About to Sea Foam my engine, questions - Sea Foam's Response!

[DonM]

My LFX just turned 70,300 miles (no catch can) and I feel it's time to do a little cleaning. It's too cold & I don't have the time to do a full "intake off" manual cleaning, so I read up (on this site and others) about using Sea Foam. I was planning on 2 cans in the tank, filling up and in a few days spraying a can down through the throttle body.

My only real concern is that some users have said they get a CEL after using it through the intake. They do mention however that it goes away after the "hot soak" & "hot" driving afterwards. Too one of them mentioned cleaning the MAF sensor ... that I don't know how to do or what to use. Any suggestions?

[O.F.]

There is a MAF spray available. I'll guess brake cleaner is the same. Remove your MAF and spray it. It evaporates quickly.

[ChibiBlackSheep]

Seafoam in the gas tank doesn't do much for our direct injection engines. The valves don't get covered in fuel.

I also wouldn't do it through the intake, because you don't want to dislodge large parts into the valves. Since the engine has such high mileage, I would really only recommend leaving it alone, or getting the manual cleaning done.

MAF like mentioned, super easy to clean. Just remove the bolts, hit it with MAF cleaner spray, let it dry for 10 minutes, reinstall. I do this every other oil change (or whenever I rotate my tires)

[Elite Engineering]

Do NOT do a solvent based engine running cleaning EVER on a GDI engine. The deposits are not the soft carbon of past port injection engines but a very hard crystalline sand like make up form the much higher heat the valves operate under. While most of the debris loosened is expelled out the exhaust, some is always forced down between the pistons and cylinder walls like pour some sand in your intake! The scouring may be minor, but is damage still the same. Also, in your tank it is doing nothing as it touches nothing in the engine that carbons up. It can help keep injectors clean, but top tier fuel is safer and steady.


The other thing is at most it loosens app. 20% of the deposits not truly cleaning. ONLY a proper manual cleaning will safely clean the deposits.


Here is a good video explaining the crushed walnut shell method:


The video is only incorrect on using a soft brush, There is no damage can occur from a stiff metal brush.

[olblue75]

I wonder if a BMW dealer would do this to a non-BMW?

[polizzio]

His finished product in the above video is impressive. And those valves had about 74k miles on the engine. With all we have seen and learned on GDI engines and oil contamination since 2010, I don't think the slight performance and mileage gains of the GDI design are worth it. I really wish my LFX was port FI.

Oh and I want to mention even with an aftermarket oil separator (catch can, which is not 100% effective), there is oil lubricating the valves stems and valve guides passing on to the back of valves/intake tract. Small volume but collective over long term operation/life of engine. Oil is not only coming from PCV (blow by).

[DonM]

I know that ... I really do, but I'm starting to get desperate. I asked one member of the forum if he would do mine like he did his and offered a full exterior detail + some cash, but he wasn't comfortable working on someone else's car. I was even willing to drive to the next state over to meet him.

Locally, there is only one shop I know of that I trust to do the work, but they quoted $800 +/- (opting to estimate high rather than give an estimate, then have to charge more that what they originally said). And I just can't swing that.

Lastly, I just don't have the self-confidence to do it myself. I don't have the greatest history of working on my cars. I've pulled intakes on a few of my older cars (a '72 Dodge V8 and an '83 305 Camaro), BUT I had help from someone who knew what they were doing.

I know that walnut blasting is the "magic bullet" for cleaning intakes, but does anyone know of a "magic sling shot" that could help the issue a little? Or a shop in the NE Ohio area that can do the job more reasonably? Like mentioned, I'm even willing to take a little road trip to have it done.

Originally Posted by Elite Engineering

Do NOT do a solvent based engine running cleaning EVER on a GDI engine. The deposits are not the soft carbon of past port injection engines but a very hard crystalline sand like make up form the much higher heat the valves operate under. While most of the debris loosened is expelled out the exhaust, some is always forced down between the pistons and cylinder walls like pour some sand in your intake! The scouring may be minor, but is damage still the same. Also, in your tank it is doing nothing as it touches nothing in the engine that carbons up. It can help keep injectors clean, but top tier fuel is safer and steady.


The other thing is at most it loosens app. 20% of the deposits not truly cleaning. ONLY a proper manual cleaning will safely clean the deposits.


Here is a good video explaining the crushed walnut shell method:


The video is only incorrect on using a soft brush, There is no damage can occur from a stiff metal brush.

[ChibiBlackSheep]

Originally Posted by DonM

I know that ... I really do, but I'm starting to get desperate.

Can I ask why you are getting desperate? Are you actually running into an issue, or do you just want to clean it?

Personally I read your request, and thought you just wanted to do it because seafoam is easy, and you are trying preventative maintenance, but not having any engine issues.

Or, are you experiencing engine issues?

