V6 Occasional Tracking Setup

[intensifi]

Pete,

To keep this brain dead simple for us knuckle draggers...

Assuming we (v6 owners) first upgrade our bushings to those from your Street1 or Daily Driver kits...

What are the valid/safe square setups for the V6?

# Tire Wheel width front offset rear offset sway bar reqs
1 275/45/20 9"
2 305/30/19 ?
... ... ...
... ... ...
... ... ...

Which would you favor for a street/hwy car? A street/hwy + track car?

After these foundational steps it sounds like each owner could then decide whether go to the 1LE upgrade kit or your Pace Car kit.

Am I missing anything?

[JusticePete]

Wheels and Tires

Anything between 275/45/20 9" to 305/30/19 will work well. The 305/30/19 is my personal preference because it puts the most rubber under the front fender. the 305s lower the car 1" withOUT altering suspension geometry. That is a huge plus. Once you drive on the 305s, you won't want to drive on anything else.

When we build special project cars I work with Dave Schardt the owner of Forgeline. Dave has been nothing short of invaluable to us. In exchange for all the work Forgeline puts into our projects we forward all inquiries regarding offset back to them. After all, they did all the work so they deserve a chance to earn your business.

What comes after the Foundational Bushings?

Between the GM performance Parts and Pedders there are a lot of options and combinations.

Sway Bars - OE ZL1 25/28mm or Pedders Z Bars 27/32mm
Springs - 1LE Front and Pedders 220033 Rear
Damping 275s - 1LE Struts are a BEST BUY
Damping 305s - That is a lot of tire to control. higher spring rates and more aggressive damping are in order. Xa coilovers or Supercars.

Does this answer your question?

Originally Posted by intensifi

Pete,

To keep this brain dead simple for us knuckle draggers...

Assuming we (v6 owners) first upgrade our bushings to those from your Street1 or Daily Driver kits...

What are the valid/safe square setups for the V6?

# Tire Wheel width front offset rear offset sway bar reqs
1 275/45/20 9"
2 305/30/19 ?
... ... ...
... ... ...
... ... ...

Which would you favor for a street/hwy car? A street/hwy + track car?

After these foundational steps it sounds like each owner could then decide whether go to the 1LE upgrade kit or your Pace Car kit.

Am I missing anything?

[intensifi]

Originally Posted by JusticePete

Wheels & Tires
Anything between 275/45/20 9" to 305/30/19 will work well. The 305/30/19 is my personal preference because it puts the most rubber under the front fender. the 305s lower the car 1" with altering suspension geometry. That is a huge plus.

Did you mean to say "without" altering suspension geometry?

Thank you for pointing out that particular setup would lower the car. I guess we can go to Tirerack or equivalent to figure out which combos give the same outer diameter (speedo issues) and have the same or better speed/load ratings.

Does a "proper" square setup involve just 4 of the same tire size (staggered wheel size ok) or 4 of the same size tire and wheel (no stagger)? I know there are issues with Camaro wheels due to offset issues and that only certain combinations work (proper fender and brake clearance).

Originally Posted by JusticePete

What comes after the Foundational Bushings?

Between the GM performance Parts and Pedders there are a lot of options and combinations.

Sway Bars - OE ZL1 25/28mm or Pedders Z Bars 27/32mm
Springs - 1LE Front and Pedders 220033 Rear
Damping 275s - 1LE Struts are a BEST BUY
Damping 305s - That is a lot of tire to control. higher spring rates and more aggressive damping are in order. Xa coilovers or Supercars.

Thank you for the menu.

I'd probably just go with the 1LE kit or your Pace Car package to keep things matched (and simple).

Originally Posted by JusticePete

Does this answer your question?

Mostly. I'll call or PM when the time comes.

[stevey_frac]

So... I've found Brembo calipers for $600. Given that i'll be able to sell my V6 for at least a few hundred, that's not a bad deal.

After this winter I'll look at selling my winters, buying the brembo's, and selling my V6 brakes! (And then buying 19" winters next fall)

Once that's done I'll come back to Justice Pete for a good suspension setup to persue.

[JusticePete]

Originally Posted by intensifi

Did you mean to say "without" altering suspension geometry?

Thank you for pointing out that particular setup would lower the car. I guess we can go to Tirerack or equivalent to figure out which combos give the same outer diameter (speedo issues) and have the same or better speed/load ratings.

Does a "proper" square setup involve just 4 of the same tire size (staggered wheel size ok) or 4 of the same size tire and wheel (no stagger)? I know there are issues with Camaro wheels due to offset issues and that only certain combinations work (proper fender and brake clearance).



Thank you for the menu.

I'd probably just go with the 1LE kit or your Pace Car package to keep things matched (and simple).



Mostly. I'll call or PM when the time comes.

We'll be ready when you are ready.

[lscamaro]

Originally Posted by stevey_frac

So... I've found Brembo calipers for $600. Given that i'll be able to sell my V6 for at least a few hundred, that's not a bad deal.

After this winter I'll look at selling my winters, buying the brembo's, and selling my V6 brakes! (And then buying 19" winters next fall)

Once that's done I'll come back to Justice Pete for a good suspension setup to persue.

Please don't forget you'll need a little more than just the calipers. The rotors at least are needed. I'm not 100% sure if the SS lines are needed but I'd do them. You don't need the SS dust shields but just be prepared to cut yours

[stevey_frac]

Rotors and brake lines are relatively cheap, and rotors are consumable. I was originally looking at 1000 for calipers. I'll need pads as well.

