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Old 10-19-2016, 07:32 PM   #1
alaskacamaro
 
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An American Horror Story: Texas Speed and Performance

I have attached photos of a cylinder head that was pulled from my vehicle two weeks ago. The cylinder head was installed in late April 2016. The tech who did the install stated the heads came pre-installed with all internals and all he had to do is remove me stock heads, install the rockers and install the new heads. Immediately after the install a noticed blue puffs at startup. At first, I was told this is normal because of the tune and crappy gas that exist is Alaska. A few weeks after the install, my low engine oil light came on and a noted I was 4 quarts low. The tuner told me he must have forgotten to fill it after the tune and to check it and see if it continues. I shipped the car to Louisville, KY in mid June, I had already made plans to move there. The vehicle arrived in early July. A few weeks after I arrived I got another low engine oil warning and was again 4 quarts low (the vehicle had approximately 1500 miles on it since the install). Total engine miles were 23K.

The original turner was not sure what could be the problem (possible valve seal) since there were not visible signs of oil loss on the engine. I had a local custom shop (Dynosty) do a basic inspection on the vehicle. They told me the valve seals appeared to good but there was a lot of oil in the inake manifold and would not sure what could be the issue as well without doing a more complex internal (and costly) inspection. They recommended a catch can install, first, to see if there was excess pressure causing blowback plus a new tune. If the problem continued, they would have to take apart the heads and inspect the engine.

The can was installed and a re-tune done. They noted an odd sudden drop in power around 6K. The blue puff of smoke at start up continued as did the check engine light flashing from time to time. I contacted Texas Speed to inquire about the odd power drop (maybe a cam related issue). They did not have an explanation but when my account was looked up, the tech from Texas Speed noted the package I had purchased came with valve springs that may fail during normal operating conditions. He gave me two options, I could send the heads back and they would install the new springs or he could ship me the springs and have Dynosty install them (at my cost). At the time it would have cost me way more money to have the heads removed and shipped to Texas Speed than it would have been to have the local shop install them. I elected to have the springs shipped to me for install.

Once the springs came, Dynosty began the install. That is when I received a call from the tech that he had discovered the cause of my mysterious oil leak. The cause was a valve guide that was not staying in the head and had in fact fallen through it. In his professional opinion, this was a defect causing in the milling or casting process of the head. Since these heads were pre-assembled, it would have been difficult to noticed the issue and he noticed it only because he was installing the replacement springs.

I contacted Texas Speed to explain what had happened. They contacted Dynosty and told them to ship the head back to them so they can look at it. Dynosty would be billing me for the removal an re-install cost of the defective head but I was confident that once Texas Speed came to the same conclusion as Dynosty they would do the right thing and cover any costs associated with the bad head. I understand virtually all parts companies carry a clause that keeps liability of a company to a minimum, even with defective parts. Still, I was sure that a company like Texas Speed would do the right thing.....

I have attached the email chain between myself and a manager of Texas Speed. In the end, essentially I was told I was just lucky there were going to send me a new head, since the head I had had an out of date warranty (I have purchased the kit in April 2015 but because the only tuner I trust got injured and could not work an any vehicles for 8 months I had to wait). She emphasized they will not cover any cost for labor or other damages even if the head was sent to me defective.

As of today, when Dynosty sent me these photo's, I was told there could be internal engine damage from the debris that came from the head. He is going to pull my engine oil pan to inspect for debris.

Has this been an issue of a improper install or abuse I would not have even contacted them but this is clear issue of a defective part that has caused a lot of cost and frustration. I am sick to the core that a company would allow a customer to get stuck holding a bill for a mistake that was sent out by them.

Until this company takes more ownership in a situation like mine, I would encourage everyone to not do business with them until they make some assurances that any customer that is shipped a bad part with be handled properly and not be left holding onto a potentially enormous repair bill. Name:  IMG_9293.JPG
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James Rouleau <rouleaujames@gmail.com>
AttachmentsOct 17 (2 days ago)

to gary
Good morning Gary

We spoke almost two weeks ago concerning a cylinder head that was discovered by the local tuning shop to have a defective valve guide (improperly machined is the term he used). They have mailed the defective head to your company last week. This defect was the cause the mysterious oil loss issue I have been having since the heads were installed in May. I have attached several items to this email for you to review. Attached are a letter from me to you company explaining the history of the issue, a copy of the email correspondence between me and the original installation tuner and a copy of a bill from the local tuning shop showing the amount owned. This does not include the 1200.00 I have already spent with this shop trying to figure out what was causing the oil loss. Please review and let me know what you think.

