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Old 05-06-2009, 11:45 PM   #57
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Originally Posted by FirstLSK View Post
OldTimer -- It may help some other unsuspecting victim if you would post this dealers name.
agreed... let us know what dealership it is that did that and we'll all flood their email boxes with complaints and notices about how bad of a dealership they are for doing that to an enthusiast.
got tequila?
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Old 05-06-2009, 11:50 PM   #58
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Thank you very much Fbodfather. to the post about the dealer charging extra... you had to expect something like that would happen with all the hype the car has been generating, is it fair they just sprung that on you? no not at all. But if you ordered a car with an open "sales ticket" then your kind of asking for trouble IMO. I had the same situation where the salesman and sales manager said they were selling at MSRP we had an agreed upon sales prices signed by both, but i get a call a few days later from the general sales manager saying they are selling the car 15k above *yes 15k* msrp and that he was supposed to be handling all orders for the camaros and his staff was misinformed. Long story not so long I will be waiting for my car. New cars ALWAYS have problems we should all expect that and I will have mine soon enough
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Old 05-06-2009, 11:50 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by FenwickHockey65 View Post
He just did. The earliest orders are still being retrofitted with updates.
Sorry. I was typing when he replied. It just makes me nervous that it takes a rioting mob to get an answer for something like this.
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Old 05-06-2009, 11:50 PM   #60

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Originally Posted by FenwickHockey65 View Post
The earliest orders are still being retrofitted with updates.

This really sums it up....but some people just cant seem to understand it.
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Old 05-06-2009, 11:52 PM   #61
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Originally Posted by Toons View Post
Ok, can I just have my car now?
Please tell me that was a joke...
Originally Posted by FenwickHockey65 View Post
Not the place for this...and horribly disrespectful.

Thanks Fbod for being on this site even though you don't have to be. I don't see where you find the energy to do your job, and take all these questions at the same time. A true enthusiast!
I am seriously never serious vv V vv Next order of business

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Old 05-06-2009, 11:54 PM   #62

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Originally Posted by fbodfather View Post
And we will not violate the laws of individual states or federal law..........

Now – I know I’m going to get flamed AGAIN……..

...........and I know that some won’t believe what I’ve just written….

..........and there are those who have opinions even though they have never worked in this industry, and thus, while it’s every person’s God Given Right to have an opinion – it is not necessarily so that the opinion has ANYTHING to do with fact.
I know you're talking about me but I was never flaming you. I respect you but I just happened to disagree based on the information that I have (which may be wrong of course, it just doesn't seem so). Regardless, I never meant to offend you and am truly sorry if I did.

Also, THANK YOU for your hard work.

I had nothing to do with building this car and it gets irritating watching people try and make it look as terrible as possible *cough*ChallengerTalk*cough* (Note: not everyone there is bad, just some have strong "opinions").

Regardless, I think the Camaro will be a fantastic car that's just experiencing the normal growing pains of any car at this point.
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Old 05-06-2009, 11:56 PM   #63

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Originally Posted by fbodfather View Post
Because yours is an early car.

We are retrofitting the early cars.

Would you rather that we ship the car to your dealer with things that we don't think are acceptable?

Reflashes, for example, do not take 5 minutes. Done properly, they take a substantial amount of time.

We ARE motivated to get them out as quick as possible...we don't want upset customers -- and we don't want to tie up money by parking cars in a lot somewhere and just letting them sit.

I'm sorry you're upset......we're turning them around as fast as we can.
I've been wondering about this too. Granted, I didn't order until February, but I agree with all of the October-ers that still don't have their car yet. I guess this answers it then.

I do wonder though... has the production line been updated due to the battery wiring recall? Or do all cars need to have the "fix" installed?

Thanks for the posts, Scott.
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Old 05-07-2009, 12:27 AM   #64
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It sounds as if fbodfather is high up on the food chain but still takes time to write everyone (ever think about twitter fbodfather?). I wish I ordered early but ended up ordering recently. I was told I might not get mine until after August and my family teases me that I might get it in time to store it for the winter but I will gladly wait. You all have bragging rights to say you ordered yours when the rest of the world was in hibernation. This is what the go getters do, pave the path for the rest of us. Remind yourself also that if it wasn't for all those early orders this concept car would be a hazy memory instead of a piece of history you can actually own! Feel proud to be the owner of a working piece of art with all the bells and whistles of American History! If you are just looking to be the "first one on the block to have this car" then go to the dealers and take what is there. Thank you fbodfather for taking the time to feed us with great info and don't let a few rotten apples spoil it for the bunch of us red delicious ones.
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Old 05-07-2009, 12:34 AM   #65
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And here's the minority party's rebuttal to GM party's State of the Union address

Originally Posted by fbodfather View Post
Additionally, it would allow us to gauge early option and model volumes - -which is always one of the most difficult tasks to do on a new vehicle program. When we announced the program, we said we’d build each of these cars by no later than the third quarter. We’re on target to meet or beat that date with over ½ of these orders now either placed for production, in production, in transit, or in the owner’s driveway.
This should have been made more clear. When you said things like "we want you (collectively) behind the wheels of your Camaros AS SOON AS POSSIBLE!" to the average person that means that you are actually taking steps to make this happen, not just using us as guinea pigs. Nowhere did the official documentation state any of this. And, when you preorder something, it is assumed that yours will be among the first delivered.
Originally Posted by fbodfather View Post
So the decision was made to build one Camaro for each dealership – and that further, we’d attempt to get this ‘one Camaro per dealer’ out there by May 6th so that Chevy Dealers nationwide could invite their local Camaro/Firebird/Corvette owners – and others – to come and see the new Camaro – get in and out of it – and get to know it better.

