Suspension newbie needing some help

[go_go_gadget88]

So since I have gotten this car, my main focus has been getting some more power under my right foot. Now that that has been accomplished, I thought it was time to shift the focus elsewhere for a bit. I will preface by saying this is 99% a street car. I want to take it to the drag strip at some point, but it isn't going to live there. That said, I don't drive it often so when I do, it's pretty...ahem..."spirited" driving. And I would like it to stay in one piece when I do hit the strip. Especially after I get some meats on the rear.

I recently purchased a 3.91 rear end, and will be doing that swap relatively soon. What I want to know is, what should I be looking at to upgrade suspension-wise while I am back there to help keep from breaking parts? So far suspension is 100% stock. Everyone talks about wheel hop like it always happens but I haven't noticed anything hop-wise sitting in the driver's seat

I have read that upgrading the rear cradle bushings is a must, so I thought about dropping the cradle down when I swap diffs and doing new bushings. Do I want to go with something like this that also has differential bushings while it is going in and out? https://www.phastekperformance.com/2...hing-bk030.htm

Thanks in advance for any and all help!


Just trying to narrow down what is best to do now to minimize double work going back in again later. Thanks for any and all input?

[KillboyPowerhead]

For spirited driving/light track use, the two best mods you can do for better stability/cornering are the newer style rear bar (also requires 2012+ rear lower control arms and drop-links) and the subframe bushings.

If you do the rear bar you may also want to consider replacing the front bar with a bigger one as well, to balance the front and rear; you could go with the factory SS bar up front and a ZL1 bar in the rear, or go aftermarket for both such as JPSS's 27mm front, 32mm rear bars. I went with Pegasus' solid subframe bushings and noticed a big difference in reduced roll/tire hop even after installing the JPSS bars. JPSS also has (or will soon have) solid bushings.

[go_go_gadget88]

Originally Posted by KillboyPowerhead

For spirited driving/light track use, the two best mods you can do for better stability/cornering are the newer style rear bar (also requires 2012+ rear lower control arms and drop-links) and the subframe bushings.

If you do the rear bar you may also want to consider replacing the front bar with a bigger one as well, to balance the front and rear; you could go with the factory SS bar up front and a ZL1 bar in the rear, or go aftermarket for both such as JPSS's 27mm front, 32mm rear bars. I went with Pegasus' solid subframe bushings and noticed a big difference in reduced roll/tire hop even after installing the JPSS bars. JPSS also has (or will soon have) solid bushings.

I had to edit my comment. I realize when I say track, I should have said drag strip as that's what I meant whoops! Only actual tracks near me are dirt, so no go for me. I will basically see no high speed turns/cornering. Mostly just clutch dumps, burnouts, and a lot of WOT runs thru a few gears.

I have seen solid bushings. Quite a bit more money though. Wasn't planning to buy rear end this soon so my funds are somewhat limited right now. Are they a worthy upgrade over the poly unit I linked for my style of driving? I also see for the diff bushings that there is the red "pro" version in that kit, or a black "street" version. Is either of these better for my use while I am in there? They both have a similar description other than the durometer ratings

[olblue75]

Still do the cradle bushings and upgrade all your rear suspension links to ZL1/1LE/Z28 parts it will keep those all in check and if your not doing any crazy turns probably a smaller bar for the front to help weight transfer.
I would get a set of Z28 front control arms or JPSS inserts to keep your front end in check also helps keep the steering a little more precise.
You might want to find a Tru Trac or a used Z28 LSD there was a few in the classifieds they are a helical design for better traction management.
I run the 1LE axles and Ive done road course and Auto X not sure if the Z28 has bigger axles or not but OEM pieces are pretty good up through Z28 HP Levels, and depends how deep your wallet is.

https://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=528164

https://www.camaro5.com/forums/showt...&highlight=Z28

[frankwjr]

my sig...


peace

[KillboyPowerhead]

Even for drag racing the new, bigger rear bar and solid subframe bushings will help keep the rear tires planted. As mentioned, stiffer toe links and trailing arms, and stiffer upper control arm and trailing arm bushings will all help keep the rear tight and reduce dynamic toe/camber movement. I wouldn't bother with the differential bushings unless it's a strict racing car due to the extra noise and vibration

