factors of the vehicle itself which displays the value of the workmanship and confidence in the product used to achieve those power gains.

Additionally, sharing those dyno #'s I hope assists others who may want to do as I did and research the various products before making the typical choice simply because everyone else is going down a certain path.

However, I'm preparing to obtain the necessary gear so I can do some tracking this summer as well, just for the experience that is one of my goals for doing the upgrades on the vehicle I like to think of it as recreational performance driving that racing for #'s or records. Realistically, my goals are to experience that same ol'skool driving experience, and at the same time have my vehicle perform like many other high performance (boosted) vehicles and use it for a bit of weekend recreation.

Originally Posted by Asylum

To the guy who posted about Times on the track..

You are aware at 700+ RWHP, applying it to the ground is the hardest part. Regardless of the type of SC you chose?


When asked what is the BEST supercharger? The debate is Coke vs Pepsi. And the answer is simple;

Which one do YOU like best.

I, like Chris like the procharger, I am also a fan of the Kenny Bell system. But to me, the BEST system is the SYSTEM I SPENT MONEY ON.... Period.

When you have 10+g's to invest into your car, you literally have the pick of the litter.. so why not pick the one you REALLY REALLY want.

Your right on. The only think I would add is "......... so why not pick the one you REALLY REALLY want" ... "especially when it turns out to be the best performing, upgradeable, safest and most flexible option out there?"

BTW - Post up your sheet, and let me know what you thknk when you get the ride. I know you're going to be real happy.

[ADKINS PERFORMANCE]

We need to get someone setup with the turbonetics turbo kit and compare the three

[calbert1999]

Originally Posted by ADKINS PERFORMANCE

We need to get someone setup with the turbonetics turbo kit and compare the three

Yeah man. That's the spirit, that's exactly what I talking about.

I"m hoping to see the ProCharger #'s because of the various versions and differences between them, so would be nice to see turbo's too.

[ADKINS PERFORMANCE]

To see what trully is the best kit on the market if possiable to compare them all