Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums - Camaro5.com
 
TireRack
Go Back   Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums - Camaro5.com > Engine | Drivetrain | Powertrain Technical Discussions > Forced Induction - V8


Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 10-11-2021, 01:14 AM   #1
Bcoy_80
 
Drives: 2010 camaro ss (ls3 manual)
Join Date: Oct 2021
Location: California bay area
Posts: 7
Cool Turbo ls3 power limits

So I recently got a 2010 camaro ss manual (ls3) and I have the option to buy a 76mm turbo for very cheap from my friend. Itís brand new and Iím highly considering it. My car has 78k miles so somewhat low milage for 11 years old. Iím still somewhat new to modifying cars and have been trying to put in a ton of research but just want to hear feedback on my ideas. Itís a sort of open ended question so any advice is appreciated.

Firstly I am going to change the cam out. I plan on keeping the rotating assembly stock as I would rather not fork out the money and time to do a full rebuild as this is my daily. I have read the assembly is very reliable and can take a lot of abuse, crank is topped at 900hp, 800 to be safe. And rods are no issue around this level as far as Iím aware. Ik the piston heads are flat top and Iíve read to stay below 230 duration as p/v clearance is a major issue. Can anyone confirm this? I will be fully rebuilding the heads with ls7 springs and trunnion rocket arm kit. I will also be doing a full cat delete and using a holly terminator

Second I will be changing it to e85 so new and bigger injectors and fuel pump. Is it possible to use the stock pump or will the e85 ruin it. I have also read the pump maxes at about 575 but have also read of people using it up to 1000hp. Has anyone maxed it out? If so what power?

Third reliability is a huge factor for me. I am planning to hit around 600hp as Iíd like to stay a bit under the supposed 650rwhp limit and have some cushion for myself. Iíve read max boost is 12psi on stock internals so id like to stay at a max of 10. With e85 cam a tune and boosted how much psi would throw me over the 650 limit? I would eventually rent a dyno and find out while tuning but just curious. Would this be relatively safe? What can I change to give myself some safety net for keeping the engine going. Iíve read up on meth and am highly considering it. I donít plan to abuse the engine and it would spend 95% of its life on low boost (probably 2-4 pounds for around town). Would just like to make sure to leave whoever I race far behind me when the challenge comes. Iíve read to replace internal seals but what else would be good preventative?

Lastly will there be any other restrictions I need to take care of as I reach the 600 rwhp? Anything expected to give out? I have read the tr 6060 is rated for 700ft of torque but have heard itís ok to go higher as long as you donít slam the transmission. With the 650 restriction Iím assuming I wonít come anywhere close to breaking it. Overall I would just like to know how to keep it reliable and make sure I know everything that must be upgraded before I break something and have an extreme headache. Any help is appreciated and Iím hoping Iíve done enough research to have a basic idea of it all, Iím going to talk to some ls shops in the area but thought Iíd reach out for some help here as well. Thanks in advance
Bcoy_80 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-11-2021, 08:39 AM   #2
CamaroCracka

 
CamaroCracka's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Turbo LS3
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Palm Bay, FL
Posts: 1,972
Stock cranks get to 1000hp fairly easily, especially if you stud the mains, but the rods and pistons are not going to live long at that level no matter how many claim to be doing it.

IMO, you don't need a different cam. A 76mm turbo is not that big and your biggest issue will be backpressure if you get toward 15# of boost. In other words, the 76mm turbo won't flow enough exhaust to make use of a big cam. A stock LS3 should be able to hit 600hp with a 76mm turbo fairly easily.

If you run E85, you will need a bigger pump for 600HP. The stock pump is not really good to 600hp on 93. I maxed a ZL1 pump at 600. Some guys say they get 650 out of those. I have a BAP to take it the rest of the way.

There is no need for meth and E85. They both serve the same purpose.

The TR6060 won't even break a sweat at that power level. If you don't plan on trying to launch from a dig on sticky tires, the diff and axles will likely live a while.

You biggest concern with a single turbo is not burning everything up in engine bay. Use lots of wrap especially around the area where everything comes into the turbo. You will need some good plug wires. I use Accel ceramic boots after trying several others. You also need to move up to a plug one level colder.