[go_go_gadget88]

Originally Posted by olblue75

Still do the cradle bushings and upgrade all your rear suspension links to ZL1/1LE/Z28 parts it will keep those all in check and if your not doing any crazy turns probably a smaller bar for the front to help weight transfer.
I would get a set of Z28 front control arms or JPSS inserts to keep your front end in check also helps keep the steering a little more precise.
You might want to find a Tru Trac or a used Z28 LSD there was a few in the classifieds they are a helical design for better traction management.
I run the 1LE axles and Ive done road course and Auto X not sure if the Z28 has bigger axles or not but OEM pieces are pretty good up through Z28 HP Levels, and depends how deep your wallet is.

https://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=528164

https://www.camaro5.com/forums/showt...&highlight=Z28

Well I already have a diff coming that has 3.91 gears in it, so I can direct swap. And as for axles, I didn't know what would be best for my situation. I didn't think a z28 axle mated up to an SS diff, but admittedly I don't know anything for sure lol. I hate to waste my money buying better OEM ones if I am just going to snap them with boost down the road.

Originally Posted by frankwjr

my sig...


peace

Well as much power as I plan on putting down in the future, I think I will need more than the subframe inserts on the rear, won't I?

And I see the 1LE axles..are those an upgrade to the SS axle? And if so, are they a direct bolt in?

Originally Posted by KillboyPowerhead

Even for drag racing the new, bigger rear bar and solid subframe bushings will help keep the rear tires planted. As mentioned, stiffer toe links and trailing arms, and stiffer upper control arm and trailing arm bushings will all help keep the rear tight and reduce dynamic toe/camber movement. I wouldn't bother with the differential bushings unless it's a strict racing car due to the extra noise and vibration

Ok so solid bushings the way to go? They don't add to vibration? Can the rest of these items mentioned be done with the cradle in place? As in, can I just do mounts now while swapping the diff, and the other parts as I get money for each? And I can just leave the stock diff bushings if upgraded ones aren't needed. Just seemed like the time to do it if they were.

[KillboyPowerhead]

I went with solid and definitely can't complain , very little if any increased vibrations/noise, however, if this is a daily driver and you put on a lot of miles you may want to consider polyurethane as the subframe wasn't designed for solid bushings and, therefore, may eventually fail (the welds/joints) if pushed real hard (although in your case as you described, I don't think that'll be an issue).

The upper control arm bushings, if you choose to do them, will be considerably easier with the cradle lowered; with that said it is fairly easy to lower the cradle when needed - I did all of my suspension work in the driveway with jack stands. The rest of the arms/bushings can be done separately easy enough.

I would leave the stock diff bushings in place.

[olblue75]

A Z28 diff case is the same as the SS as are the axles the only difference in axles comes in are V6 and ZL1 cars.

But you can buy a Z28 or TruTrac helical diff and get away from 1 tire fire. I noticed when I swapped my cradle bushings it seemed like the car accelerated better since the cradle didn't have to wind up, and don't think you'll get cradle failure most of the vibes will be transmitted through the diff into the cradle not just the cradle into the car.

[frankwjr]

Well as much power as I plan on putting down in the future, I think I will need more than the subframe inserts on the rear, won't I?

look again...BMR T/A's and bushing...

And I see the 1LE axles..are those an upgrade to the SS axle? And if so, are they a direct bolt in? yup!

and a lot of peeps don't give enough credit to the motor mounts....yeah, yeah..stock is fine...any way go ask Jannetty what they put on every F/I car the put on the street...prothane.

peace

[go_go_gadget88]

Originally Posted by olblue75

A Z28 diff case is the same as the SS as are the axles the only difference in axles comes in are V6 and ZL1 cars.

But you can buy a Z28 or TruTrac helical diff and get away from 1 tire fire. I noticed when I swapped my cradle bushings it seemed like the car accelerated better since the cradle didn't have to wind up, and don't think you'll get cradle failure most of the vibes will be transmitted through the diff into the cradle not just the cradle into the car.

Maybe that's what I was thinking of. So, z28 axles = straight swap. ZL1 axles = not so much?