Regards

3 Attachments


Dominic Kamas <dominic@texas-speed.com>
Oct 17 (2 days ago)

to Gary, me
Hi James

Gary made me aware of your issue and we are going to handle it for you. I do understand the heads are out of warranty, but based on your specific circumstances Gary did make an acception for you (which I agree with). We are going to have the head replaced under warranty and fix the guide issue. I'm not sure what caused the issue to begin with, it very well could have happened when they were installed or sometime afterward. All the heads are pressure checked when they leave to ensure no issues, so i would assume heat made this issue show up.

Nonetheless we are going to replace the head at no charge. As with 99% of warranties from any company, it covers our part and our labor. I do realize you did incur expense to switch the head out, but unfortunately other shop labor is not covered. Even if you head was still within the year we can't cover labor.

I do hope you understand. Please call me or Gary if you have any questions.

Dominic Kamas
Texas Speed and Performance
512-863-0900

On Mon, Oct 17, 2016 at 10:48 AM, Gary Luther <gary@texas-speed.com> wrote:



--
Thanks.

GARY LUTHER | Sales Associate | Texas Speed and Performance | www.texas-speed.com | Office 806-698-0365 | Fax 806-698-1139
This communication and any files transmitted with it may contain information that is confidential, privileged and exempt from disclosure under applicable law. It is intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify the sender. Thank you for your co-operation.


James Rouleau <rouleaujames@gmail.com>
Oct 17 (2 days ago)



James Rouleau <rouleaujames@gmail.com>
Oct 17 (2 days ago)

to Dominic
Dominic

Thank you for your prompt response.

I am aware that in most cases, warranty work covers labor to install a defective part (such as a car dealership). However, I am not near your company, unless you have someone in the Louisville KY area that is certified to cover you warranty work. Certainly the cost of shipping my car to you is not going to be very cost effective either. It is more than a little frustrating to hear your policy is to not cover any of the cost associated with part that was (in my opinion) faulty from the start. Your response stated all parts are inspected before leaving the factory and the "issue" must have became apparent after the install due to "heat"? If you reviewed my documentation I provided, this head was installed, by a very well established tuning shop, not more than 5 months ago. Now that I know what the exact issue is, this was a problem from the very start. This would have continued to be a problem had the tech locally not had to take the head off to replace (yet another possible faulty part). There is less than DD 2000 miles on the vehicle as of today and I have not been driving it at all since the valve spring issue to report to me by your company. How could have a CNC cylinder head have failed so quickly? I don't drive my car very hard and the specs were way under the tolerances.




Dominic Kamas
Oct 17 (2 days ago)

to me
James

Again, sorry that this happened to you. I want to make sure you understand that any aftermarket auto part warranty does not cover labor to install or uninstall due to defects. If the head was defective (and we are assuming it was) then we will replace or repair the part. That is what we are doing for you even though it is out of warranty. The warranty starts when you buy the parts not when it is installed. Again, we made an exception for you based on the situation.

Again, there isn't an parts manufacturer including GM that will warranty labor on a part, when you only purchase the part. We are going to help you as much as possible, but I can't cover the labor.