Finally, they don't make a setup guaranteed to leave the competition far behind. There are a number of guys on here who run 1000hp with really sticky tires then there are all the other platforms who have their street killers as well. In fact, given you will have to wait for boost to come in, it's entirely possible you could get beat by a well built NA car.
__________________
2010 SS - On3 kit with downpipe cutout, CTR 78/80, CompCam 239/251 620/632 122+4, and meth. Z28 suspension.

2011 Vert - 416/w 230/236 .612/.602 115lsa, 1LE suspension w/32mm rear bar. Z28 diff.
CamaroCracka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-11-2021, 09:03 AM   #3
fz4k98
 
Drives: 2013 1ss
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: WI.
Posts: 383
Tires and use will determine what and how often you break things. I added a supercharger and didnt have any breakage until I added street slicks and went to the track. that much power on stock tires is fun to drive but does not provide the traction to use the power.
fz4k98 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-11-2021, 09:45 AM   #4
RealQuick
 
Drives: 2010 Camaro 2SS M6 - Intake/Exhaust
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Bridgewater
Posts: 652
If this is your only car and you daily drive it, I wouldnt turbo it personally. Too many things that could go wrong.

That being said, I agree camarocracka, 600rwhp should be cake for the motor (even without a cam).

What turbo system are you going to run? Huron Single? Turbonetics Kit? Engine bay heat is a serious concern.

Do the fuel pump once... especially with E85... skip the ZL1 pump and get a dual pump setup.

As far as breaking stuff... anything can happen... and yes, traction and wheel hop break things.
RealQuick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-11-2021, 10:27 AM   #5
Greenhornet2

 
Greenhornet2's Avatar
 
Drives: 2011 Camaro 2SS LS3 Whipple
Join Date: May 2019
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 1,925
I agree with pretty much everything said here. You really don't need a cam to hit the number you want. You really don't need to run E to hit that number either. I see two avenues for you.
If you really will be happy at 600WHP you can go stock cam, 93 octane ZL1 pump with a voltage booster preferably, with bigger injectors.
If you will want to go further, or really just want to be able to run E go dual or triple pumps do the fuel system once.
in my research around 15 psi is where you will push coolant if the heads aren't studded. I was recommended not to go over 12psi per Jannetty. The rest will be good at 600whp. I have about 10k on my setup. I don't race at the strip or do mile long pulls though. It gets WOT in 2nd and 3rd occasionally.
__________________
Whipple 2.9 CAI ID1050x injectors ZL1 Pump JRE FPCM JMS Voltage booster JRE Rough Idle blower cam BTR .660 springs CHE trunnion kit 1 7/8 Speed Engineering Borla Atak JRE scoop 1.5" lowering springs BMR trailing arms and toe links Cradle inserts 704WHP 603WTQ 93 octane
Greenhornet2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-11-2021, 03:33 PM   #6
RupertPupkin

 
Drives: 2014 Camaro SS 1Le
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: IL
Posts: 1,240
Send that sh**… Get 700-800, and call it a day.…. Better to have and not need, than need and not have. Do it all in 1 shot, cheaper in the long run.

There’s no such thing as reliable when u start modding. Stuff can break even @ stock.
__________________
2014 SS 1LE Money Pit
Was: 802Whp/662Trq
Current: Blown Engine :(
RupertPupkin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-11-2021, 03:46 PM   #7
RealQuick
 
Drives: 2010 Camaro 2SS M6 - Intake/Exhaust
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Bridgewater
Posts: 652
FYI, I made 817rwhp/758rwtq on stock bottom end with a single 7675 turbo @ 16psi on 93 + meth.

I only went to a big motor because I needed to replace the motor in my 2004 GTO at the time. Took the LS3 out for the goat and was "forced" to by a 416ci for the camaro
RealQuick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-12-2021, 01:36 AM   #8
Bcoy_80
 
