05-26-2011, 07:11 AM | #57 | ||||
Hail to the King baby!
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Again, my POV, the Z28 never used premium materials, never deleted things that made it a great road going car as well. It "selectively" added hardware to make it what it was and prevented you from adding some things that added weight. So unless what you are all asking for is a car you can trailer to the track every weekend and isn't even street legal, you are going to have A/C, etc. And to add build combinations in the assembly plant that now include NOT installing parts would also be costly. This need to take weight out of the car is just Mustang envy. Everyone wants the Camaro to weigh what a Mustang weighs. But is the Boss lightweighted? Is it full of carbon fiber and magnesium parts? Quote:
Because that's what it was designed to do. But it has a radio, full Corvette safety features. But it does have an alumium frame, and CF all over the place. That's why a Z06 carries a $25,000 premium over a base Corvette. Quote:
I'll give you a couple of examples. C5 Z06 had a titanium exhaust. Saved 30 pounds..........................cost over $1,000. Current Corvette has the 2 stage exhaust. Adds 6 HP. Cost? A lot and no weight reduction. GM has to pass Federal Standads for Noise Pass By. And to balance between low mass, low restriction isn't as easy as what you can do in the aftermarket. You have to quit assuming because you can, that GM can. That's not always true. Most aftermarket parts never see the testing GM has to go through to ensure your cars are durable and trouble free. Now that's a weeeeee bit old school there.
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05-26-2011, 10:49 AM | #58 |
Too Many Great Choices
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05-26-2011, 10:51 AM | #59 |
Too Many Great Choices
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Thanks Number 3.
I think as a group we are interested in taking on the Boss at their pricepoint. What Camaro would you/GM build in order to do that? |
05-26-2011, 10:53 AM | #60 |
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What can be done to build a less expensive LS7?
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05-26-2011, 01:24 PM | #61 |
Hail to the King baby!
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Need volume. That's the big reason for the Wixom plant where the LS7/LS9 are hand built. Maybe 4,000 LS7s right now and 1,000 LS9s. Would need substantially more volume for the LS7 to get cheaper.
Or eliminate all those nice titanium goodies on the inside.
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05-26-2011, 01:26 PM | #62 |
Searching for the truth
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Look folks this thread isn't about losing weight. Stop saying the mustang only weighs so much and the Z28 needs to weigh that much, IT WONT HAPPEN. The camaro is a much bigger car. All this talk about losing weight does not help bring the Z28 to life, it only hurts it.
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05-26-2011, 01:44 PM | #63 |
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So Number 3, is it your thought that a Z-28 would have a lightly modified LS3?
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05-26-2011, 02:11 PM | #64 | |
Hail to the King baby!
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Quote:
But to do a Z28 with parts bin engineering and not eliminating anything really already on the car: I'd take some parts from the ZL1. ZL1 Chassis minus the MR Shocks and the ZL1 brakes (big mass increase) would make me happy. That would at least be the foundation. You could go with the FE4 suspension bits. Not really sure the difference in FE4 and ZL1 (excluding MR). I might then add the 2 stage exhaust assuming it could be done with out a big mass penalty and that it in fact added the same HP the Corvette sees. I'd probably limit it to 1SS, but the marketing and sales guys would want you to be able to option the car up for more profit. So option restriction would have to be personal restraint. But to get a little bit of mass out, I'd go 1SS minus the following: Engine cover Sound deadener (mastic patches, spray on etc.) Trunk trim Modfied parts (some would require investment by GM) Thinner dash mat LS manual seats Light weight battery (reduced cold start performance) Thinner glass Lighter (less durable) carpets Lighter weight forged wheels Fixed rear seat (non folding, eliminate the cost and weight for latches) Things you can't touch Airbag or OnStar. Both part of GMs corporate safety strategy. GM shouldn't violate that, even for a Z28. I'd leave the body alone, no CF, no added aluminum etc. Waste of money for the weight reduction from the factory. So if you showed personal restraint in options, my list above might save you 75 to 100 pounds and you'd have a great chassis, brakes and an extra 6 HP. Now the if I was GM or should I say if it were my decision, I'd have ready to sell you through the dealer: CF hood, fenders and decklid. Would run you about 4 to 5,000 (my guess) I'd sell you a GMPP Calibration that would be warrantied (similar to my Sky Redline but that was mostly a boost increase on the Turbo) CAI and Exhaust tuned for a verified HP gain, again warrantied. And with that you'd save maybe another 100 pounds.........maybe, and maybe get 15 or 20 HP bump. So that would be my play. So all in, the Dealer installed bits would run you maybe 7,000 extra and you'd have a car 150 pound lighter and maybe 20 HP up on an LS3, with the chassis and brakes from the ZL1. Hows that?
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05-26-2011, 02:19 PM | #65 | |
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05-26-2011, 02:20 PM | #66 |
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Would have? That sounds a bit more than theoretical to me. I'm just suggesting that if beating the Boss is the play, then you need more HP. How you get it? Good question.
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05-26-2011, 02:25 PM | #67 | |
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I was joking on all of my posts about weight reduction. I just want the car. Number 3, I know the "thunder stealing" Z/28 isn't going to happen until the ZL1 is out and selling. It was brought up before about the 1SS with additional goodies added and I know it would work. |
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05-26-2011, 02:38 PM | #68 | |
Hail to the King baby!
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Quote:
And any wheel that is 25 pounds lighter than stock would be hard pressed to meet GM's standards. Current fronts weigh 31 pounds and the rears are 36. So what you are saying is "easy" is a 6 pound front wheel and an 11 pound rear. Not really possible IMO. The current wheels weigh a combined 134 pounds, saving 100 will be farrrrr from easy.
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Last edited by Number 3; 05-26-2011 at 02:48 PM. |
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05-26-2011, 02:43 PM | #69 | |
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05-26-2011, 02:49 PM | #70 | |
Searching for the truth
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