My thoughts on the "mega thread"

[2010-1SS-IBM]

Originally Posted by 8cd03gro

What's funny to me is that you complain about other posters causing problems, but you are the first person to make any kind of aggressive or insulting statement in this thread. Interesting huh?

You have to be willfully blind to think the problems in the other cars and the Camaro vs. sections are due to moderators, and not the forum members themselves. If you take insult from that statement, so be it. Those forums are crap though, and it's not due to a bunch of Camaro owners trolling it. Most of the Camaro owners don't even go there any more because all it does is cause fights with the resident troll population.

Originally Posted by 8cd03gro

So when you sell your Camaro, even if you are forced to because of a financial crisis, will you leave this forum for good? That's what you suggest be accepted as the rule; or do you just want anyone that likes any vehicle more than the Camaro to be banned? What about Camaro owners that have Mustangs, or Camaro owners that like the Corvette, or the m3 or the s5 more than the Camaro, but can't quite afford one? Should they stop posting as well?

I have a feeling you will resort to insults and name-calling, but I thought I would finish my input before it is brought to that.

I think you should be a Camaro enthusiast if you post here. What's so hard about that? It's a nice car, and at least gives people posting something they have in common.

[8cd03gro]

Take a step back and look at the people in this thread that you are referring to. All of us have been posting here as long (take a month or two for one) or longer (myself included) than you have.

As for the mustang forums not being littered with Camaro information - when the Camaro was launched, it was at least as filled as this forum is with mustang information. That's what happens when you have an other cars section and your leading competitor was just revamped. I don't know what you expect.

Now for the IRS thing, I'm pretty sure everyone knows and agrees that IRS is an overall better design than SRA. The points that you see people make and extrapolate into the equivalent of murdering one of your family members, is that the current SRA in the mustang is not far behind a good IRS setup. With the handling abilities of the current mustang, you really can't argue that with any truth. Now, can I ask you, have you ever driven a '11 mustang? Why should your opinions and information be more valid than someone that has when you said yourself that it's stupid for people to be developing opinions and spreading information when they haven't even driven the vehicle in question?

[syr74]

Originally Posted by 2010-1SS-IBM

Get real. Most of the Mustang posters who post here are way more willfully ignorant than any of our members. But prove me wrong, see if you can get one of them to write up an honest post about an independent rear suspension, and it's benefits. If that's too hard, pick any other common car component (sunroof, or whatever) that isn't available on this year's Mustang. I've been trying for weeks now; nothing. "Solid rear axle, it's not that bad on a clean track" and "solid rear axles, they're better at the quarter mile" are about the only responses I've gotten. So much for the "car enthusiast" reasoning.

Actually, my view here is that Camaro enthusiasts often use this argument in reverse. Put simply, I frequently hear how any IRS is superior to the best SRA and as such the Camaro is obviously better than the Mustang. The problem is that this just isn't true. An IRS does indeed have more potential than a SRA, but you have to actually realize that potential in order to reap those potential advantages.

BMW and the Mac strut IFS is the best parallel example I can think of. For years you were beyond hard pressed to find a better sorted front suspension than the one offered by the M3 despite the fact that, on paper, a double wishbone IFS is theoretically superior. So how did BMW do it? Simple, their MacStrut was an superbly executed example of the same while the rival double wishbone setups were, almost universally, just good. That difference in execution forgives a lot of sins.

So yeah, there is absolutely an argument that the Mustang's SRA is superior to the Camaro's IRS based on the argument that it is better executed. And honestly, I think the counter to that, which is that IRS is superior to SRA just because, it a bit contrived and that arguments like that are how we ended up here.

[8cd03gro]

Originally Posted by 2010-1SS-IBM

You have to be willfully blind to think the problems in the other cars and the Camaro vs. sections are due to moderators, and not the forum members themselves. If you take insult from that statement, so be it. Those forums are crap though, and it's not due to a bunch of Camaro owners trolling it. Most of the Camaro owners don't even go there any more because all it does is cause fights with the resident troll population.

What are you talking about, do you even frequent those sub-forums? We're in one right now, in a thread about the mustang and there have been what, 4/8 posters (?) that own camaros and more have owned them at some point or looked into buying them.

I think you should be a Camaro enthusiast if you post here. What's so hard about that? It's a nice car, and at least gives people posting something they have in common.

I completely agree, but you don't have to own a Camaro to be a Camaro enthusiast. I don't own a damn Ferrari, but if I could, I would in a second.

[305pride]

we should put it to a vote so see how many people agree with the mega mustang thread or who dont agree with it.

[syr74]

Originally Posted by 2010-1SS-IBM

I think you should be a Camaro enthusiast if you post here. What's so hard about that? It's a nice car, and at least gives people posting something they have in common.

The problem is how you are spinning the word enthusiast. It wouldn't work and isn't remotely realistic or arguably even good for the forum.

[diddiyo]

[WiccaJew]

Originally Posted by 8cd03gro

Take a step back and look at the people in this thread that you are referring to. All of us have been posting here as long (take a month or two for one) or longer (myself included) than you have.

As for the mustang forums not being littered with Camaro information - when the Camaro was launched, it was at least as filled as this forum is with mustang information. That's what happens when you have an other cars section and your leading competitor was just revamped. I don't know what you expect.