Drives: 2010 camaro ss (ls3 manual)
Join Date: Oct 2021
Location: California bay area
Posts: 7
I’m going to run a precision turbo 76mm with a turbo smart blow off and waste gate. Holly brand intercooler. So what I’ve gathered is 600 is really cake for the engine so may as well push further. My main concern is that since it’s daily driven I would like it to last a couple years atleast until I can rebuild the bottom end. I’m fully aware shit sill go wrong but I am ok as long as it’s something that can be fixed within a weekend. I don’t want to rebuild the engine or any major problems. Some things here and there are expected. I’m definitely considering heat to be my biggest concern. What is about the max hp of the stock cam? I will be changing the fuel pump to e85 regardless as it runs cooler. I will go a spark plug cooler as recommended since I won’t be changing the bottom end so the ring gap will remain stock. I would be happy with 600 but since I’m doing all this I’m probably going to push up the boost to the 12psi. If I aim for about 700rwhp, likely will want to remain a bit below it as I’d rather have a safety cushion. I won’t be WOT often especially since i only have 285 on currently and they’re almost brand new so those won’t be changed for a bit. I have also read that the ls motors are awful at getting rid of head pressure so I will be modifying that as well. So overall is the stock cam good for upwards of 700rwhp, it won’t opened up all the time so rods and heads should be alright for a good while but I’m still worried about the rings closing up with heat when I do. Any others suggestions with the current ideas?
Bcoy_80 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-12-2021, 01:39 AM   #9
Bcoy_80
 
Drives: 2010 camaro ss (ls3 manual)
Join Date: Oct 2021
Location: California bay area
Posts: 7
Oh and also if I do cam it it will only be a stage 2 Texas speed at most, p/v clearance is tight with flat top heads, but if the stock cam works will I see any benefit of rebuilding the heads? And so I won’t need meth with e85 right? I also don’t plan to stud the mains as I wouldn’t like to pull the engine. Without studding would 600-700 rwhp still be somewhat reliable on the crank? Again just want a good couple years from it without needing a rebuild
Bcoy_80 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-12-2021, 06:36 AM   #10
eLeSthree

 
Drives: 2011 Camaro SS 6sp
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Drivers Seat
Posts: 1,720
Most of your off the shelf cams will not have PTV issues, assuming you have stock LS3 pistons and stock untouched LS3 heads. Hundreds of cams to chose from.

So you're going to daily a cammed, single turbo, E85 camaro in California? Don't they have the most strict smog laws in the US?

If you ask me, if I wanted a daily driver around 600-700whp stock bottom end, it would be a PD blower. Maggie, whipple, LSA, even the E-Force could get you near 600 and be smog legal. Any of those PDs setups will probably be faster than a single turbo on the street.
__________________
TMS Dart 427 FED M311s, ESS Tuning G4 Blower, DSX Tuning Triples and FF, FIC1300, Mcleod RXT 1200HD, 1030whp 925wtq.
eLeSthree is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-12-2021, 08:01 AM   #11
CamaroCracka

 
CamaroCracka's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Turbo LS3
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Palm Bay, FL
Posts: 1,972
Lots of SBE LS3s successfully running 6-700 without studded mains. The rods and pistons are the weak link at that level. I studded my mains because I was putting in forged pistons and rods.

If you do the cam, you should upgrade the oil pump at the same time. LS3 oil pumps have an issue with the pressure relief valve sticking.

Agree with eLeSthree on the PD blower. I was planning on doing a Whipple on mine when I cam across a really cheap turbo deal. I guarantee more than a dozen times I wish I had just waited and gone with the Whipple.

Also be sure you find a good tuner. My tuner talked me into a cam upgrade that produced almost no increase in horsepower and I knew in my gut it was the small turbine that was the problem.
__________________
2010 SS - On3 kit with downpipe cutout, CTR 78/80, CompCam 239/251 620/632 122+4, and meth. Z28 suspension.

2011 Vert - 416/w 230/236 .612/.602 115lsa, 1LE suspension w/32mm rear bar. Z28 diff.

Last edited by CamaroCracka; 10-12-2021 at 08:22 AM.
CamaroCracka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-12-2021, 10:43 AM   #12
Bigdumogre

 
Bigdumogre's Avatar
 
Drives: 2012 Camaro SS
Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: New York
Posts: 1,226
Quote:
Originally Posted by RupertPupkin View Post
Send that sh**Ö Get 700-800, and call it a day.Ö. Better to have and not need, than need and not have. Do it all in 1 shot, cheaper in the long run.

