Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums - Camaro5.com
 
JDP Motorsports
Go Back   Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums - Camaro5.com > Members Area > General Automotive + Other Cars Discussion

General Automotive + Other Cars Discussion Come chat about other cars.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 04-05-2013, 08:17 PM   #1
KMPrenger


 
KMPrenger's Avatar
 
Drives: '10 ABM LT/RS, 06 Chevy Colorado
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Jefferson City, Missouri
Posts: 9,581
So maybe the N/A V6 isn't quite dead after all?

New MT article states GM, along with new I-3 and I-4 engines, is working on a family of next gen V6 engines.

http://wot.motortrend.com/gm-investi...#axzz2PdYCPHqM

I for one, feel the N/A V6 is in more danger of going MIA than the V8, as modern Turbo 4s are producing horsepower levels well in the acceptable range of a decent V6, and torque levels greater than high-performance N/A V6 engines. V8s on the other hand, still have a big purpose in the world of trucks and sports cars and I don't see them going away anytime soon.

So with that in mind, the above article got my attention. I'm wondering if the new 4.3 V6 is considered as the first of the new "family" of next gen V6 engines. I'm betting we see cylinder de-activation across the line, which is what the 4.3 also has.

I've been hoping for a good V6 offering in the 6th gen. Offering a strong, good revving 340 - 350 HP, 280 - 300 TQ V6 engine for sedans and the next gen Camaro would be awesome in my mind, and with cylinder deactivation would achieve great mpgs. (just make it so that if we put her in sport mode....there is NO cylinder de-activation! )

The 4.3 with its greater torque range would remain for truck duty.

I'm looking forward to seeing more about this.
__________________
IPF Tune, Custom Magnaflow Exhaust, Vararam intake, MACE Ported Manifold, RX Ported TB, "Black Ice" manifold insulator, Elite Catch Can, ZL1 repro wheels, ZL1 Springs, DRL Harness, Front GM GFX, Heritage grill, Street Scene lower grill, NLP Spoiler, ZL1 rockers and much more!
KMPrenger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2013, 12:16 AM   #2
RubyCamaro
SSlayer
 
RubyCamaro's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Camaro 1LT Red Jewel tintcoat
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Springfield, TN
Posts: 13,543
Cool! & interesting
__________________
RubyCamaro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2013, 04:56 AM   #3
revychevy
 
revychevy's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 2SS RS LS3
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: St Louis mo.
Posts: 271
What about Turbo V6? Don't understand why Turbo 4 bangers are always compared to NA V6's
__________________
2SS RS bone stock for now...
revychevy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2013, 12:19 PM   #4
KMPrenger


 
KMPrenger's Avatar
 
Drives: '10 ABM LT/RS, 06 Chevy Colorado
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Jefferson City, Missouri
Posts: 9,581
Quote:
Originally Posted by revychevy View Post
What about Turbo V6? Don't understand why Turbo 4 bangers are always compared to NA V6's
It is because that is what the Turbo 4 is made to replace...the N/A V6. The Turbo V6 is made to replace the V8. You get the power of the larger engine, with greater efficency when not in boost....(at least in most applications).

You can't compare the T4 to a T6 because its basically like comparing an N/A V6 to an N/A V8.
__________________
IPF Tune, Custom Magnaflow Exhaust, Vararam intake, MACE Ported Manifold, RX Ported TB, "Black Ice" manifold insulator, Elite Catch Can, ZL1 repro wheels, ZL1 Springs, DRL Harness, Front GM GFX, Heritage grill, Street Scene lower grill, NLP Spoiler, ZL1 rockers and much more!
KMPrenger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2013, 01:07 PM   #5
BaylorCamaro
Track > 1/4 Mile
 
BaylorCamaro's Avatar
 
Drives: 2013 ZL1
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Kemah, TX
Posts: 5,242
Quote:
Originally Posted by KMPrenger View Post
It is because that is what the Turbo 4 is made to replace...the N/A V6. The Turbo V6 is made to replace the V8. You get the power of the larger engine, with greater efficency when not in boost....(at least in most applications).

