(Yet Another) Convertible top issue - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

nazarah · 11-07-2019, 08:07 AM

Here we go again!

I've searched for this one, and can't find a thread pertaining to this particular issue. So thought I'd see if you all had some ideas. It's on a 2013 ZL1.

I've made sure the thing in the trunk is in proper position. I've made sure the trunk is fully closed. Here is what happens.

You unlatch the top like normal, and press the button to retract. It begins to move. No messages in the DIC. It gets about 1/3rd of the way up, and then stops. If you take a momentary pause, bring it down just the slightest bit and continue to go back up, it will go the next 2/3rd of the way. Then with another pause, down just a tiny bit and back up and it goes the rest of the way up.

Rinse and repeat coming back up to close it.

Any ideas?

sbubbaklein · 11-07-2019, 08:19 AM

do you have the engine running? Is it just battery power getting low. Do you have your foot on the brake, possibly poor brake switch connection.

nazarah · 11-07-2019, 08:42 AM

I had the engine off. I'll try it again with the engine running and foot on the brake - perhaps you are correct. Thank you for the recommendation!

samman11 · 11-07-2019, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nazarah

I had the engine off. I'll try it again with the engine running and foot on the brake - perhaps you are correct. Thank you for the recommendation!

I don't know about the foot on the brake thing, as that's not required on my 2011, but I always have the car running. That top motor takes a lot of power.

kpeters59 · 11-09-2019, 12:35 AM

Sounds an awful lot like what I was trying to describe here:

https://www.camaro5.com/forums/showp...4&postcount=10

Also, my top stops moving several times going both up and down. It started doing that pretty soon after I started noticing the wet back floor. Is that related?

It has a VERY regular pattern to it. It seems to be able to move for exactly 5 seconds and stops. Going up, I just release and re-press the button and it continues. Going down, I have to briefly press up and then continue down and it goes all the way down after about 5 of those. I assume there's some kind of sensor that's not working, so the controller turns off the motor, or worse, the motor is shutting off most likely due to heat. Anybody with any idea why that's happening? Is it related to the 5th Bow issue?

I'd guess that either some kind of movement sensor is not sending its signal properly or the motor is getting hot and going in to emergency mode or something.

Going up it does not require that I briefly change directions to get it to continue.

Going down, it stops 5 times. Going up, more. I think 'cause it's harder to go up.

Anybody else?

-KP

nazarah · 11-12-2019, 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kpeters59

Sounds an awful lot like what I was trying to describe here:

https://www.camaro5.com/forums/showp...4&postcount=10

Also, my top stops moving several times going both up and down. It started doing that pretty soon after I started noticing the wet back floor. Is that related?

It has a VERY regular pattern to it. It seems to be able to move for exactly 5 seconds and stops. Going up, I just release and re-press the button and it continues. Going down, I have to briefly press up and then continue down and it goes all the way down after about 5 of those. I assume there's some kind of sensor that's not working, so the controller turns off the motor, or worse, the motor is shutting off most likely due to heat. Anybody with any idea why that's happening? Is it related to the 5th Bow issue?

I'd guess that either some kind of movement sensor is not sending its signal properly or the motor is getting hot and going in to emergency mode or something.

Going up it does not require that I briefly change directions to get it to continue.

Going down, it stops 5 times. Going up, more. I think 'cause it's harder to go up.

Anybody else?

-KP

YES - that is exactly it!

I tried it again this past weekend. Car was running, foot on brake, trunk thing pulled all the way out, trunk closed securely. Still had to do the back and forth game to get it to go up. Still no idea about what is happening.

nazarah · 11-13-2019, 03:32 PM

Could this be as simple as the switch up front beginning to fail?

I have been trying to find a wiring diagram that includes the convertible top functions but have not found anything as of yet. I really have only a basic idea of how these things work.

Does the full power to the motor on the pump run through the switch, or is the switch controlling a relay?

kpeters59 · 11-13-2019, 07:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nazarah

Could this be as simple as the switch up front beginning to fail?

No way.

It's WAY too consistent.

I'm pretty sure it's the exact same amount of time on every button push.

I'd guess it's 5 seconds.

Does anybody have a copy of (or access to) the control circuit schematic? I'd bet there's some kind of motion sensor that's not providing output (or input to the controller) and after 5 seconds it just stops. Probably damaged by the stupid leaking 5th bow issue.

Quote:

Originally Posted by nazarah

Does the full power to the motor on the pump run through the switch, or is the switch controlling a relay?

I seriously doubt that. There has to be a relay. And more.

-KP

nazarah · 11-15-2019, 07:51 AM

Still spending my free time looking for a schematic that covers all of the electrical components included with the top. Might be time to break down and order factory service manuals.

sbubbaklein · 11-15-2019, 09:45 AM

go to acdelcotds.com and select subscription, then scroll to service information and select 4 day for $15

nazarah · 11-18-2019, 08:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sbubbaklein

go to acdelcotds.com and select subscription, then scroll to service information and select 4 day for $15

Ah - NICE! I'll check that out today. Thanks!

kpeters59 · 11-29-2019, 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nazarah

Ah - NICE! I'll check that out today. Thanks!

Were you able to get some documents downloaded? That I might be able to leech off of?

Does anybody know where the Convertible Top Control Module resides? And removal procedure?

I suspect mine's gotten wet from GM's big snafu, so I'll need to source a replacement. Or, maybe fix the original?

-KP

Deputy347k9 · 11-30-2019, 05:49 AM

Not sure how well this picture will come out being the print is so small. I have a set of 2013 service manuals.