I guess if I start having issues with the 1 tire, I can always have the diff inside upgraded. So far, I'm not having any issues there. Though this new diff may be a different story

Originally Posted by KillboyPowerhead

I went with solid and definitely can't complain , very little if any increased vibrations/noise, however, if this is a daily driver and you put on a lot of miles you may want to consider polyurethane as the subframe wasn't designed for solid bushings and, therefore, may eventually fail (the welds/joints) if pushed real hard (although in your case as you described, I don't think that'll be an issue).

The upper control arm bushings, if you choose to do them, will be considerably easier with the cradle lowered; with that said it is fairly easy to lower the cradle when needed - I did all of my suspension work in the driveway with jack stands. The rest of the arms/bushings can be done separately easy enough.

I would leave the stock diff bushings in place.

I am just having a hard time with solid. I read that is isn't bad, but seems like usually solid suspension parts = rougher ride. I can look into UCA bushings if they are easier now. I will be doing this on jackstands/jacks in the garage.

Originally Posted by frankwjr

look again...BMR T/A's and bushing...

Right, I see that..but those can be done later can't they? You said check sig like that was the stuff I needed.. but I am thinking about cradle mounts that we are currently talking about, the inserts you have are probably not enough right?


and a lot of peeps don't give enough credit to the motor mounts....yeah, yeah..stock is fine...any way go ask Jannetty what they put on every F/I car the put on the street...prothane..

I am curious how the motor mounts help the rear end stay together? It seems like it would be easiest to wait until I pull the motor, and then do the mounts then. Or can they be done semi-easily with engine in the car? Not that they aren't needed...but just because a shop puts something on every car doesn't mean its an end-all be-all thing. Usually that just means it's an easy sell to make a few more $$$ on the deal. Or a least a piece of mind over necessity kind of thing. Still something I can sure look into then.

[BMR Sales]

Originally Posted by go_go_gadget88

So since I have gotten this car, my main focus has been getting some more power under my right foot. Now that that has been accomplished, I thought it was time to shift the focus elsewhere for a bit. I will preface by saying this is 99% a street car. I want to take it to the drag strip at some point, but it isn't going to live there. That said, I don't drive it often so when I do, it's pretty...ahem..."spirited" driving. And I would like it to stay in one piece when I do hit the strip. Especially after I get some meats on the rear.

I recently purchased a 3.91 rear end, and will be doing that swap relatively soon. What I want to know is, what should I be looking at to upgrade suspension-wise while I am back there to help keep from breaking parts? So far suspension is 100% stock. Everyone talks about wheel hop like it always happens but I haven't noticed anything hop-wise sitting in the driver's seat

I have read that upgrading the rear cradle bushings is a must, so I thought about dropping the cradle down when I swap diffs and doing new bushings. Do I want to go with something like this that also has differential bushings while it is going in and out? https://www.phastekperformance.com/2...hing-bk030.htm

Thanks in advance for any and all help!


Just trying to narrow down what is best to do now to minimize double work going back in again later. Thanks for any and all input?

Those Cradle Bushings are Great, but I don't recommend the Diff Bushings for 99% of people. Cradle Bushings you can go as hard as you want with no problem, Diff Bushings anything harder than Stock and you will get some form of NVH, sometimes pretty severe.

[BMR Sales]

Originally Posted by go_go_gadget88

Right, I see that..but those can be done later can't they? You said check sig like that was the stuff I needed.. but I am thinking about cradle mounts that we are currently talking about, the inserts you have are probably not enough right?

The suggestion was our Trailing Arms & Cradle Bushings. I would also suggest Toe Rods.

Can they be done later? Sure, but you are right there and why would you want to double or triple your labor

[go_go_gadget88]

Originally Posted by BMR Sales

Can they be done later? Sure, but you are right there and why would you want to double or triple your labor

That's what I was trying to find out.. if they would make a lot more labor to do later? Doesn't look like it would be bad to go in and replace trailing arms later.

And as to WHY I would want to do them later? Simple.. $$$$$, or lack thereof

Wasn't even planning to buy rear end right now, and budget is still recouping from the cam swap lol. If it isn't imperative to do it while the cradle is down, I can go back and replace other parts as money allows me too.

You are probably the person to ask. What kind of RWHP level would you recommend someone jumping from your poly cradle bushings to a solid metal unit?

Bonus dumb question on my end....what is NVH?