You can't compare the T4 to a T6 because its basically like comparing an N/A V6 to an N/A V8.


Sure is interesting. Can't wait to see what happens!
BaylorCamaro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2013, 02:34 PM   #6
DGthe3
Moderator.ca
 
DGthe3's Avatar
 
Drives: 05 Grand Am GT
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Niagara, Canada
Posts: 22,181
Send a message via MSN to DGthe3
Quote:
Originally Posted by KMPrenger View Post
New MT article states GM, along with new I-3 and I-4 engines, is working on a family of next gen V6 engines.

http://wot.motortrend.com/gm-investi...#axzz2PdYCPHqM

I for one, feel the N/A V6 is in more danger of going MIA than the V8, as modern Turbo 4s are producing horsepower levels well in the acceptable range of a decent V6, and torque levels greater than high-performance N/A V6 engines. V8s on the other hand, still have a big purpose in the world of trucks and sports cars and I don't see them going away anytime soon.

So with that in mind, the above article got my attention. I'm wondering if the new 4.3 V6 is considered as the first of the new "family" of next gen V6 engines. I'm betting we see cylinder de-activation across the line, which is what the 4.3 also has.

I've been hoping for a good V6 offering in the 6th gen. Offering a strong, good revving 340 - 350 HP, 280 - 300 TQ V6 engine for sedans and the next gen Camaro would be awesome in my mind, and with cylinder deactivation would achieve great mpgs. (just make it so that if we put her in sport mode....there is NO cylinder de-activation! )

The 4.3 with its greater torque range would remain for truck duty.

I'm looking forward to seeing more about this.
I'm kinda 50-50 on whether the 4.3 will be the new generation of V6s mentioned or if they are talking about a new set of 60 degree V6s for use in passenger cars & crossovers. After all, it is an all new V6 engine design but at the same time, the current High-Feature V6 family is a decade old (slightly older than the gen IV small block in fact) and so is due for replacement pretty soon.

Chances are slim that we'll see V6s that can run in V4 mode in passenger cars. GM seems to like the idea of sticking to 60 degree DOHC V6s for their cars & crossovers, but leaving the big v8-derrived, pushrod activated 90 degree V6s for trucks. GM's AFM system requires the engine to use pushrods. Honda has an overhead cam cylinder deactivation system but it shuts down an entire bank of cylinders. I can only imagine the trickery that must go on to keep the unwanted vibrations to a minimum.

What I would like to see with the next gen of V6s is a small 3.1L that cranks out around 270 hp/230 ft-lbs with reasonable efficiency (probably besting the 2L turbos). That would be enough for most of the smaller vehicles that use V6s. But then have a larger one, say 3.8L, that is up at about 350 hp and 290 ft-lbs (like you mentioned) for full size cars, large crossovers, and the Camaro. Off the large one, you can make your turbo6 with similar output as the LT1 V8, for applications where it doesn't make sense to actually use the V8. There would be no point in doing a turbo version of the smaller one as it would likely barely best the big V6 in output.

Quote:
Originally Posted by revychevy View Post
What about Turbo V6? Don't understand why Turbo 4 bangers are always compared to NA V6's
Because turbo 4s and NA 6s are usually offer similar hp & torque output.
__________________
Note, if I've gotten any facts wrong in the above, just ignore any points I made with them
__________________
don't believe a thing you read about the next gen Camaro -- as history has proven time and time again:

WE DO NOT TALK ABOUT FUTURE PRODUCT PLANS PERIOD FbodFather
__________________

Camaro5 Fest sub-forum
DGthe3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2013, 05:16 PM   #7
KMPrenger


 
KMPrenger's Avatar
 
Drives: '10 ABM LT/RS, 06 Chevy Colorado
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Jefferson City, Missouri
Posts: 9,581
Quote:
Originally Posted by DGthe3 View Post
I...