We also found out in the pre-order activity that the V8 percentage was even higher than we’d thought it would be – so we also decided to make the “one Camaro per dealer’ a V6 – thereby accomplishing two objectives:
1. To preserve the V8 components for ‘R6P’ orders
2. To put a V6 in the showroom so that people who would not normally think about Camaro – would see the car – see the value – and perhaps purchase one. (we need to continue to sell Camaros in volume – and that means ‘conquest’ sales.)

(by the way – anyone who spent any time at an auto show this year will tell you that the American Public at large is in LOVE with the new Camaro – AND – when asked to guess the price, they’re always thousands of dollars higher than the actual price……….therefore, the V6 is the right car to put in a showroom early on.)

One last word or two (or more) about the Engines. Early on, conjecture on the boards was that we could not build enough V8s to meet demand. We countered with ‘no – that’s not true’ – and shortly thereafter announced we were going to build a V6 for each dealer. That started conjecture that R6P orders with V6s would be delayed. That wasn’t true either – but it certainly gave peoples’ blood pressure a test! And it caused many people to use bad words!—all for naught.
I don’t think most of us really have a problem with the one-per-dealer decision. Not everyone agrees with it but it’s not the real point of contention.
Originally Posted by fbodfather View Post

Now – we also know that ‘sharing’ information with you is a two-sided sword. Examples:

>The very early ‘first photo’ of the White Camaro in a garage – it was grainy – taken with a poor-quality cell-phone --- and I dare say that the Enthusiast Community at large lost its collective mind. HORRIBLE comments – and when I said “Please – don’t make a judgement until you see it in person” – well, -- you would have thought we’d broken into an orphanage and stolen all of the toys!

>Then someone took some pictures of very early IVER units in Europe – you may recall the pictures – there was a Camaro on a car carrier – and someone opened the door and snapped away. (This came to be known as the ‘shunt’ photo) -- You would have thought we’d broken into an orphanage, stolen all of the toys, and slapped a Nun or two! Again – I said “this is not a finished car – please withhold your judgement” – and there may have been even worse things said about me and everyone at GM!

>and then there were the headlights! So upsetting were they that we even got our own ‘smiley’ on this site that declared: “NOT THE REAL HEADLIGHTS!” -- and again, I said: “They are NOT the real headlights – please wait until you see the car…..” And two months later, we’d get a ‘newbie’ on the site ranting about the headlights!

…………….now – I could go on and on about the various (what I like to call ) “Panics du Jour.”
Are you really giving examples of spy shots as to why GM shouldn’t share information? Why not give those spy shots to the public before they can even become an issue? What if you just posted more flattering pictures along with explanations that the interior wasn’t anywhere close to final and that the headlights were just for testing and the final ones weren’t finished? None of the panic would have happened!!! They've already let writers test Volt mules so it looks like the Camaro is being surpassed in the early information game.
Originally Posted by fbodfather View Post

Why --- just last weekend, we had a ‘tragedy/panic du jour’ when someone reported that the front fascias would split in the corners when you drive fast. Evidently no one thought about the pictures of Camaro at the ‘ring – or that the Camaro has served as a pace car at several NASCAR races thusfar and has accumulated hundreds of miles at very high speeds…………………………and then you found out that the fascia on this car was a pre-production fascia……………….and thankfully, the thread was changed to reflect this. THE BAD NEWS IS that people read it early on this thread – went to OTHER sites – and posted similar threads – and guess what? Most of them have still not been corrected. The damage is done!
Actually several people DID post that. Pictures were even posted of the pace cars showing no damage.
Originally Posted by fbodfather View Post

Now the latest: [/U][/B]

Some of you – rightfully so – want your Camaros!

…..and you want ‘em NOW!

………………….and we understand that.

However, nothing is ever quite as simple as it seems.

Yes – there are Camaros being built for one Rental Agency - AVIS. AVIS buys tens of thousands of cars and trucks from us EACH YEAR....

They are good customers as well…..

......and when they say “OK – we’ll buy XXXX number of *insert brand name here* IF you will get us 200 Camaros last week! – well – we DO have a business to run.

Yes – there are a few dealers out there that have taken more orders than they were allocated. We’re trying to get to the bottom of that issue……..

