Lets make the definitive Harness and racing seat thread!

[White_SS/RS]

And what are we looking at going the SCCA/FIA path?

[Balok]

Originally Posted by tw78911sc

Don't forget rear impact, where the rear of car impacts a barrier, in most racing orgs, a backing plate is necessary to keep people from breaking their neck/backs... I've read other discussions about this, IMO, either go the full SCCA/FIA path, or leave it OEM.

Thanks, I don't remember this being mentioned concerning OEM seats, but I remember a guy putting in a Kirkey seat and welding in a brace. The only organization I've attended events with is Trackdaze and I don't believe they require this safety feature.

[Balok]

Originally Posted by White_SS/RS

And what are we looking at going the SCCA/FIA path?

Most likely a full welded cage, which most of us won't be able or willing to with their cars. But I believe he's saying his opinion is all or nothing and that there's not really a safe place in the middle. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but that's my interpretation.

[Stephen12ZL1]

nice thread

[JOHNSONROD]

good job starting this thread. when i did my interior build, i couldnt find very much definite info on what i should do for HPDEs. i wanted to do one setup that would be good for everything from small club track days to SCCA and NASA events.
its hard to spend 3 grand on safety stuff when you know how much goodies you could get for that coin. it was an easy decision for me because i intend on tracking my car every time i can until im too old to climb in or i wreck it beyond fixing it. other guys who DD or only go every now and then, it would be a harder decision. if your going to do it enough to start running in faster groups, you should start thinking about your safety. lots of guys getting in bad crashes lately.
i went with the RPM road six point cage with a nascar bar added, sparco sprint V fia seats, and 5 point harnesses. im planning on going to 6 point cam loack belts and a head restraint by next season.

[Inferno LSX]

Sparco seats RPM 6 point roll bar and I still need to install the Sparco harnesses. I used the Planted brand seat bracket instead of the Sparco one because with the door bar the seat is to far towards the door. The Planted one had more holes so I was able to make the seats closer to the center console and now I can close and pin the door bars shut no problem.

[Balok]

Originally Posted by Inferno LSX

snip

What model are those seats, and did you gain any headroom by installing them, is it about the same headroom as stock or less? Also, did you install the roll cage yourself or have it done? I've heard they are majorly hard to install in terms of being a real pain in the ass, and you pretty much have to gut the interior to put them in.

[Inferno LSX]

I'd say about the same head room. If I didn't install the sliders I would probably drop down 1" or 1 1/2". The seats are Sparco Chronos. The driver side one is the wider version as I'm not the slimmest Camaro owner.

[White_SS/RS]

Originally Posted by Balok

Most likely a full welded cage, which most of us won't be able or willing to with their cars. But I believe he's saying his opinion is all or nothing and that there's not really a safe place in the middle. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but that's my interpretation.

That's what I'm assuming as well. I can understand the idea of all or nothing but there's a lot of middle ground between a full cage and a 3 point seat belt from the factory. Anything that reduces your chance of injury should be considered.

[Orange Crush 1LE]

Great thread. Wow, a lot of points you'd like to discuss, you don't mess around LOL. I might have to bite on just a few key points.

First, I started off planning on tracking my car often but leaving it stock. Well, that plan got foiled when I became fully addicted to tracking. My advice before you spend too much time analyzing this and figuring out what your own strategy is to get some seat time under your belt with the car stock. It'll give you perspective.

After putting coil overs and R compounds on, the car became very fast on the track. At that point, l realized that there were dangerous crashes from time to time that could seriously injure me if I were to lose control in a bad spot. I would show vids to my lady of my track adventures and noticed that, although I was having fun, she was very worried about me. I have seen a few bad accidents such as a new FRS that must have rolled five or six times at Willow Springs. I think about being there for my kids for years to come, and think about my neighbor that is now in a wheelchair after falling off his roof. That gave me the nudge to have a roll bar welded into my Camaro. A big compromise, yes, as now I have no rear seats. I didn't go as far as a full cage because this car is driven on the street and you really need a helmet or tons of padding if you have a cage. I kept a full interior and AC and this is not a lightened race car, so it's still comfortable and practical to drive to and from the track. My set up is to make my car safe enough and to pass NASA rules, so my set up is more than most may want or need.

Here's what I have evolved to:

WELDED ROLL BAR- l don't believe harness bars are safe
SPARCO EVO SEATS- to accept the 6-point harness; one-piece for strength
6-POINT HARNESS- To prevent submarining and to protect the family jewels
NECKSGEN HEAD AND NECK RESTRAINT- Once you're running a harness, your neck is very vulnerable and you need this or a HANS

I also wear a fire suit, gloves, shoes, and Nomex balaclava and socks.

I will be running a full season of NASA time trials next year, and my car has passed NASA tech inspection. If things go well in time trials and I decide to do wheel to wheel racing the following year then I will need to add a roll cage and a fire suppression system.

I'm close to one end of the spectrum as I'm tracking over 20 days a year. I want to do this for a long time, so I went safe.

[tw78911sc]

Not all "racing seats" ar FIA certified. They are purpose made to absorb a high impact, that being said, without enough rear support even they can snap on a rear impact. Formula/F1 cars or others with a firewall right behind the seat are no issue. Passenger cars/stock cars not so. So then they did the math and determined if the dispersed the impact pressure and the amount of movement a seat can safely endure, SCCA and all other high level of racing orgs require a seat brace. This picture is for "Chump Car" racing, the most entry level racing in the US.

They don't sell FIA folding seats, thus your rear seat is going to be gone unless your remove the seat harness bar when not at the track, and with a roll cage, any impact without a helmet is no bueno. Others have mentioned the dangers of running a harness bar, being bolted solid to the seat and having a roll over and not having the ability to move your head and suffering head/neck injury when the roof caves.

Also, any OEM seat will not have a opening for a submarine belt, and looping it in front of your seat all the way up your crotch will still allow you to move up to the front the the seat before being fully restrained,

so, IMO, either keep it stock and let your air bags work, get a lap belt at most, or go full in with a and wear a helmet around town,

Originally Posted by White_SS/RS

And what are we looking at going the SCCA/FIA path?

[tw78911sc]

OrangeCrush made a great point, want safety, get a HANS device, they have new options that don't depend on a harness to keep it in place, they strap around your chest. I had the unfortunate experience of being a being a coach of a new student, and when he shift exiting a 90 mph corner and shifted from 3 to 2nd instead of 4th, we pounded the pit wall several times, it was a rear end impact, no airbags deployed, the car was a write off and I suffered from a concussion for the next 6 months. I did not have a HANS on and it would have helped my neck from snapping around and mixing up the few decent brain cells I had left.

[ZL1-V]

Originally Posted by Inferno LSX

I'd say about the same head room. If I didn't install the sliders I would probably drop down 1" or 1 1/2". The seats are Sparco Chronos. The driver side one is the wider version as I'm not the slimmest Camaro owner.

I want to see you sit in my seat to get a feeling of how much of a difference there is!

[Inferno LSX]

Originally Posted by ZL1-V

I want to see you sit in my seat to get a feeling of how much of a difference there is!

Ok, I'm 5'8" and my car has the sun roof. I might eventually remove the sliders.