2010 turbo V6 vs 2010 SS

[ytown87]

Originally Posted by GretchenGotGrowl

HP Turbine (IPS Twin;A6) -- 460 RWHP/440 RWTQ; doesn't drag race
Skulka222 (IPS Twin;A6) -- 450 RWHP/4?? RWTQ (just got it last week).
Can't_c_me (Custom Twin;M6) -- 500 RWHP/460 RWTQ; doesn't drag race.

To steer this back on topic some. Is OP doing twin or single turbo setup? All that you quoted above are twin turbo setups. If OP is doing single turbo, what are the est figures on that then? The questiom to start off with was if his turbo kit would be faster than a bolt on SS. If single turbo...Im doubting it will

[GretchenGotGrowl]

Originally Posted by ytown87

Not for nothing but my 12.4 and many after have been during this summer heat with my best set on a 88° night so.....Im pretty sure I have room once it cools down to shave a few tenths off as well.

I get the argument you want to validate about V6ers being able to run times identical or barely less than bolt on SS cars and I am sure its possible. Good for those who have. But how much more money has it taken to even get to those times? 7k? 8k?

You asked how many bolt on SS have beat ZL1 and CTS-V cars. Ive taken a couple out before but so what? Asking who has beat one is as if they cant be beat is like going into a "my car is faster than..." and you quote magazine times all day to validate you point.

Shout outs to all these with a V6 that have the money and have been able to make their cars something amazing. Give credit to all those deserving regardless of what type of Camaro they drive. Unfortunately there are so few of them out there to really help back the whole "my V6 forced induction can beat..." debate compared to bolt on SS cars. Hopefully more do come around

I am not trying to validate anything, I am trying to counter bad information. I never once quoted a magazine time. I am glad you have beaten a ZL1...convincingly though?

The facts are the IPS kit gives the V6 ZL1 power for less than the MSRP difference between the the cheapest V6 and the cheapest SS. So, it is a viable option. The OP is trying to determine if it is the correct option for him. People that know absolutely nothing about TT V6s posting demonstrably false information about that option and then trying to prove their point by bringing in unrelated FI kits are not helping him make an informed decision. Instead they are engaging in self validation.

[Evil-Bee-NH]

Can't we all just get along....


No we can't because V8 guys who post dumb uninformed crap in the V6 section have a penis size issue or something. The OP asked for advice on a V6 FI setup not on your opinions V8 vs. V6 this is why we can't have nice conversations anymore. I blame the parents clearly didn't beat some of their children enough growing up.

[ytown87]

Originally Posted by GretchenGotGrowl

I am not trying to validate anything, I am trying to counter bad information. I never once quoted a magazine time. I am glad you have beaten a ZL1...convincingly though?

Lets be real and you know as well as I do. It doesnt take all that much if the driver doesnt have enough seat time with their car..no matter how fast the car has been documented going.

[ytown87]

Originally Posted by Evil-Bee-NH

Can't we all just get along....


No we can't because V8 guys who post dumb uninformed crap in the V6 section have a penis size issue or something. The OP asked for advice on a V6 FI setup not on your opinions V8 vs. V6 this is why we can't have nice conversations anymore. I blame the parents clearly didn't beat some of their children enough growing up.

Just in case you missed it. This thread is in the "Camaro vs." section and not the V6 section. Kinda free game buddy.

And you have neither a V8 or TT V6 so..... thanks for all that you are able to contribute.

[SIXJAK]

I like my IPF SC'd V6. I know it does not make the kind of power the turbos do but I've driven it now for a year and a half with no other issues but the LLT tune. I know what it'll beat and what it won't. I'll just say this: if you're driving an SS with bolt ons and a tune, good luck and have fun breathing my running a bit too rich exhaust fumes. My car has better sways, end links bushings, properly set up coil overs and the same brakes as an SS. It's a very fun car to drive.

[BlaqWhole]

You guys need to step back and relax. You're acting like I attacked you or something. If anything Gretchen, I've always spoken well of you on here, on another Camaro forum, and on 2 Camaro pages on Facebook. I even posted a link featuring your car when a bunch of SS guys were bashing the V6ers out there...just to show them what the V6 is capable of. And like I said already, I have no desire or intention to argue with you. And furthermore, I don't deserve the lack of respect you're starting to show me. Now if we can't continue this in a polite manner, then I will more than gladly excuse myself from this conversation. Believe me, I can find a dozen different Camaro related arguments in an hour if I wanted to.

Now with that said, you're doing a lot of speculation for cars that don't drag or go to the track. I don't care if they have 700 hp, if it has never been to the track, then all you can do is speculate on what it'll do.

