Help Please

[Valkyrie14]

I use a LSX conversion for my LSA on LS3 block. I have been using a 6 rib belt and a ZL1 lower. I had to install a 220amp alternator, so I thought it was time to convert to 8 rib.

I bought all of the 8 rib pulleys from West Innovators and retained my LSX kit. Everything installed nicely. I started her up and at first it sounded great. So I went inside before taking her for a drive. When I came out there was a loud knock sound and I panicked and shut her down. Then I tried to start her back up and she didn’t want to start. I kept trying, plenty of juice, she just didn’t want to turn over. This is issue #1.

Finally she sluggishly start and ran. I opened the hood to inspect the knocking and I noticed around the crank pulley it was sloppy and the edge of the brand new belt was already worn. I think the knock is actually the belt slapping the crank pulley. Issue #2.

On install I cracked the pigtail for the oil temp sensor, I don’t think this is the source of my issues, but I include it in case it might.

Issue 1, I installed a 0 gauge power wire to the alternator. I clipped out the old alternator wire but left the power wire that runs over by the starter. When I bolted down the power wire to the alternator I just put the old ring with the other power wire on top of it. I used a 0 gauge ground wire from the alternator to the frame. I added a 2 gauge ground wire to the drivers side engine block to the chassis just for added ground. Didn’t add any other wires. Started up the first time with little hesitation. I don’t know?

Issue #2, I noticed the new pulleys are slightly out of line with the upper pulley, and the crank pulley. I might be able to align them with a slimmer shim; but I think the only problem the alignment of the belt is causing is the wear on the edge. The new 8 rib belt is slightly smaller than my old one, I had to adjust the tensioner to get it to fit. The tensioner is almost all the way pushed in, and it is bouncing slightly when running. The lower crank also looks like it wobbles, but it always looked like this. Engine runs smooth when all of this mess isn’t happening. One other detail, the new alternator came with a 6 rib ADP pulley, I swapped it with the Innovators West 8 rib, which is not an ADP. The OEM isn’t an ADP, but since this is a change I am mentioning it.

The belt is a Gates RPM. The alternator is a Powermaster. All good parts.

My next upgrade is a ATI 10% harmonic balancer and 2.55 upper pulley. I don’t know if doing that now will help fix my current issue. Or if getting a bigger belt to let the tensioner go back to a fuller release would fix this. Tomorrow going to try my 6 rib belt on there just to be able to drive. But I need to fix this fast, this is my DD.

[Badbubba]

Did you ever remove the damper or pin it? I'd use a dial indicator and rotate the motor to check values. And, if you can see misalignment with the pulleys, you have a problem.

[Valkyrie14]

I pinned the crank when I installed the LSA. Just one pin, I’m at 600rwhp.

The ZL1 balancer I am using looks like it is wobbling when it runs, but it has looked like this since install 3 years and 40,000 miles ago.
I am going to check my pulleys alignment, because I think they are off slightly.

[bottletalk]

what codes did you get? your car wouldn't turn over....should have something? are all your pulleys aligned? the knock that you heard was it just one knock or constant in rhythm? might just be your belt and pulley alignment, the ribs climbing a pulley, not making it then snapping back? check the alignment with a straight edge and depending what the sound was like remove the belt and check each pulley.

[Valkyrie14]

Originally Posted by bottletalk

what codes did you get? your car wouldn't turn over....should have something? are all your pulleys aligned? the knock that you heard was it just one knock or constant in rhythm? might just be your belt and pulley alignment, the ribs climbing a pulley, not making it then snapping back? check the alignment with a straight edge and depending what the sound was like remove the belt and check each pulley.

It was definitely a rhythm knocking. I am going to check my codes, the CEL did come on.

[Valkyrie14]

Update: the straight edge shows my pulleys are all over the place. The ones on the water pump are in line with each other, but not the alternator or the harmonic balancer. The harmonic balancer and the alternator aren’t in line. On the tensioner side the tensioner and smooth pulleys aren’t in line and aren’t with the upper pulley either.

I am off to the hardware store to try and find some washers of various sizes to try and line everything up with the harmonic balancer and upper pulley.

Car started fine. Pulled codes, all were related to the low power from the old alternator. So I think we can mark the electrical issue as done.

[Valkyrie14]

Does anyone know if ATI damper can be adjusted for alignment?

[acutron42]

Not sure on the damper but I wonder if your noise could be the tensioner slapping if the pulleys are that far out.

[bottletalk]

Originally Posted by Valkyrie14

Does anyone know if ATI damper can be adjusted for alignment?

with a spacer, the damper should be all the way in.

[Valkyrie14]

Originally Posted by bottletalk

with a spacer, the damper should be all the way in.

So the damper can run with a spacer?

I just aligned all of the pulleys using spacers. They are looking good. But the crank pulley is just a bit recessed. So when I started it up the belt starts riding the outer edge of the crank pulley. I’m pretty sure that is the noise, I adjusted the tensioner and I held it while the car was running, pretty sure it isn’t the noise.

I am ready to get an ATI Damper if I can put a spacer behind it to bring it out about a millimeter or two.

[bottletalk]

Originally Posted by Valkyrie14

So the damper can run with a spacer?

I just aligned all of the pulleys using spacers. They are looking good. But the crank pulley is just a bit recessed. So when I started it up the belt starts riding the outer edge of the crank pulley. I’m pretty sure that is the noise, I adjusted the tensioner and I held it while the car was running, pretty sure it isn’t the noise.

I am ready to get an ATI Damper if I can put a spacer behind it to bring it out about a millimeter or two.

doesn't the ati come with .05" shim spacers, call ati to confirm max distance but if alignment is good and the damper is completely on I believe your good as long as it mounts flush.

[Danial]

Originally Posted by Valkyrie14

Update: the straight edge shows my pulleys are all over the place. The ones on the water pump are in line with each other, but not the alternator or the harmonic balancer. The harmonic balancer and the alternator aren’t in line. On the tensioner side the tensioner and smooth pulleys aren’t in line and aren’t with the upper pulley either.

I am off to the hardware store to try and find some washers of various sizes to try and line everything up with the harmonic balancer and upper pulley.

Car started fine. Pulled codes, all were related to the low power from the old alternator. So I think we can mark the electrical issue as done.

I was at work when I saw your first post and if I could have, I would have posted then, to check the pulley alignment. I design and sell belts, pulleys, conveyors and all kinds of power transmission products (including Gates brand).

The belt wear you described is almost always attributed to bad alignment, particularly in a new application.

[Valkyrie14]

Originally Posted by bottletalk

with a spacer, the damper should be all the way in.

Originally Posted by Danial

I was at work when I saw your first post and if I could have, I would have posted then, to check the pulley alignment. I design and sell belts, pulleys, conveyors and all kinds of power transmission products (including Gates brand).

The belt wear you described is almost always attributed to bad alignment, particularly in a new application.

I have the bad alignment down to the lower pulley. When running the belt rides on the outer edge of the pulley and is all over the place.

On the subject of belts, I need a 102” 8 rib performance belt. All I can find is a Dayco.

[Danial]

Originally Posted by Valkyrie14

I have the bad alignment down to the lower pulley. When running the belt rides on the outer edge of the pulley and is all over the place.

On the subject of belts, I need a 102” 8 rib performance belt. All I can find is a Dayco.

What's the Dayco number?

And on another note, most of my industrial clients generally avoid Dayco because of quality control issues. Because of that, I wouldn't use them unless it was all I could find.