ZL1 / CTS-V Brakes

[JusticePete]

The new Camaro rear rotors and Cadillac CTS-V rotors have been collecting dust long enough. The Castrol SRF arrived today along with the new Cobalt Friction XR1 and XR3 brake pads. We are about to take the Cadillac CTS-V brakes to a new level of excellence.

Cobalt Friction pads are the best we have found. They are race only pads, but I use them all summer long on the street. They are noisy and dirty, but they stop the car hot or cold like no other pad.

SRF is the best of the best. Some will disagree, but the wet boiling point is outstanding.

Brake Fluid Wet / Dry Boiling Point
AP SUPER 600 590°F / 410°F
CASTROL SRF 590°F / 518°F
NEO SUPER DOT 610 610°F / 421°F
MOTUL RACING 600 593°F / 420°F
MOTUL DOT 5.1 509°F / 365°F
ATE SUPER BLUE 536°F / 392°F
VALVOLINE SYNPOWER 503°F 343°F
ATE SL 500°F / 329°F
CASTROL LMA 450°F / 311°F
AP 551 528°F / 288°F

With the thermal management complete and the brake parts and fluid in hand we are almost ready for another day at the track.

Thermal Management Thread

[Bruce@raymondsperformance]

WE just insalled this front brake upgrade last night on the shop car.WOW they are large and they look great.It makes a nice upgrade and I like the fact that the parts are gm.

[Chris_B]

Originally Posted by JusticePete

Brake Fluid Wet / Dry Boiling Point
AP SUPER 600 590°F / 410°F
CASTROL SRF 590°F / 518°F
NEO SUPER DOT 610 610°F / 421°F
MOTUL RACING 600 593°F / 420°F
MOTUL DOT 5.1 509°F / 365°F
ATE SUPER BLUE 536°F / 392°F
VALVOLINE SYNPOWER 503°F 343°F
ATE SL 500°F / 329°F
CASTROL LMA 450°F / 311°F
AP 551 528°F / 288°F

Speaking of great fluids, let's not leave out AP Racing's PRF: 617°F / 399°F. It currently has the best recovery of the top brake fluids on the market (least compressibility after boiling). Many Sprint Cup drivers prefer this fluid based on that property alone.

Also, wet boiling point is nearly irrelevant unless someone is planning on keeping the fluid in the car for more than 2 years. The SAE wet boiling test uses fluid saturated at 3.7% moisture content. Brake fluid, being hygroscopic, will absorb about 1.5% to 2% per year, depending on the climate and heat cycle extremes the fluid experiences. This absorption rate decreases asymptotically to level out at around 5.5%, as the fluid won't absorb much more than that. Anyone keeping their fluid fresh and dry (flushing after track days, not using pressure bleeders without a diaphragm, etc.) will not need to worry about the wet boiling point.

Chris

[Info@PeddersUSA.com]

Originally Posted by Chris_B

Speaking of great fluids, let's not leave out AP Racing's PRF: 617°F / 399°F. It currently has the best recovery of the top brake fluids on the market (least compressibility after boiling). Many Sprint Cup drivers prefer this fluid based on that property alone.

Also, wet boiling point is nearly irrelevant unless someone is planning on keeping the fluid in the car for more than 2 years. The SAE wet boiling test uses fluid saturated at 3.7% moisture content. Brake fluid, being hygroscopic, will absorb about 1.5% to 2% per year, depending on the climate and heat cycle extremes the fluid experiences. This absorption rate decreases asymptotically to level out at around 5.5%, as the fluid won't absorb much more than that. Anyone keeping their fluid fresh and dry (flushing after track days, not using pressure bleeders without a diaphragm, etc.) will not need to worry about the wet boiling point.

Chris

A great point!

mike

[Dr Jkel]

Originally Posted by Chris_B

Speaking of great fluids, let's not leave out AP Racing's PRF: 617°F / 399°F. It currently has the best recovery of the top brake fluids on the market (least compressibility after boiling). Many Sprint Cup drivers prefer this fluid based on that property alone.

Also, wet boiling point is nearly irrelevant unless someone is planning on keeping the fluid in the car for more than 2 years. The SAE wet boiling test uses fluid saturated at 3.7% moisture content. Brake fluid, being hygroscopic, will absorb about 1.5% to 2% per year, depending on the climate and heat cycle extremes the fluid experiences. This absorption rate decreases asymptotically to level out at around 5.5%, as the fluid won't absorb much more than that. Anyone keeping their fluid fresh and dry (flushing after track days, not using pressure bleeders without a diaphragm, etc.) will not need to worry about the wet boiling point.

