SRT Hellcat and Hemi Engines Might Not Survive Through 2019

[el ess A]

Low fuel prices aren't going to help, either. I know they'll help US, but not much incentive for someone to buy a mini car that gets a zillion mpg when they can buy a gas guzzling truck and at least for the time being, spend <50 bucks to fill the tank from dry!

[Red2014SS]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

The flip side of that is small volume cars don't shift the average very much. The calculation formula is intended to weight big sellers more heavily than niche products. And a vehicles footprint factors into the target that it needs to meet. So something like a Hellcat doesn't actually hurt them all that much. Now, the R/T Chargers & Challengers that get only slightly better mileage than the Hellcats yet sell in substantially higher numbers ... those might be a point of concern for FCA.

But an even bigger concern for them should be the poor sales of the Dart. Strong sales of efficient cars like that make it easier to do gas guzzling V8s. GM does fairly well in the compact & subcompact segments, as does Ford. But FCA has been struggling with the Dart, for reasons that I'm not entirely sure of. And the 500 isn't doing that great either. At the moment, they're probably relying on diesel half ton Rams to pull their average up ... which just feels odd.

I don't know whether the linked Yahoo article is hogwash or truth. You make some great points though. The Dart is a disaster. I don't know the sales figures, but the only FCA vehicles I see on the road are Dodge trucks and Challengers. Which, (as unscientific as a personal observation can be), might mean they are in CAFE trouble come 2019. Or, at least in enough trouble that a small volume engine like the Hemi could be pushing them over the edge, fleet average mileage wise. One thing about it, they certainly can't afford a huge fine. Perhaps they need to follow Chevy's lead and start producing a retro styled Dart with a 4 cylinder engine? Might pull them off the bottom, sales and CAFE-wise.

Originally Posted by hammdo

Sounds like a 'internet rumor' marketing ploy to drum up 'mania' to buy (dealer induced) so the dealer(s) can mark it up to crazy $#s ;o).

These are selling, are not in large enough #s to kill the 'averages' MPG and emissions, so, why would they want to kill it? It an attention getter and help sell other versions too...

-Don

Could be. It wouldn't be the first time an auto-maker tried to sandbag the public. I still do wonder why they cancelled all of those 2015 Hellcat orders? Did they under estimate sales potential that much? Or were they already on the edge of current CAFE standards and producing 2000 more 2015 Hellcats wasn't worth the fine? Like DG said, they really don't have a popular fuel efficient sales leader. Trucks and muscle cars might sell well, but Uncle Sam hates both of them. They don't make many Hellcats, but all it takes is one if you are really, really close to failing to meet CAFE.

Or it could just be a load of bull.... just to get us gearheads talking. If so, it worked.

[newmoon]

Originally Posted by Mikebrinda

SRT Hellcat and Hemi Engines Might Not Survive Through 2019

https://www.yahoo.com/autos/s/srt-he...173010561.html

And this is news how? Which of the present line of motors for any of the brands will still be around 4-5 model years from now. I would hope that Dodge isn't sitting around with their thumb up their A!! trying to milk the present hellcat. I think smaller displacement along with turbos will be the future.

[GrandAmGT]

Originally Posted by motorhead

I'll be amazed if chrysler corporation last through 2019.

That's why earlier this year they asked GM to merge with them.

[Blownhotrodder]

The next administration can always change the café requirements.

[stoopid]

CAFE requirements aren't the issue. Eventually, on a long enough timeline, we run out of fossil fuels. This is the reality, like one day we will all be dead. Alternative fuels and solar/electric are the only path forward. The only reason prices are low now are the Saudis driving it down to push the United States (and possibly Russia) temporarily out of the market. Once their wells run dry (largest in the world), we better be ready or we're f%^#$'d. Don't blame people parenting us, we don't seem adult enough to do it ourselves. We are literally being helped against our will because we're short sighted consumers and need the parenting. Equally to blame are the oil companies who directly benefit (profit) from the sale of the very thing even they know is finite, but who have historically resisted any progress in moving to other solutions. Recently oil companies have started to take on a more public role in pursuing alternative energy because, well, I guess reality finally sunk in!

Fwiw - Tesla has already proven you can can build a fun electric vehicle. There will always be toys for the grownups.

As for fuel alternatives, the NA engine may not be dead quite yet. There's some biofuel technology (algae) in the works that could be a direct substitute for petroleum. It may not even require any retrofitting, and could be very low emissions [or at least not add to the problem]. If they can figure out how to make it cheap enough (as of now it's more than oil) we may have a way to have our cake and eat it too.

As for the Hellcats, they're not going anywhere until gas prices get so expensive even people who can drop $60k on a toy can't afford to fill them up.