Now for the IRS thing, I'm pretty sure everyone knows and agrees that IRS is an overall better design than SRA. The points that you see people make and extrapolate into the equivalent of murdering one of your family members, is that the current SRA in the mustang is not far behind a good IRS setup. With the handling abilities of the current mustang, you really can't argue that with any truth. Now, can I ask you, have you ever driven a '11 mustang? Why should your opinions and information be more valid than someone that has when you said yourself that it's stupid for people to be developing opinions and spreading information when they haven't even driven the vehicle in question?

Some of the mustang people (yourself included) do add a lot of information. And like you said the mustang forums was littered with camaro information when it came out. I still owned my 05 mustang when the camaro came out and it was no where close to the same amount of garbage as on this forum. And you know what the moderators did on the mustang forums. They closed reposted information and booted people who posted once saying the camaro is so much better than the mustang.
It was what should have happened here. A lot of the mustang people don't even introduce themselves or make themselves a part of the community. That is called a troll.
I do enjoy hearing information about the mustang, but it is annoying seeing 20 threads about the same information.
If you look at the postings on the mustang forums at the time of the camaro release it isn't this bad.

[assasinator]

thank god for the Z28. it will teach the 2011GT its place.

[syr74]

Originally Posted by WiccaJew

If you look at the postings on the mustang forums at the time of the camaro release it isn't this bad.

I'll agree, but then most of those forums handled the whole situation differently from the outset. I'm telling you, the difference is in the policies and how they are enforced.

theoretical example based on a real thread about a different subject.....somebody starts a thread here about the new Boss 302 and the fourth post is somebody saying 'yeah, but it's still a crap-stang and Camaro's rule....check and see what forum you are one'. Mod interaction.....nothing.

I know of a Mustang forum where that same reaction to a post about say, the new Z28, would absolutely garner that user a warning. Why? Because it's rude, that's why.

And I think that is where the buggy went astray here. Rude is rude, it shouldn't matter is they are being pro-Camaro or pro-whatever when they are being rude and, to be blunt, trolling....but here I think that how your comments are perceived in terms of pro-this or that does matter. The issue should be they are being rude and creating problems, but I think too often it isn't.

[WiccaJew]

Originally Posted by syr74

I'll agree, but then most of those forums handled the whole situation differently from the outset. I'm telling you, the difference is in the policies and how they are enforced.

theoretical example based on a real thread about a different subject.....somebody starts a thread here about the new Boss 302 and the fourth post is somebody saying 'yeah, but it's still a crap-stang and Camaro's rule....check and see what forum you are one'. Mod interaction.....nothing.

I know of a Mustang forum where that same reaction to a post about say, the new Z28, would absolutely garner that user a warning. Why? Because it's rude, that's why.

And I think that is where the buggy went astray here. Rude is rude, it shouldn't matter is they are being pro-Camaro or pro-whatever when they are being rude and, to be blunt, trolling....but here I think that how your comments are perceived in terms of pro-this or that does matter. The issue should be they are being rude and creating problems, but I think too often it isn't.

The mustang forum gave him a warning, but not the warning about someone being bluntly rude about their mustang. Its the same thing on both forums. And the rules (or close to the same) on both forums. I think the difference is on a camaro forum you can say pro-camaro trolling and be ok and on a mustang forum its pro-mustang trolling and its fine. Either way my point is there is more trolling right now and they are handling it fine. The only thing i think they need to do is close re posts instead of merging them. Just like the mustang forum. They closed three threads about the z28 picture that was showing it beating the 2011 gt500 and kept one open. Same thing they need to do here. Delete rude and obnoxious comments on both sides.

[8cd03gro]

Originally Posted by WiccaJew

The mustang forum gave him a warning, but not the warning about someone being bluntly rude about their mustang. Its the same thing on both forums. And the rules (or close to the same) on both forums. I think the difference is on a camaro forum you can say pro-camaro trolling and be ok and on a mustang forum its pro-mustang trolling and its fine. Either way my point is there is more trolling right now and they are handling it fine. The only thing i think they need to do is close re posts instead of merging them. Just like the mustang forum. They closed three threads about the z28 picture that was showing it beating the 2011 gt500 and kept one open. Same thing they need to do here. Delete rude and obnoxious comments on both sides.

I made a sticky about the '11 mustang with the admin and offered to keep the first post organized and up-to-date with any new information about the mustang. It was the perfect, simple solution to the clutter and BS, but it was deleted and the mega thread was created. Worked well, huh?

[CombatVet0311]

If you are the type of person that wants to buy a mustang, and then attempt to learn about your potential purchase on a Camaro website, then you are a dolt.

Most of the mustang guys here just seem to want acceptance and psychological coddling to support their purchase or potential purchase. If I were insecure in an investment, I would also search for acceptance from the competition to ease the blow to my psyche. Basic human nature.

I do enjoy the competitive banter though, I find the constant struggle for closure amusing.

[8cd03gro]

Originally Posted by CombatVet0311

If you are the type of person that wants to buy a mustang, and then attempt to learn about your potential purchase on a Camaro website, then you are a dolt.

Most of the mustang guys here just seem to want acceptance and psychological coddling to support their purchase or potential purchase. If I were insecure in an investment, I would also search for acceptance from the competition to ease the blow to my psyche. Basic human nature.

I do enjoy the competitive banter though, I find the constant struggle for closure amusing.