Below are the warranties of other LS heads in the industry...AFR and Trick Flow(Both can be found on their respective sites). Both warranties are the same as our...please not what they do not cover. I just don't want you to think we are alone in our warranty procedures.

afr heads warranty

This warranty does not cover the following:
Failure due to improper installation or maintenance, abuse, misuse, unauthorized repairs, modifications, or alterations determined at the sole discretion of AFR. If your machine shop, engine builder or installer performs any unauthorized repairs, AFR warranty is voided and AFR will not reimburse any cost you incurred.
Removal or replacement cost.
Costs incurred due to down time of the vehicle.
Damage to related components.
Marine salt water corrosion.
Corrosion from not using/refreshing antifreeze.
Fitness for purpose or merchantability.
Trickflow head warranty

This warranty does not cover:
• Failure due to improper installation or maintenance, abuse, misuse, unauthorized repairs, modifications, or alterations determined at the sole discretion of Trick Flow Specialties. If your machine shop, engine builder, or installer performs any unauthorized repairs, the warranty is voided and Trick Flow Specialties will not reimburse any cost you incurred.
• Removal or replacement costs.
• Costs incurred due to down time of the vehicle.
• Damage to related components.
• Marine salt water corrosion.
• Corrosion from not using and/or refreshing antifreeze.
• Fitness for purpose or merchantability.




James Rouleau <rouleaujames@gmail.com>
Oct 17 (2 days ago)

to Dominic
Dominic

Are you the final say in this matter? If your warranty policy covers 99% of the issues what does it take to get in that 1% that doesn't? I understand why most companies do not cover labor, because they have no control over how a part in installed and therefore there are too many variables to cover. That is the letter of the law. In this case, the head was improperly milled from you, or whoever your 3rd party was at the time. Both tuner shops assured me that this type of defect cannot happen from installation or use but was going to be defective no matter what was done. The only reason it was discovered on an engine with 23K miles was the tech was trying really hard to figure out the oil loss problem, and all the oil building up in the intake and valves.

As a custom parts company, you should make every attempt to make a situation like this right, to include covering the cost of all the issues that happened because of a defective part that was manufactured directly from the factory. This would be the spirit of the law in regards to you warranty policies. Has this been a bad seal or some other component that would have been installed correctly, I wouldn't have even bothered you but the problems and cost I have faced are directly because of a faulty part that was somehow missed in QC.

I am a very active member in several car clubs and forums. As I am sure you know, Kentucky is a car friendly state. I went to your company because quite a few people raved on your products quality and your willingness to stand behind it. Selling a defect part, then telling a customer that the warrant doesn't cover any costs other than replacement is just plain wrong. If a part you sold someone caused catastrophic damages and was later determined to be a fault from the manufacturing process are you going to just tell that customer, sorry but we don't cover those damages?

I have worked with several companies that have made a practice of making things right, even if that means taking a slight hit in a profit. It means keeping a customer base confident in the company they support. I was given to understand this is how your company worked as well. Was I wrong?

Just so we are clear, Texas Speed and Performance will not; under any circumstances, cover costs associated with a documented defective part they have sold to a customer which may have caused damages and undo costs to be incurred.


Dominic Kamas
Oct 18 (1 day ago)

to me
James

To be very clear so you can better understand. this is the way this has gone down.

We send you a head that was perfectly fine when it left here. It absolutely did not have the issue it has now. This was not a defective part that was just sent out as you claim. Somewhere between March of 2015 when you purchased it, and now something happened to head to cause the problem it does have. If you give a couple weeks more I can try to track down what may have caused the problem. It could be a wide variety of things. Instead of putting you through the waiting of trying to find the problem, we decided to go ahead and just replace the head regardless of fault. (It very well could have been a casting flaw that didn't show for a few hundred miles)

If you would like to tell everyone about your experience online, please do. As long as you give the truth of the situation I'm sure most would be happy with the outcome if they were customers.

Your head was out of warranty ( I warrantied anyways)
You can claim the head was defective and nothing you did (took your word and replaced the head)
You want us to cover labor, something nobody in the industry does and threaten to bad mouth me if I don't give you what you want. ( I explain we don't cover labor, but will cover our product)

I would be more than happy to post our email chain and what we have done to stand behind our product if you choose that road. I'm sorry if you don't agree with the way every product is warrantied. PRC Heads have a proven track record of reliability and performance. Yours had an issue, an issue that I'm resolving for you very quickly and easily. Yet you still feel the need to threaten to attack our image if it is not done to your satisfaction. This is the part I don't agree with, but you are welcome to do what you feel is necessary.