Deputy347k9 · 11-30-2019, 06:15 AM

Notes from 2013 F/Car serfide manual Volume 4/4, page 12-93

Power folding top description and operation: Overview: The operation of the convertible top is semi-automatic. The user of the vehicle manually latches and unlatches the convertible top while hydraulic power actuation provides the force to raise and lower the top. The electrical position of the power convertible top system consists of the following:
1. folding top control module
2. header latch position switch
3. folding top control switch
4. luggage barrier sensor
5. folding top position sensor
6. folding top pump motor

There are following paragraphs that give a basic description of each component.

11-07-2019, 08:07 AM	#1
nazarah Drives: 2004 Dodge Viper Join Date: Oct 2019 Location: Omaha Posts: 66	(Yet Another) Convertible top issue Here we go again! I've searched for this one, and can't find a thread pertaining to this particular issue. So thought I'd see if you all had some ideas. It's on a 2013 ZL1. I've made sure the thing in the trunk is in proper position. I've made sure the trunk is fully closed. Here is what happens. You unlatch the top like normal, and press the button to retract. It begins to move. No messages in the DIC. It gets about 1/3rd of the way up, and then stops. If you take a momentary pause, bring it down just the slightest bit and continue to go back up, it will go the next 2/3rd of the way. Then with another pause, down just a tiny bit and back up and it goes the rest of the way up. Rinse and repeat coming back up to close it. Any ideas?

11-07-2019, 08:19 AM	#2
sbubbaklein Drives: early 2011 Camaro convertible Join Date: Jul 2014 Location: House Springs, Mo Posts: 2,002 View My Garage	do you have the engine running? Is it just battery power getting low. Do you have your foot on the brake, possibly poor brake switch connection. __________________ Early 2011 LT Convertible, ZL1 bumper, hood, side skirts, belly pan and wheels, Truecarbon ECF hood extractor, K&N CAI, Elite catch can, Big Worm Bow Tie emblems, Jacfab bracket, Vitesse TC, BMR strut brace, BMR tunnel brace, NPP exhaust

11-15-2019, 09:45 AM	#10
sbubbaklein Drives: early 2011 Camaro convertible Join Date: Jul 2014 Location: House Springs, Mo Posts: 2,002 View My Garage	go to acdelcotds.com and select subscription, then scroll to service information and select 4 day for $15 __________________ Early 2011 LT Convertible, ZL1 bumper, hood, side skirts, belly pan and wheels, Truecarbon ECF hood extractor, K&N CAI, Elite catch can, Big Worm Bow Tie emblems, Jacfab bracket, Vitesse TC, BMR strut brace, BMR tunnel brace, NPP exhaust

11-30-2019, 05:49 AM	#13
Deputy347k9 Drives: 2014 Ashen Gray Convertible Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: Havelock, NC Posts: 1,328	Not sure how well this picture will come out being the print is so small. I have a set of 2013 service manuals. Attached Images __________________

11-30-2019, 06:15 AM	#14
Deputy347k9 Drives: 2014 Ashen Gray Convertible Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: Havelock, NC Posts: 1,328	Notes from 2013 F/Car serfide manual Volume 4/4, page 12-93 Power folding top description and operation: Overview: The operation of the convertible top is semi-automatic. The user of the vehicle manually latches and unlatches the convertible top while hydraulic power actuation provides the force to raise and lower the top. The electrical position of the power convertible top system consists of the following: 1. folding top control module 2. header latch position switch 3. folding top control switch 4. luggage barrier sensor 5. folding top position sensor 6. folding top pump motor There are following paragraphs that give a basic description of each component. __________________

11-07-2019, 08:42 AM	#3
nazarah Drives: 2004 Dodge Viper Join Date: Oct 2019 Location: Omaha Posts: 66	I had the engine off. I'll try it again with the engine running and foot on the brake - perhaps you are correct. Thank you for the recommendation!

11-09-2019, 12:35 AM	#5
kpeters59 Drives: Black 2012 SS Convertible Join Date: Jul 2018 Location: Houston Posts: 41	Sounds an awful lot like what I was trying to describe here: https://www.camaro5.com/forums/showp...4&postcount=10 Also, my top stops moving several times going both up and down. It started doing that pretty soon after I started noticing the wet back floor. Is that related? It has a VERY regular pattern to it. It seems to be able to move for exactly 5 seconds and stops. Going up, I just release and re-press the button and it continues. Going down, I have to briefly press up and then continue down and it goes all the way down after about 5 of those. I assume there's some kind of sensor that's not working, so the controller turns off the motor, or worse, the motor is shutting off most likely due to heat. Anybody with any idea why that's happening? Is it related to the 5th Bow issue? I'd guess that either some kind of movement sensor is not sending its signal properly or the motor is getting hot and going in to emergency mode or something. Going up it does not require that I briefly change directions to get it to continue. Going down, it stops 5 times. Going up, more. I think 'cause it's harder to go up. Anybody else? -KP

11-13-2019, 03:32 PM	#7
nazarah Drives: 2004 Dodge Viper Join Date: Oct 2019 Location: Omaha Posts: 66	Could this be as simple as the switch up front beginning to fail? I have been trying to find a wiring diagram that includes the convertible top functions but have not found anything as of yet. I really have only a basic idea of how these things work. Does the full power to the motor on the pump run through the switch, or is the switch controlling a relay?

11-15-2019, 07:51 AM	#9
nazarah Drives: 2004 Dodge Viper Join Date: Oct 2019 Location: Omaha Posts: 66	Still spending my free time looking for a schematic that covers all of the electrical components included with the top. Might be time to break down and order factory service manuals.