[hotlap]

Originally Posted by stoopid

CAFE requirements aren't the issue. Eventually, on a long enough timeline, we run out of fossil fuels. This is the reality, like one day we will all be dead. Alternative fuels and solar/electric are the only path forward. The only reason prices are low now are the Saudis driving it down to push the United States (and possibly Russia) temporarily out of the market. Once their wells run dry (largest in the world), we better be ready or we're f%^#$'d. Don't blame people parenting us, we don't seem adult enough to do it ourselves. We are literally being helped against our will because we're short sighted consumers and need the parenting. Equally to blame are the oil companies who directly benefit (profit) from the sale of the very thing even they know is finite, but who have historically resisted any progress in moving to other solutions. Recently oil companies have started to take on a more public role in pursuing alternative energy because, well, I guess reality finally sunk in!

Fwiw - Tesla has already proven you can can build a fun electric vehicle. There will always be toys for the grownups.

As for fuel alternatives, the NA engine may not be dead quite yet. There's some biofuel technology (algae) in the works that could be a direct substitute for petroleum. It may not even require any retrofitting, and could be very low emissions [or at least not add to the problem]. If they can figure out how to make it cheap enough (as of now it's more than oil) we may have a way to have our cake and eat it too.

As for the Hellcats, they're not going anywhere until gas prices get so expensive even people who can drop $60k on a toy can't afford to fill them up.

I've been hearing that the world will run out of fossil fuels since the mid 70s with predictions that it would have already happened by now. Know sources continue to spike. This is BP's twenty year projection
http://www.bp.com/content/dam/bp/pdf...35_booklet.pdf

[Gary24]

I thought you meant because they break down. Hahaha.

[hockeylover86]

Originally Posted by Red2014SS

I don't know whether the linked Yahoo article is hogwash or truth. You make some great points though. The Dart is a disaster. I don't know the sales figures, but the only FCA vehicles I see on the road are Dodge trucks and Challengers. Which, (as unscientific as a personal observation can be), might mean they are in CAFE trouble come 2019. Or, at least in enough trouble that a small volume engine like the Hemi could be pushing them over the edge, fleet average mileage wise. One thing about it, they certainly can't afford a huge fine. Perhaps they need to follow Chevy's lead and start producing a retro styled Dart with a 4 cylinder engine? Might pull them off the bottom, sales and CAFE-wise.




Could be. It wouldn't be the first time an auto-maker tried to sandbag the public. I still do wonder why they cancelled all of those 2015 Hellcat orders? Did they under estimate sales potential that much? Or were they already on the edge of current CAFE standards and producing 2000 more 2015 Hellcats wasn't worth the fine? Like DG said, they really don't have a popular fuel efficient sales leader. Trucks and muscle cars might sell well, but Uncle Sam hates both of them. They don't make many Hellcats, but all it takes is one if you are really, really close to failing to meet CAFE.

Or it could just be a load of bull.... just to get us gearheads talking. If so, it worked.

They didn't cancel the orders completely, they just moved them into the 2016 orders. This was done because FCA didn't have the order system set up with allocations, from what i understand it was wide open and unlimited # of orders could be placed.

There is a limit of parts that the suppliers can provide once tooled up, and you just cant add another 25%-50% capacity at the drop of a hat. Not without expediting charges/tooling charges that would eat up the profit margin and make it not worth the end sales.

Even doubling the capacity for MY2016 (as FCA has recently announced they will do) will be a stretch on such short timing..

[enzia35]

Originally Posted by hockeylover86

The article is pure BS.

As long as HP sells, the mfg's will build them, and the Hellcat clearly sells.

The current gen Hellcat is in the middle of its 3 year run, and gen-II cars are in testing now.

Bet on the 6.2 SC having even more power in 2018, not a V6..

Blame the .gov! The .gov will eventually force them to stop making them.

[shine2013]

That's sad to read. Those 2015 Challengers are beautiful. Saw a Hellcat in person and loved it.

[nester7929]

I don't think Ford is immune to this either. The fact that their flagship car has a twin turbo V6 says volumes about the direction they will go in.

[hockeylover86]

Originally Posted by nester7929

I don't think Ford is immune to this either. The fact that their flagship car has a twin turbo V6 says volumes about the direction they will go in.

The choice of the 3.5TT for the FGT was due to the Le Mans engine size limits (4.0L for FI).

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by nester7929

I don't think Ford is immune to this either. The fact that their flagship car has a twin turbo V6 says volumes about the direction they will go in.

That is marketing, pure & simple. Ford is going all in on Ecoboast & this is the result.