What I would like to see with the next gen of V6s is a small 3.1L that cranks out around 270 hp/230 ft-lbs with reasonable efficiency (probably besting the 2L turbos). That would be enough for most of the smaller vehicles that use V6s. But then have a larger one, say 3.8L, that is up at about 350 hp and 290 ft-lbs (like you mentioned) for full size cars, large crossovers, and the Camaro. Off the large one, you can make your turbo6 with similar output as the LT1 V8, for applications where it doesn't make sense to actually use the V8. There would be no point in doing a turbo version of the smaller one as it would likely barely best the big V6 in output. ...
I really agree with this very much, and I was thinking something very similar.

If they really are making a new family of V6 engines, then this makes perfect sense to me. A 3.1 and a 3.8 or something similar would be perfect, damn I'd love that.

I remember the old 3.1 in my 96 Grand Prix. Totally different design of course, but it got awesome mileage.
__________________
IPF Tune, Custom Magnaflow Exhaust, Vararam intake, MACE Ported Manifold, RX Ported TB, "Black Ice" manifold insulator, Elite Catch Can, ZL1 repro wheels, ZL1 Springs, DRL Harness, Front GM GFX, Heritage grill, Street Scene lower grill, NLP Spoiler, ZL1 rockers and much more!
KMPrenger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2013, 05:55 PM   #8
NASTY99Z28
 
Drives: 99z28 with bolt-ons and a mwc fab 9
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Florida
Posts: 607
Quote:
Originally Posted by DGthe3 View Post
I'm kinda 50-50 on whether the 4.3 will be the new generation of V6s mentioned or if they are talking about a new set of 60 degree V6s for use in passenger cars & crossovers. After all, it is an all new V6 engine design but at the same time, the current High-Feature V6 family is a decade old (slightly older than the gen IV small block in fact) and so is due for replacement pretty soon.

Chances are slim that we'll see V6s that can run in V4 mode in passenger cars. GM seems to like the idea of sticking to 60 degree DOHC V6s for their cars & crossovers, but leaving the big v8-derrived, pushrod activated 90 degree V6s for trucks. GM's AFM system requires the engine to use pushrods. Honda has an overhead cam cylinder deactivation system but it shuts down an entire bank of cylinders. I can only imagine the trickery that must go on to keep the unwanted vibrations to a minimum.

What I would like to see with the next gen of V6s is a small 3.1L that cranks out around 270 hp/230 ft-lbs with reasonable efficiency (probably besting the 2L turbos). That would be enough for most of the smaller vehicles that use V6s. But then have a larger one, say 3.8L, that is up at about 350 hp and 290 ft-lbs (like you mentioned) for full size cars, large crossovers, and the Camaro. Off the large one, you can make your turbo6 with similar output as the LT1 V8, for applications where it doesn't make sense to actually use the V8. There would be no point in doing a turbo version of the smaller one as it would likely barely best the big V6 in output.


Because turbo 4s and NA 6s are usually offer similar hp & torque output.
Why a 3.1 with less power? A 3.8 would be the same size dimensionally and fuel mileage would probably be to close and not justify the lack of power. Plus if they stick with one engine it will be cheaper to produce.
__________________
He is like the jedi night of gayness. If hitler and henry ford had a special needs child together it would probably be the pill.
NASTY99Z28 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2013, 08:24 AM   #9
scrming
Red Brick of Vengeance!
 
scrming's Avatar
 
Drives: 12 Second Brick
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: at my pulpit
Posts: 7,742
Quote:
Originally Posted by DGthe3 View Post
Because turbo 4s and NA 6s are usually offer similar hp & torque output.
Just put my 2.0L 4 cylinder EcoBoost on the dyno this last Saturday. Only performance mods are a 93 octane tune and an axle back exhaust

Blue - Stock Tune
RED - 93 Octane Tune




While the peak HP number isn't stupendous, the TQ number is pretty amazing, IMHO... Not sure what the drive train loss is on a FWD car... so even at an 8% loss, you are looking at about 265 HP / 350 TQ at the crank...
scrming is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:29 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.