Chris

So are you saying that the stock brake fluid needs to be replaced every two years? Not very knowledgable in this area. Thanks

[Rob@WretchedMS]

should be yes, more if you are tracking the car.

[Info@PeddersUSA.com]

Originally Posted by Dr Jkel

So are you saying that the stock brake fluid needs to be replaced every two years? Not very knowledgable in this area. Thanks

It is interesting how the domestics do not recommend a brake fluid service, yet most of the popular foreign rides do. Even though the brake fluid system is in fact sealed from the atmosphere, the fluid does become "used up"! And having the fluid exposed to moisture in the air, is seriously bad. Brake fluid is like a desicant when it comes to moisture

mike

[Dr Jkel]

Off the top of your head what does the replacement of the brake fluid usually cost. I have only been on a track one time and I made two laps, until I saw what it was doing to my tires, lol, but I only have about 6600 miles on my car and I have had it for a year, mostly highway driving but an ocassional dusting of some folks around here. So is it the usage or the time that would indicate the need for a change?

[Chris_B]

Originally Posted by Dr Jkel

So are you saying that the stock brake fluid needs to be replaced every two years? Not very knowledgable in this area. Thanks

Absolutely! Not only does the boiling point continually drop, the added moisture increases the change of component corrosion. This would hold true for just about every car on the road. The moisture mostly comes through the OE rubber lines over time. Another good argument for quality stainless steel braided brake lines.

Chris

[Chris_B]

Originally Posted by Dr Jkel

Off the top of your head what does the replacement of the brake fluid usually cost. I have only been on a track one time and I made two laps, until I saw what it was doing to my tires, lol, but I only have about 6600 miles on my car and I have had it for a year, mostly highway driving but an ocassional dusting of some folks around here. So is it the usage or the time that would indicate the need for a change?

Unless you are doing serious track days, once every two years is good. Once per year is a little better. A flush will cost about 3 bottles of brake fluid plus 1 hour labor (well, the better shops anyway!). This could be anywhere from $120 to $200 depending on fluid choice and shop labor rate.

Chris

[JusticePete]

Originally Posted by Dr Jkel

Off the top of your head what does the replacement of the brake fluid usually cost. I have only been on a track one time and I made two laps, until I saw what it was doing to my tires, lol, but I only have about 6600 miles on my car and I have had it for a year, mostly highway driving but an occasional dusting of some folks around here. So is it the usage or the time that would indicate the need for a change?

It depends on which fluid you use. The Castrol SRF is about $65 a bottle on the Internet. Other fluids as low as a couple of bucks. When changing brake fluid on a 2010 Camaro you should cycle the ABS pump to change out that fluid as well. You can use a Tech II tool set to the Corvette chassis for this. If you bring in a high quality fluid, you should also have the shop flush thier power bleeder with your fluid so you are not mixing $3 brake fluid with you $15 fluid.

Doing an anal brake fluid change should not take any more than 90 minutes with a standard brake fluid change no more than an hour. If you know the local shop rate and the cost of the fluid you select you'll have your answer.

[JusticePete]

There are a a number of opinions on which brake fluid is best. My crew swears by Castrol SRF.

All brake fluid is hydrophilic which is a fancy word that means the fluid attracts water out of the air. All brake fluid will have some water in it unless it just came out of a sealed bottle. The amount of water is relative as is the use. If you change out your fluid after every race, you have no need to be concerned about the wet boiling point. If you live in high humidity areas and change your fluid during the track season you should be concerned about wet boiling points. If you change your fluid every two years you should pay attention to wet boiling points.

The engineers and drivers I work with have a strong preference for Castrol SRF. They refer to it as the Gold Standard for brake fluid. When they talk, especially the driver who is putting his lie on the line, I listen. Pedders USA cars track on Castrol SRF.

[JusticePete]

Some one musst really like SRF. I have ordered from four places only to find it is out of stock. The fifth supplier came through today. Now we just have to flush the Camaro and Mustang.

[Sack Rat 2SS]

I have been runing the CTS-V (Z-28) six piston brake package for one year now with nothing but good things to report. ADM Performance was the catalist in doing this upgrade. Included stainless brake lines as well. And the weight of the front Caddie rotors is slightly less than Camaro and the calipers slightly more so it is almost a wash weight wise regarding unsprung. And the more aggressive look helps some as well. Great package for autocross or roadrace. This was an early post fron last year and geting lost but I felt it deserved to be refreshed for others to see. The Silver calipers really show off the package. There is a pic attached here.