And to answer your question, no, I never raced a ZL-1. I go to the track to run my best time, not to compete with the car in the next lane. I could be lined up with a ZR1 or a Civic, it doesn't matter unless it is a legit race...which it isn't. Like I said, I ran a 12.83. So if a ZL-1 runs faster than a 12.83, then no, I can't beat it...obviously. But the point is, that I have not seen any V6 Camaro with a TT run a low 12. Not just on this site, but on Youtube and every other Camaro forum or page. I have not seen it. And I looked. You posted 3 examples of Camaros none of which have been to the track. Racing is more than just HP. For all I know, maybe the drive train can't put that power to use.

And again, like I said, I have only spoken out of what I've seen and read. I have already said that I will acknowledge any hardcore proof that shows the opposite of what I know. So far, there has only been guesses and speculation. If you think a TT V6 Camaro is gonna run with a ZL-1 then that is your belief. But don't go talking to me like I'm BSing and you're all-knowing when you haven't provided any substantial proof. We're both talking based on what we know and believe. So if you can't prove it, then we're both in the same boat man. Just sayin...

[BlaqWhole]

And for the record, we all know what Gretchen's car can do. But his car isn't an otherwise stock V6 with a TT. His car is very highly modified. The OP is in a stock V6 with a TT set-up. That is a far cry from your car Gretchen. If someone asked whether or not a V6 can run X time or make X power with TTs, then we could point to you and your car and say it is possible. But this is not the case here.

[GretchenGotGrowl]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

You guys need to step back and relax. You're acting like I attacked you or something. If anything Gretchen, I've always spoken well of you on here, on another Camaro forum, and on 2 Camaro pages on Facebook. I even posted a link featuring your car when a bunch of SS guys were bashing the V6ers out there...just to show them what the V6 is capable of. And like I said already, I have no desire or intention to argue with you. And furthermore, I don't deserve the lack of respect you're starting to show me. Now if we can't continue this in a polite manner, then I will more than gladly excuse myself from this conversation. Believe me, I can find a dozen different Camaro related arguments in an hour if I wanted to.

Now with that said, you're doing a lot of speculation for cars that don't drag or go to the track. I don't care if they have 700 hp, if it has never been to the track, then all you can do is speculate on what it'll do.

And to answer your question, no, I never raced a ZL-1. I go to the track to run my best time, not to compete with the car in the next lane. I could be lined up with a ZR1 or a Civic, it doesn't matter unless it is a legit race...which it isn't. Like I said, I ran a 12.83. So if a ZL-1 runs faster than a 12.83, then no, I can't beat it...obviously. But the point is, that I have not seen any V6 Camaro with a TT run a low 12. Not just on this site, but on Youtube and every other Camaro forum or page. I have not seen it. And I looked. You posted 3 examples of Camaros none of which have been to the track. Racing is more than just HP. For all I know, maybe the drive train can't put that power to use.

And again, like I said, I have only spoken out of what I've seen and read. I have already said that I will acknowledge any hardcore proof that shows the opposite of what I know. So far, there has only been guesses and speculation. If you think a TT V6 Camaro is gonna run with a ZL-1 then that is your belief. But don't go talking to me like I'm BSing and you're all-knowing when you haven't provided any substantial proof. We're both talking based on what we know and believe. So if you can't prove it, then we're both in the same boat man. Just sayin...

I've seen guys in SSes and 5.0s run high 13 and low 14. That's the driver. If you remove the driver from the equation, then two cars that are essentially the same weight, same gearing and same drag coefficient will not run the same time if one has 90 more HP (stock SS) than the other (TT V6). It also makes sense that one that is down 20-30 or more HP (bolt-on/tuned SS) will not win convincingly against the other (TT V6).

Your post that I took exception with didn't mention anything about drivers.

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

A twin turbo system on your V6 should make it a driver's race against a stock SS with the advantage towards the TT V6. Throw bolt-ons at the SS and it will win convincingly. So I would say that if your goals are hp, tq, and fast 1/4 mile times, then trade up to the SS.

And you haven't shown us any videos or other evidence of you beating a TT V6. It would be like me saying I would win convincingly an SS with an AGP TT putting down 800 RWHP. I've never seen one put down a good time at a track and I've read few threads about people being disappointed in their times. However, I know if I were to take an 800 RWHP AGP TT V8 down the track I would run much faster than I've ever run in my 650 RWHP TT V6.

So, given the OP

Originally Posted by 717Stunna

I'm going to turbo my V6 soon and a buddy of mine has a full bolt on and tuned SS he said he would kill me but I would be turbocharged with full bolt ons and tuned how you think this would turn out

He won't be a better driver in the bolt-on SS than he will be in a TT V6. He will still lose to his buddy if he can't drive. He has a better chance with more power. The TT V6 gives him more power.