To answer your first question, yes I am the final say, and I'm sorry you feel like we didn't do our job. I feel the exact opposite.
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Old 10-19-2016, 07:41 PM   #2
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Wow, you have me buggin now.... im having the same issue here with oil consumption. PRC heads milled .020... i went as far as replacing the valve seals but it looks as if im still having a issue. Gonna reroute my catchcan lines and hope it goes away but now im worried..... best of luck man! Mine only have 5k miles on them and were purchased in july of this year. I hope they r not suffering from the same or similar issue..... hmmmm
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Old 10-19-2016, 07:44 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by VvtBEAST View Post
Wow, you have me buggin now.... im having the same issue here with oil consumption. PRC heads milled .020... i went as far as replacing the valve seals but it looks as if im still having a issue. Gonna reroute my catchcan lines and hope it goes away but now im worried..... best of luck man! Mine only have 5k miles on them and were purchased in july of this year. I hope they r not suffering from the same or similar issue..... hmmmm
I would have them pulled and inspected. I did not think (at the time) the issue would be caused by a faulty milled head but that is what I was told. Now I am on pins a needles wondering if there is engine damages.
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Old 10-19-2016, 07:58 PM   #4
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Crazy part is it seems to be on 2 cylinders, 3&5. I will inspect the issue some more,thanks!
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Old 10-19-2016, 08:05 PM   #5
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I've seen PRC heads failing a lot lately. Sorry for your troubles OP.
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Old 10-19-2016, 08:12 PM   #6
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Oh wow. I was considering ordering parts from them. I mean the complaints are few and far between, but knowing that if a situation like this were to occur, they won't do anymore than replace the faulty part? What if your engine got obliterated? If you can provide documented evidence that the failure and damages caused to the engine were completely their fault, I would be extremely disappointed to learn they wont cover their own mistake. If you make a crap part and potentially destroy a customers engine because of said crap part, you better do everything in your power to right that wrong. Otherwise they care more about profit and not sh*t about customer service.

Had you posted this exact same thread with Texas Speed profusely apologizing and agreeing to cover all damages cost as long as provided with the correct documentation, that would have set them a part from the competition in huge ways. Disappointing to hear. Sorry about your troubles OP, hope everything turns out alright for you.
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Old 10-19-2016, 08:17 PM   #7
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i think they did you right. YOU chose to put high performance heads on your car.quit your whining and thank your blessings it wasn't worse.
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Old 10-19-2016, 08:23 PM   #8
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That does suck. But, shit happens. ....you play, you pay.
Good luck
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Old 10-19-2016, 08:40 PM   #9
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i think they did you right. YOU chose to put high performance heads on your car.quit your whining and thank your blessings it wasn't worse.
Agreed. And they are covering an out of warranty part. Probably should have waited till you had the new head before talking sh1t about them online. Good luck.
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Old 10-19-2016, 08:49 PM   #10
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Agreed. And they are covering an out of warranty part. Probably should have waited till you had the new head before talking sh1t about them online. Good luck.
Had this part failed due abuse or improper installation I would agree. The issue I have is in the part having a milled defect and not detected until after damages were done. If you were to buy something and it caused damages because of a defect in construction, would you be okay with a company tell you its not their fault and the cost is on you to fix?
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Old 10-19-2016, 09:18 PM   #11
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At least they are doing that. I know 2 locals that had heads fail first time they saw power and TSP didn't do anything for them.
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Old 10-19-2016, 09:35 PM   #12
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At least they are doing that. I know 2 locals that had heads fail first time they saw power and TSP didn't do anything for them.
I just so surprised by this. For years I saw nothing but praise for Texas Speed and several other quality companies. Had a bought on Bubba's discount auto sales or Jimmy under the highway overpass I would expected these kinds of things....
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Old 10-19-2016, 10:37 PM   #13
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Been in the parts business for many years. Not hot rod related, directly. Replacing the part and not the labor is pretty standard procedure. Otherwise, the company that made the part is paying tows, per diem and on and on. Most warranties have language about "limited liability" covering "manufacturers defects." It just gets too convoluted otherwise.
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Old 10-20-2016, 12:48 AM   #14
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