ECU upgrade

[RupertPupkin]

At what power level will the stock ECU need upgrading?

[AlanRubin]

None, an upgraded ECU would still be the same Delphi ECU, with a custom tune for your
car. It's the TUNE that makes the difference. The GT500, and the HELLCAT
cars still use their stock ECUs, they're just tuned for the superchargers. ECUs in
cars today are way more sophisticated than they used to be.

The V6 LLT cars have a Bosch ECU, that's what the Euro cars use, and they are
a pain in the ass. My VWs had the exact same ECU, and so did an Audi R8 we
worked on, in fact TWO of them one per side, it is a V10. The Bosch ECU
can only control up to 8 cylinders, two driver chips for the injectors. It's
programmed to use 3/3 for the LLT V6. With two of them on the Audi
R8, each ECU controls a bank, with additional protocals to talk to each
other to keep the engine in time and tune.

Now, an upgrade ECU for an LLT Camaro, would be the DELPHI ECU from
the LFX motor... I personally do not know anyone who has gotten the
Delphi to work on the LLT engine. IT has a few more sensor input lines,
and has the pinout for the E85 fuel sensor.

An upgraded, or Stage 1,2,3 ECU for example, would mean sending yours
out to have it tuned, and sent back..

[gtstorey]

Some ECU's have limitations built in as far as how much boost they can read/use and probably limits on other sensors and info beyond what the manufacturer intended. Some of this may just be a limitation on what HP Tuners or other software have cracked to give you access to. I'm taking my first trip in tuning with the a Cobalt SS Turbo transplanted into a kit car and the tables that HP has unlocked are limited.

Our ECU on the V8's probably have as much or more support than any other ECU. Alan is probably right, at least within almost all practical limits.

[AlanRubin]

The programming is all that is changed, without adding anything. They will only
tolerate what they're set to. So, you increase the tolerance ranges, and the
programming for A:F ratios to compensate for it, then send the tune.

If you needed to use wide-band O2 sensors, the TUNE in the ECU would be
changed to tolerate the readings from them, that would normally be outside
normal readings.

If you plan to add a sensor the ECU doesn't support, that's different. Say the 2010
SS does not have the E85 option, and won't because the pin is not there. Then
you upgrade to the 2013 one, which has E85 support. Just like the Bosch ECU
does not support E85 or a tune for it, but the Delphi one does.

Tunes will change the ranges, values, and tolerances. That is why you can go
too far with values and the car not run right or at all... Upgrading the ECU won't
change that, you would still need to tune that one with your expanded mappings.

[gsxrturbo]

THE 2010 CAMARO ecu does support e85

[AlanRubin]

Originally Posted by gsxrturbo

THE 2010 CAMARO ecu does support e85

We know...

Originally Posted by AlanRubin

None, an upgraded ECU would still be the same Delphi ECU, with a custom tune for your
car. It's the TUNE that makes the difference. The GT500, and the HELLCAT
cars still use their stock ECUs, they're just tuned for the superchargers. ECUs in
cars today are way more sophisticated than they used to be.

The V6 LLT cars have a Bosch ECU, that's what the Euro cars use, and they are
a pain in the ass. My VWs had the exact same ECU, and so did an Audi R8 we
worked on, in fact TWO of them one per side, it is a V10. The Bosch ECU
can only control up to 8 cylinders, two driver chips for the injectors. It's
programmed to use 3/3 for the LLT V6. With two of them on the Audi
R8, each ECU controls a bank, with additional protocals to talk to each
other to keep the engine in time and tune.

Now, an upgrade ECU for an LLT Camaro, would be the DELPHI ECU from
the LFX motor... I personally do not know anyone who has gotten the
Delphi to work on the LLT engine. IT has a few more sensor input lines,
and has the pinout for the E85 fuel sensor.

An upgraded, or Stage 1,2,3 ECU for example, would mean sending yours
out to have it tuned, and sent back..

Originally Posted by AlanRubin

The programming is all that is changed, without adding anything. They will only
tolerate what they're set to. So, you increase the tolerance ranges, and the
programming for A:F ratios to compensate for it, then send the tune.

If you needed to use wide-band O2 sensors, the TUNE in the ECU would be
changed to tolerate the readings from them, that would normally be outside
normal readings.

If you plan to add a sensor the ECU doesn't support, that's different. Say the 2010
SS does not have the E85 option, and won't because the pin is not there. Then
you upgrade to the 2013 one, which has E85 support. Just like the Bosch ECU
does not support E85 or a tune for it, but the Delphi one does.

Tunes will change the ranges, values, and tolerances. That is why you can go
too far with values and the car not run right or at all... Upgrading the ECU won't
change that, you would still need to tune that one with your expanded mappings.

What language do you speak, so it can be corrected for you.

[AlanRubin]

Originally Posted by gsxrturbo

THE 2010 CAMARO ecu does support e85

Also, you can SAY that all you want, I run it in my 2010 V6, at least 20%,
every work day but I have run 3/4 tank of it. It works, it runs, drives nice,
but you just don't have the tune to take advantage of it. The only way
the ECU does not support it, is to measure the ethanol content with the
sensor. Still, as it is, it will run on it, I have done it, and I still do it. I run
25% in my 2008 Mustang as well. THREE years now, and ran it in my
other cars as well, mix of 88 and E85, at least 1/4 tank.

Any car 2001 and up will run E15.

Support and Works with, are not the same.

[RupertPupkin]

So for 1000-1100 whp build stock is more than capable?

[gtstorey]

Originally Posted by AlanRubin

We know...
What language do you speak, so it can be corrected for you.

Having the ECU support it and having the sensors and pin outs are two different things. It's my understanding it has the tables to make it work correctly as flex fuel, it just isn't set up with the hardware. Again I refer back to the ECU on the ecotec LNF, it doesn't have the tables to run flex fuel tables so can be ran on what ever blend fuel you want to run but it doesn't have tables to allow it to change fueling based upon ethanol content on the go.