No disrespect intended.

[GretchenGotGrowl]

Originally Posted by The Black Knight

I'm also seeing:
GretchenGotGrowl - 647RWHP & 726RWTQ

Oh yeah Gretchen, you're way off man. How can you compete?? You "ONLY" make "TWICE" the power of a stock SS. Apparently these guys know something the rest of us don't.

But the OP is not talking about a build like mine. The three I mention are the ones that have basically stock cars with turbos added. Thanks for the props, but bringing my car into this is just as misleading as some of the other posts.

[GretchenGotGrowl]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

And for the record, we all know what Gretchen's car can do. But his car isn't an otherwise stock V6 with a TT. His car is very highly modified. The OP is in a stock V6 with a TT set-up. That is a far cry from your car Gretchen. If someone asked whether or not a V6 can run X time or make X power with TTs, then we could point to you and your car and say it is possible. But this is not the case here.

That we can agree on! We are talking about a basically stock V6 with a twin turbo kit. Bringing my car into the discussion is like someone considering cams and heads as bolt ons. It is irrelevant to the question the OP posed.

[Jason@JacFab]

At the power levels the guys with the IPS turbo kits are putting out, I would guesstimate them being capable of a mid to low 12 easily, high to mid 11s with a good driver, good track prep and optimal weather.

In my old SS, with nothing but a cold air intake I built myself, high flow cats I built myself, and some lighter 18" wheels (still on street tires), in good weather, I was running 12.5x-12.6x with a stick. In about 40-60 dyno runs, my highest pull EVER was 396.7HP/409.4TQ on a Dynocom dyno.

[KMPrenger]

Heres the thing...

There are not many forced induction V6s. Yes there are a bunch of IPF supercharger kits sold, but not a ton of those guys are on this forum. But when you talk turbo V6s, there not many of them at all. EVEN LESS of them are drag racing....so this is a very rare group your talking about here.

Now...the IPF supercharger kits are centrifugal, and their power is found on the top end. Thats part of the reason these particular builds may not be much if any faster (and sometimes slower) than a stock SS on the 1/4 mile. But catch one on the highway, and say you want to do a little rolling fun, the IPF V6 will likely have an advantage....especially if they have other supporting bolt ons. The IPF kit with headers on a V6 typically pushs around 380 - 400+ rwhp depending on the transmission. So no stock SS is keeping up with this on the road.

By the way..here is video of one with nothing more than the kit, on stock tires doing a 12.8. This time is not a typical run, but shows the potential. I can find another video of a completely stock V6, with just the kit, on the stock LS wheels and tires running a 13 flat.


So now lets talk about the turbo guys. Theres a whopping THREE of them....three of them on this site (not counting Gretchen). These guys are making 450ish HP and TQ, with a broader power curve than the supercharged guys. I have seen video of a few of these turbo guys beating modified V8s.....BUT....it was on the street.

I agree with Gretchen in that, there is much miss-information, that a turbo setup on the V6 only gets you to the levels of the V8, or maybe close to it. But the reality is that a properly done up kit will push the V6 well beyond a stock V8, to a decently modified one.

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by GretchenGotGrowl

I've seen guys in SSes and 5.0s run high 13 and low 14. That's the driver. If you remove the driver from the equation, then two cars that are essentially the same weight, same gearing and same drag coefficient will not run the same time if one has 90 more HP (stock SS) than the other (TT V6). It also makes sense that one that is down 20-30 or more HP (bolt-on/tuned SS) will not win convincingly against the other (TT V6).

Your post that I took exception with didn't mention anything about drivers.



And you haven't shown us any videos or other evidence of you beating a TT V6. It would be like me saying I would win convincingly an SS with an AGP TT putting down 800 RWHP. I've never seen one put down a good time at a track and I've read few threads about people being disappointed in their times. However, I know if I were to take an 800 RWHP AGP TT V8 down the track I would run much faster than I've ever run in my 650 RWHP TT V6.

So, given the OP



He won't be a better driver in the bolt-on SS than he will be in a TT V6. He will still lose to his buddy if he can't drive. He has a better chance with more power. The TT V6 gives him more power.

No disrespect intended.

I don't have a video of me racing against a TT V6, because I have not seen one at the track...and I've been there several times this year. So what you're saying is that its ok for you to speculate that they could beat a bolt-on SS without any evidence...but I can't estimate that they run identical to a stock SS?? Well I guess we'll find out when OP races that guy.