Thereís no such thing as reliable when u start modding. Stuff can break even @ stock.
I know these feels now 😞. First pull on the dyno after cam install I spun a bearing. Wish I had money to build the bottom end atm but pretty much just fixing whatís wrong - new rods and bearing plus machine shop.
__________________
2012 Camaro 2SS/RS - CSP Custom Cam 232/240 .615/.615 113 +3, Texas speed CNC heads, FTI billet triple disc converter, K&N cai, Katech ported TB, GPI Ported/rod modded manifold, Texas speed 1 7/8 headers, HFC, Flowmaster 2 chambers with x pipe, Mishimoto CC, MSD wires, Roto fab washer relocation, tru cool 40k trans cooler, apex scoop, Pedders extreme coil overs and much more!!
Bigdumogre is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-12-2021, 12:03 PM   #13
Greenhornet2

 
Greenhornet2's Avatar
 
Drives: 2011 Camaro 2SS LS3 Whipple
Join Date: May 2019
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 1,925
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bcoy_80 View Post
Iím going to run a precision turbo 76mm with a turbo smart blow off and waste gate. Holly brand intercooler. So what Iíve gathered is 600 is really cake for the engine so may as well push further. My main concern is that since itís daily driven I would like it to last a couple years atleast until I can rebuild the bottom end. Iím fully aware shit sill go wrong but I am ok as long as itís something that can be fixed within a weekend. I donít want to rebuild the engine or any major problems. Some things here and there are expected. Iím definitely considering heat to be my biggest concern. What is about the max hp of the stock cam? I will be changing the fuel pump to e85 regardless as it runs cooler. I will go a spark plug cooler as recommended since I wonít be changing the bottom end so the ring gap will remain stock. I would be happy with 600 but since Iím doing all this Iím probably going to push up the boost to the 12psi. If I aim for about 700rwhp, likely will want to remain a bit below it as Iíd rather have a safety cushion. I wonít be WOT often especially since i only have 285 on currently and theyíre almost brand new so those wonít be changed for a bit. I have also read that the ls motors are awful at getting rid of head pressure so I will be modifying that as well. So overall is the stock cam good for upwards of 700rwhp, it wonít opened up all the time so rods and heads should be alright for a good while but Iím still worried about the rings closing up with heat when I do. Any others suggestions with the current ideas?
On my whipple at 12psi on stock cam it made 574whp 93 octane. You can turn up the boost but if you want to stay at 12psi I don't think you'll get to 700whp on the stock cam even on E, but maybe close enough. Heads are usually the last thing to touch on these the stocks flow incredible well and being FI means even less of a return for the $$$ invested.
Thing is. You can do the FI see how it goes on stock cam, if you're not happy. Do the cam, there's really not much labor overlap there between fuel pump, injectors and turbo install.
__________________
Whipple 2.9 CAI ID1050x injectors ZL1 Pump JRE FPCM JMS Voltage booster JRE Rough Idle blower cam BTR .660 springs CHE trunnion kit 1 7/8 Speed Engineering Borla Atak JRE scoop 1.5" lowering springs BMR trailing arms and toe links Cradle inserts 704WHP 603WTQ 93 octane
Greenhornet2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-12-2021, 12:57 PM   #14
dreksnot
Served USN - Atomic Chimp
 
dreksnot's Avatar
 
Drives: 13 Camaro LSX433 TT
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Fort Collins, CO
Posts: 1,430
I was quite happy with my simple and reliable AGP base twins kit. Smaller and quick spool 56/61's. I did have a LPE twin fuel (CTS-V pump) and ID1000's installed to support more power on E85. I was able to nail 632whp without trying. I added a KB BAP for safety and started using it for power. SBE LS3, stock cam, stock heads had better springs installed for RPMs. My final results were 745whp (16psi) and very reliable, and deadly on the street. You don't have to do much with something like what I had to get power, reliably.
__________________

In excess of 1,000WHP
LSX433 | AGP 65/65 TT | BTR Equalzer Intake | Trickflow 245cc cathedral | BTR custom cam | Cortex EBC | n2mb WOT | ID-1700x | Denso IT24 | RPM Lv 7 TR6060 | AGP's Fore Triple Fuel | Monster LT1-S Triple | 4.11 DSS Proform 9", CF driveshaft, 1400hp axles | Hurst Line Lock | MGW Retro Short Throw w/old skool Hurst T-handle | ADM solid subframe mounts | Prothane Motor Mounts | Revshift Poly Trans insert | Moreno camber/caster plates
dreksnot is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Reply

Tags
forced induction, turbo 2010 camaro ss, turbo ls3

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:30 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.