[Fraxum]

I did just that after doing after upgrading my 2016 2SS M6 to a mid 11 second car at Atco. I sold the SS in 2 days. I later sold the A10 ZL1 and ordered my M6 Lt1. My favorite car ever!

[s346k]

Originally Posted by raptor5244

That said, you won't really turn a SS 1LE into a ZL1 unless you spend the money for all the stuff that makes them different and unless you can do all the work yourself it is probably going to cost more in the long run. However, if you enjoy the modding process it then nobody can put a price on that except you.

- LT4 with forged internals to support the supercharger
- A10 Transmission - 10L80 vs. 10L90, which is more beefed up and tuned to handle the LT4.
- Tremec 6060 - Different gearing and torque ratings to handle the extra power. I believe the ZL1 clutch may be upgraded as well?
- Bigger brakes on the ZL1 to support the increased weight.
- Front facia and hood to support the extra cooling for the supercharged V8.
- Factory warranty, you know in case that oil pump decides to explode.

i think for some people, that is a good thing. if i recall correctly, an ss 1LE is more nimble to start with. turning and braking both. it's going to take at least +70 hp for a ZL1 to pace a na ss 1LE in a straight line.

the clutches are the exact same
1-4 trans gearing? who will notice it?
a 1LE already stops better than a ZL1, why change brakes?

if moving from a regular ss car i see the zl1 as a huge upgrade. coming from a ss 1LE...? no. a not even equal power ss 1LE will eat a comparable ZL1s lunch anywhere, anytime. turning, stopping, going whatever.

ZL1s are cool cars and offer only the highest of trailer park camaro interior comforts. they just don't perform very well in comparison.

[Chutzpah]

Originally Posted by FlukeSS

Everyone says you have no warranty. Only repeating what everyone says. But its not always true, the hard part is fighting it.

Some people just don't want the hassle of fighting it I guess.

In my case I have access to a mechanic who's gone against GM and Dealerships trying to void warranties and proving them wrong. So I guess I have an advocate in that regard someone I can get a second opinion from.

And I actually already got into that debate with a dealership a day or two ago. And they admitted they have to honor the warranty unless they can "prove" the fault is caused by an aftermarket part. That is what court case documentation shows in regards to the MM Act.

Maybe you have a somewhat reasonable dealer.

From my experience, service writers know very little about cars, except for what the tech tells them (and most techs aren’t all that great). If a tech thinks the problem is going to be a pain in ass, regardless of not having anything to do with a “mod”, he’s just going to push that car out of the shop and use the “mod” as his reason. End of story. And to follow that premise, I know for certain if I brought up the MM act in reference to a mod not affecting the warranty, I’d be laughed out of the dealership and put on their special “list” (for their favorite people, of course).

If I have to fight with someone to work on my car (IE dealer, because of a mod),
I’d much rather bring my car to an independent and competent shop, at my cost. Fighting with a dealer is akin to fighting with a guy that’s going to cook your food…

[FlukeSS]

Originally Posted by Chutzpah

Maybe you have a somewhat reasonable dealer.

From my experience, service writers know very little about cars, except for what the tech tells them (and most techs aren’t all that great). If a tech thinks the problem is going to be a pain in ass, regardless of not having anything to do with a “mod”, he’s just going to push that car out of the shop and use the “mod” as his reason. End of story. And to follow that premise, I know for certain if I brought up the MM act in reference to a mod not affecting the warranty, I’d be laughed out of the dealership and put on their special “list” (for their favorite people, of course).

If I have to fight with someone to work on my car (IE dealer, because of a mod),
I’d much rather bring my car to an independent and competent shop, at my cost. Fighting with a dealer is akin to fighting with a guy that’s going to cook your food…

Fair point.

Not saying it would be a clean fight it won't be, but if there was a $15,000 engine replacement to be made and they can't prove it in court, they have to honor the warranty. That is what the MM Act is for and how it has been interpreted so far.

[arpad_m]

Originally Posted by SATINSTEEL1LE

Its a 5/60 on the powertrain. LOL. You all joke until you need a $15k longblock and its covered under warranty.

The ZL1 is the correct choice. The SS to ZL1 mod path is for those that couldnt afford a ZL1 to start with.

I could've bought several ZL1s if I'd wanted to, but decided to get an SS and mod it, make it mine and cherish it for a long time.

This is some very shallow thinking here.

[raptor5244]

Originally Posted by s346k

ZL1s are cool cars and offer only the highest of trailer park camaro interior comforts. they just don't perform very well in comparison.

Hmm, the ZL1 (non-1LE) was more than 2 seconds quicker than the SS 1LE around Willow Springs. There is no question that the SS 1LE is the best bang for the buck but saying the ZL1 doesn't perform well is kinda of crazy.

https://www.motortrend.com/reviews/2...e-squad-goals/

[USAFS197]

Originally Posted by raptor5244

Hmm, the ZL1 (non-1LE) was more than 2 seconds quicker than the SS 1LE around Willow Springs. There is no question that the SS 1LE is the best bang for the buck but saying the ZL1 doesn't perform well is kinda of crazy.

https://www.motortrend.com/reviews/2...e-squad-goals/

It shouldn't be surprising to anyone, all things withstanding, that on a track where the car can stretch its legs, the ZL1 will be quicker than the SS 1LE. If you look at Throttle House and their records, the SS 1LE on Cup 2's (1:11.58) is shockingly close to the ZL1 1LE (1:11.12) around their test track. Granted, you can argue the tire differences but, I think it is more of a testament to how well sorted the SS 1LE is. I'd bet money that with similar horsepower, albeit less torque than the ZL1 or ZL1 1LE, with equal drivers, the SS 1LE will match or beat those cars on the same tires.