Yes – there are several customers out there that ordered multiple units - - ordering one unit at multiple dealers – so that when one came in, they’d be one of the first to have a new Camaro. (…….leaving a Camaro for that dealer to sell – which is a good thing if you find one – but NOT such a good thing if you were, say, number 5 on a dealer’s list -- and the individuals who did this were ahead of you…….).

Yes – there are some on this very site that have claimed to have had a new Camaro on order – notice I used ‘plural’ in this sentence – and when asked for their order number – well – they didn’t actually order one! But they won’t tell YOU that……….

And Yes! We should be building Camaros at a faster rate – but again, quality must be the beacon in everything we do.

We DO value you.

We DO want to make you happy.

However, we cannot just place every R6P order right now – because we can’t build them all RIGHT NOW – but we WILL get them built – and we hope to have most of you behind the steering wheels of your new Camaros just as soon as possible.
Again, more responses to non-issues. We know we can’t all have them NOW. We know not all dealers and customers are always ethical. The problem is that orders are still being entered into the system and placed….. right now……..that are going ahead of people that ordered several months ago. Why? >>>>
Originally Posted by fbodfather View Post
And we will not violate the laws of individual states or federal law..........
This is the stock response it seems. Blame it on the heavy hand of government. Then please explain how you were able to build all those cars for Avis? Shouldn’t they have to be evenly spread out? How come several NASCAR drivers got early cars? How come Dr. Phil and Jay Leno are getting the hook up? Do these same laws have a provision that states “If you’re incredibly rich, GM can build a car for you ahead of all the stupid normal people”? This just doesn’t add up. If you can do it for celebrities, you can do it for the not-so-celebrities that unwittingly agreed to be your guinea pigs.

Last edited by UCF w00t; 05-07-2009 at 01:10 AM.
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Old 05-07-2009, 12:36 AM   #66

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I'd like to thank you for all that you've done to keep is informed and calm our fears.
I've asked about you at every car show I have attended, but unfortunately you have never been there at the same time as me. I would love to meet you some day and will continue to ask when I go to the shows. Every time I have asked about you, everyone has always gone on to tell me how wonderful you are.

I'd also like to thank GM for putting out the recall on the battery cable so quickly. We have only hear about 1 incident and most company's wait for it to be an overwhelming number of reports before they think about issuing one. This truly does tell me that GM values quality. I know that a lot of people are tired of waiting on their pre-orders, but I for one would be glad to know that once I get my car I shouldn't have to keep bringing it back to the dealership to fix these little details that GM has caught so early. Maybe I'm drinking kool-aid, but I truly believe that GM wants to get this car right so that when we all do finally get our Camaro's we will be more than satisfied with them.
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Old 05-07-2009, 12:41 AM   #67
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You have the "Patience of Jobe" --- you're in the right job.

IMHO some of the members on this forum are dumber than a post (I, obviously, haven't developed a charitable attitude) and they NEVER will "get it".

I think some of these bloggers have no real personality outside of this "anonymous" commentary --- and it seems to bring some of the worst out.

You (and John Fitzpatrick in the FastLane site) have explained everything in a clear, understandable way --- but, still we hear the same illogical rants.

You guys keep up the great work --- I don't think I could still be so nice!!
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Old 05-07-2009, 01:04 AM   #68

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All I can say is that I was blown away by your write up. As a fairly new member here, I feel honored to have someone in the know actually take the time to address so many concerns that are flying around cyber space. Your car truely is a work of art that has no equal. THANK YOU!

I have not had the pleasure of driving it, nor have I seen all the colors in person. I do know that I can't wait for sometime in late August or early September to get that call saying that my 2SSRS is in and to come pick her up. I have owned several GM products over the years, and will continue to do so as long as you're able to provide them.

Please keep doing what you do best so we can enjoy it for what it is, the BEST dang Camaro ever!
UNDER CONSTRUCTION......again......
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Old 05-07-2009, 01:13 AM   #69

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I understand and respect you, fbodfather.

Thank you for taking the time to talk to all of us.

I'm in for the long haul.
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Old 05-07-2009, 01:28 AM   #70
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Thank you so much for taking the time to write this post, answering the responses to this post as well as the countless other posts you contribute to on this forum. This was a very honest, thought out and from the heart appeal for understanding and many of us appreciate it very much.

But as they say, unfortunately, you can't please all the people all the time.

I, for one, appreciate the fact that GM is taking the time to make sure to make sure that all our Camaros are delivered to us close to perfect as possible. I'm sure that this is the majority sentiment. I would be classified as a "conquest" sale as the Camaro I ordered will not only be my first GM vehicle, but the first domestic vehicle I have purchased. I've only owned 3 other cars, but nonetheless.

I have been logging into this forum many times daily over the past several months and appreciate the contributions that you, Number 3 and other GM employees bring to this forum.

GM is doing the right thing. I am glad you know that. So will all those on here that are bitching at the moment when they eventually take delivery of their Camaros and they find that it was worth the wait and the posts start coming in hand over fist proclaiming "this new Camaro FAR exceeds my expectations".

Thank You!
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