Finally, if you wanted to do it cheap, removing the intake isn't difficult, and you can just wipe things down, and reinstall. That will help clean it up some and not cost a bunch.

[DonM]

Maybe paranoid is a better word than desperate. The seeming million posts about the crud build up and the cumulative effects of it. I would LOVE to be able to take the time and do it myself with a walnut blaster, but like I said ... insecurity. As for engine issues, maybe I'm being paranoid again, but (to me) it seems like it isn't starting quite as fast as it did when I first got the car. Too, I've dropped like 2 - 2.5 mpg I was getting ~26 City/Highway Ave, now it's ~24 mpg city/highway (mostly highway) and BTW, the MPG read out in the DIC is pretty accurate. Maybe the MPG is just because I've started to drive the car a little more aggressively... not much just a few more downshifts to goose the speedometer a little.

I'm VERY OCD when it comes to my car and knowing the build up IS real and can cause problems, I simply want it gone.

Originally Posted by ChibiBlackSheep

Can I ask why you are getting desperate? Are you actually running into an issue, or do you just want to clean it?

Personally I read your request, and thought you just wanted to do it because seafoam is easy, and you are trying preventative maintenance, but not having any engine issues.

Or, are you experiencing engine issues?

Finally, if you wanted to do it cheap, removing the intake isn't difficult, and you can just wipe things down, and reinstall. That will help clean it up some and not cost a bunch.

[polizzio]

DonM, if ur referencing the Sea Foam instructional on here from a couple years back, don't do it. Introducing gobs of SF into the intake to the point of the engine shutting down, and some of the other techniques one guy endorsed is just plum stupid. Hydro-locking and engine, even one cylinder, can do severe damage. Not to mention chunks of abrasive deposits going into the cylinders. Some of the peeps here come up with some crazy shit, some out of pure ignorance. Like the recent spat of a few peeps ignoring recommended chevy maintenance schedules.

If you have no immediate issues, misfires, or codes, don't panic or rush. First order of business is to install a good catch can on the PVC line to intake. Chunking gobs of SeaFoam liquid down the intake, or into the cylinders IS NOT smart.

I have 57k miles on my LFX and my fuel mileage is dropping too. I mean like probably 10-15% since new. But she still purrs, no misfires, no codes ever, nor driving issues. i have a catch can, installed it @ approx 26k.

[ChibiBlackSheep]

Originally Posted by DonM

it seems like it isn't starting quite as fast as it did when I first got the car.

It's a 2013, and now it's currently 2018. Battery life is roughly 5 years, and you live in OH, so I'm going to assume it's been cold. I would buy a battery before I paid a shop $800 for cleaning the valves.

Originally Posted by DonM

I've dropped like 2 - 2.5 mpg I was getting ~26 City/Highway Ave, now it's ~24 mpg city/highway (mostly highway)

Again, it's winter-time. You are supposed to lose roughly that MPG in the winter cold weather and on winter gas.

Have you owned the car since new? Did you track MPG other years and see it change in the winter and get better in the spring/summer?

[DonM]

Originally Posted by ChibiBlackSheep

It's a 2013, and now it's currently 2018. Battery life is roughly 5 years, and you live in OH, so I'm going to assume it's been cold. I would buy a battery before I paid a shop $800 for cleaning the valves.


Again, it's winter-time. You are supposed to lose roughly that MPG in the winter cold weather and on winter gas.

Have you owned the car since new? Did you track MPG other years and see it change in the winter and get better in the spring/summer?

I don't mean it cranks slower, it just takes a few seconds longer to fire.

Not since new, but I've tracked it since I've owned it and it's stayed fairly steady at 25.5+ mpg. You're right though, it's a cold winter and that will affect things. I'm so wishing to do SOMETHING to my car ... intake, sway bar, strut brace etc, but it's not in the budget, so I'm driving myself crazy trying to think of preventative maintenance things I can do (or talk the wife into letting me have done). But it's a pain being a single income family.

[sherob]

Yeah, winter formulated gas will hit your mileage.

[ChibiBlackSheep]

Originally Posted by DonM

I don't mean it cranks slower, it just takes a few seconds longer to fire.

Not since new, but I've tracked it since I've owned it and it's stayed fairly steady at 25.5+ mpg. You're right though, it's a cold winter and that will affect things. I'm so wishing to do SOMETHING to my car ... intake, sway bar, strut brace etc, but it's not in the budget, so I'm driving myself crazy trying to think of preventative maintenance things I can do (or talk the wife into letting me have done). But it's a pain being a single income family.

I truthfully think you are fine. Have you removed the TB and shined a light into your intake? Maybe it's not as dirty as you think?

I know it's tough on a single-income family, but you should totally enjoy the car as is. Even as a base-model, these are super fun cars.

The best thing you can do, is try to put aside money each month into an emergency fund, and be ready just in case something happens