[LT1ornothing]

Originally Posted by USAFS197

It shouldn't be surprising to anyone, all things withstanding, that on a track where the car can stretch its legs, the ZL1 will be quicker than the SS 1LE. If you look at Throttle House and their records, the SS 1LE on Cup 2's (1:11.58) is shockingly close to the ZL1 1LE (1:11.12) around their test track. Granted, you can argue the tire differences but, I think it is more of a testament to how well sorted the SS 1LE is. I'd bet money that with similar horsepower, albeit less torque than the ZL1 or ZL1 1LE, with equal drivers, the SS 1LE will match or beat those cars on the same tires.

100%, a heads and cam SS 1LE will give a ZL1 or ZL1 1LE trouble at the track. If it is a hot day, the SS 1LE will pull away after a few laps when the ZL1 and ZL1 1LE start to heat soak and pull timing.

[s346k]

Originally Posted by raptor5244

Hmm, the ZL1 (non-1LE) was more than 2 seconds quicker than the SS 1LE around Willow Springs. There is no question that the SS 1LE is the best bang for the buck but saying the ZL1 doesn't perform well is kinda of crazy.

https://www.motortrend.com/reviews/2...e-squad-goals/

i am referring to a modded 1LE vs stock ZL1. id hope stock for stock that 200+ hp on the same tire would do something for a ZL1.

[raptor5244]

Originally Posted by s346k

i am referring to a modded 1LE vs stock ZL1. id hope stock for stock that 200+ hp on the same tire would do something for a ZL1.

Understood, I have owned both. I prefer the balance of the SS 1LE but love the extra low end torque of the ZL1. My ZL1 is a street car with crappy roads and lots of traffic so I will never hit the limits of either of these cars anyway. I just enjoy the supercharger whine and short blasts on the highway on-ramps.

[ST1LE]

Originally Posted by raptor5244

Understood, I have owned both. I prefer the balance of the SS 1LE but love the extra low end torque of the ZL1. My ZL1 is a street car with crappy roads and lots of traffic so I will never hit the limits of either of these cars anyway. I just enjoy the supercharger whine and short blasts on the highway on-ramps.

Damn it raptor, I was leaning 1LE all day until this post.

[raptor5244]

Originally Posted by ST1LE

Damn it raptor, I was leaning 1LE all day until this post.

I know you are on the fence but if you can comfortably afford it, get the ZL1. You need to get that factory supercharged V8 you want before they go extinct.

If you feel you prefer an SS 1LE later on, I doubt you will, then trade it. They should hold their value pretty good thanks to inflation and lack of supply. Remember, all these V8s are basically being outlawed and we will be heading in to e-muscle soon.

If you want to mod you can still do so on the ZL1 but this car is ridiculous fast for the street as it comes. This is the first car I have ever owned where I don't desire more power. It is the extra 200lb ft. of torque at just 3600rpm that will put the smile on your face.

The ZL1 is about $15k more than a 2SS 1LE but you don't lose all that delta when you sell it. No one has a crystal ball but I think ZL1s, Hellcats, GT500s are all going to hold their value pretty well. End of an era.

[ST1LE]

Originally Posted by raptor5244

I know you are on the fence but if you can comfortably afford it, get the ZL1. You need to get that factory supercharged V8 you want before they go extinct.

If you feel you prefer an SS 1LE later on, I doubt you will, then trade it. They should hold their value pretty good thanks to inflation and lack of supply. Remember, all these V8s are basically being outlawed and we will be heading in to e-muscle soon.

If you want to mod you can still do so on the ZL1 but this car is ridiculous fast for the street as it comes. This is the first car I have ever owned where I don't desire more power. It is the extra 200lb ft. of torque at just 3600rpm that will put the smile on your face.

The ZL1 is about $15k more than a 2SS 1LE but you don't lose all that delta when you sell it. No one has a crystal ball but I think ZL1s, Hellcats, GT500s are all going to hold their value pretty well. End of an era.

It's really a testament to the 1LE, it's just so damn good. Its a $17K difference between the 2 with no other options, but I could be completely content with a 1SS 1LE if I didn't go ZL1, so its possibly a $22k difference for MY '23. 1SS 1LE is just an insane value.

I also think all three of the big boys will continue to have relatively high resale, I just don't see the demand dropping and the supply is about to end.

Fear of regret will likely have me buy the ZL1, and they're tough to come by now so I will buy it when my name comes up on the list next spring and downgrading is always an option like you said.

[ckt227]

Originally Posted by raptor5244

Understood, I have owned both. I prefer the balance of the SS 1LE but love the extra low end torque of the ZL1. My ZL1 is a street car with crappy roads and lots of traffic so I will never hit the limits of either of these cars anyway. I just enjoy the supercharger whine and short blasts on the highway on-ramps.

Couldn't agree more. The supercharger whine is just sick on a ZL1.