[Grimlock]

Originally Posted by intensifi

I have been told you must swap the fronts and rears as the brake system (ABS, etc.) is designed for a "balanced" set. I am also told you must have the same type of brakes lines on the front and rear (i.e. do not put stainless on the front and leave rubber on the back). While you are doing this, upgrade to DOT4 fluid for track use or steep hill driving.

I was able to swap just the fronts. It's a weird looking having big Brembos up front and small stock V6s on the rear. But it runs fine. Only issue is squeaking but from reading other threads it means my brake pads are doing their job.

Do brake lines make that much of a difference? I had the opportunity to get some stainless lines but didnt jump on it thinking it was just a wear/tear thing with rubber vs metal.

[JDP Sales]

Originally Posted by Grimlock

I was able to swap just the fronts. It's a weird looking having big Brembos up front and small stock V6s on the rear. But it runs fine. Only issue is squeaking but from reading other threads it means my brake pads are doing their job.

Do brake lines make that much of a difference? I had the opportunity to get some stainless lines but didnt jump on it thinking it was just a wear/tear thing with rubber vs metal.

They definitely make a good difference in pedal feel and braking response. Although I'm not sure if the SS rear lines will work on your rear V6 calipers. You may just have to do the front for the time being and once you install rear Brembo calipers you can install the rear lines. Something to think about anyway..

Best regards,

Tyler
888-308-6007

[stevey_frac]

Let's assume that I have my SS brakes...

Am I better off getting a square setup for wheels? Can I just get an additional pair of rear stock wheel and bolt those onto the front with the same rubber, or does it have to be more nuanced than that? (Offsets and whatnot).

Or, will the car handle well enough with just suspension upgrades to make it not as worthwhile doing something so drastic? It seems like more rubber on the road is a good thing....

[JusticePete]

Originally Posted by stevey_frac

Let's assume that I have my SS brakes...

Am I better off getting a square setup for wheels? Can I just get an additional pair of rear stock wheel and bolt those onto the front with the same rubber, or does it have to be more nuanced than that? (Offsets and whatnot).

Or, will the car handle well enough with just suspension upgrades to make it not as worthwhile doing something so drastic? It seems like more rubber on the road is a good thing....

EP1201 Sub-Frame Bushings
EP6577 Radisu Bushings
Springs

• 1LE Front
• Pedders 220033 Rear

Damping with stock wheels and tires or 275s all round - 1LE Struts are a BEST BUY
Pedders Z Bars

If you follow this upgrade list you will be stunned at how well you Camaro handles. Stunned. Adding a square 275 or 305 set of wheels and tires are another layer of icing on an already delicious cake.

[stevey_frac]

Originally Posted by JusticePete

EP1201 Sub-Frame Bushings
EP6577 Radisu Bushings
Springs

• 1LE Front
• Pedders 220033 Rear

Damping with stock wheels and tires or 275s all round - 1LE Struts are a BEST BUY
Pedders Z Bars

If you follow this upgrade list you will be stunned at how well you Camaro handles. Stunned. Adding a square 275 or 305 set of wheels and tires are another layer of icing on an already delicious cake.

Sounds like I have a shopping list! Thanks!

Are you recommending this even without the square tire setup? But that it will also work WITH a square tire setup? There was discussion earlier in the thread that the 1LE suspension wouldn't work well without a square wheel setup.

Also: Can you clarify if the stock RS/SS wheels will fit on the front of my Camaro?

I know there's a lot of questions here... It matches all the things I don't know about all this!

Thanks!

--Steve

[JusticePete]

Originally Posted by stevey_frac

Sounds like I have a shopping list! Thanks!

Are you recommending this even without the square tire setup? But that it will also work WITH a square tire setup? There was discussion earlier in the thread that the 1LE suspension wouldn't work well without a square wheel setup.

Also: Can you clarify if the stock RS/SS wheels will fit on the front of my Camaro?

I know there's a lot of questions here... It matches all the things I don't know about all this!

Thanks!

--Steve

Yes, any 5th Gen wheel will fit any 5th Gen including 1LE, ZL1 and Z/28.

The parts list we are working with are not a 1LE suspension. We are using 1LE struts front and rear with 1LE springs up front and the rest are Pedders. The parts in RED are Pedders. The parts in black are OE 1LE

EP1201 Sub-Frame Bushings
EP6577 Radius Bushings
Springs, 1LE Front
Springs Rear, Pedders 220033
OEM 1LE Struts are a BEST BUY
Pedders Z Bars

You would order front and rear 1LE struts and two front 1LE springs from a GM Dealer. The rest of the parts you would order from me. This parts grouping will work quite well with your stock tires. If you upgrade to square they will work better. Does this make things clear?

[stevey_frac]

Ok, so Justice Pete and I took some questions offline. Thanks man.

Here's the current plan then.

Come spring, find a set of used RS wheels. Take the rears from that set, put them up front, and then wrap everything in Michelin Pilot Super Sport tires from Rudy@Tirerack. (285/35ZR20)

I can then use the two pairs of fronts, wrap them in winter rubber, and use them in the winter! Can anyone comment on that?

Next step is to acquire the Brembo brakes / rotors/ pads / lines. I've seen used sets floating around fairly inexpensively.

After that, get the Pedders bushings (both subframe and radius) from Pete. That's a nice sized upgrade that's doable in one go.

Next, swap out the springs, struts, and install the Z bars... Pete, do you have a part number for the bars? There's a couple of different ones.

Pretty much once I get the brakes, I can start taking her to the track, and then get to truly enjoy the improved performance as things go!