[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by J_MaherAMG

To be honest, after re-reading my original post and comments I feel a little ashamed. I apologize for my comments towards you, and hope you will accept it, as they weren't fair. I try to be reasonable at all times, but I guess sometimes emotions can get the best of me and I don't think before I speak so to say. That doesn't excuse what I said or make it ok, but I do recognize mistakes when I make them. It was also nice to get a little insight as to your personal life, and as a health care professional I can conclude that you are a better person than I gave you credit for, and for that I apologize as well.

I can see why it wouldn't be a desirable car for you, and don't blame you for not liking it. I also agree that it could be considered just as much of a "one trick pony" as the Hellcat, as it certainly isn't breaking any drag racing records. To be 100% honest, when I bought my R, I have said to my father numerous times (who has a 15 Z51 Vette that I helped him spec), that his car has far more to offer in terms of comfort, build quality, interior materials, etc. and that for the amount I paid for my R it should have some aspects of the interior upgraded compared to the basic models.

In terms of the trash-talking and other facets, I have never been a party to that stuff. I've never been a Mustang fan really, have never considered buying one or owning one until this car. I wouldn't have been around when they poked fun at Hellcat ADM's, hell I wasn't aware that they also had to deal with that. From the outside it seems Ford is perfectly happy selling the inferior car in terms of performance, the only they care about is money really. They sell a slightly lower performing car for a little cheaper, and from the sales figures it looks like the lower price probably makes the difference. Those of us on the forums are the enthusiasts, but there are tons of buyers out there for almost all cars who just want to get something to be seen in, or just to cruise around in who don't care at all about just how capable even the 5.0 and SS are nowadays.

I've always been an enthusiast, and love cars with a passion. If I had enough money I would be like clone of Jay Leno... LOL I know some of the guys are giving that one fella a hard time, but I don't mind his posts as I've mentioned numerous times. If someone can debate and discuss different cars without getting too heated, I don't mind that one bit as it makes things interesting!

Cheers!

Thank you for being civil. And much respect to you for the apology, especially on a forum. I'll keep things civil with you from here out. And I hope you stick around.

Back when I was in the search for my next car I looked around and felt that the Camaro SS and Mustang GTs no longer could offer what I wanted in terms of performance. I wanted to take it to the next level. I told my friends I would get one of the "big boys" next. So that led me to consider everything out there from M4s to Z06s to GTRs and everything in between. I wrote off the GT350R because they were all in the $90K and up range. At that price I was not getting a Mustang (no offense meant at all). I then considered the regular GT350. I saw many of them in used condition with low miles for around low 50s. I really thought about it but I just could not get over the fact that it was only a 12.2 sec car. And like I said, I know it isn't built for that. But I take lots of trips to Mexico, nahm sayin...lol!! And another thing that I disliked is that there is no sunroof option, no heated/cooled seats, no heated steering wheel, no automatic trans (got tired of dealing with manual trans for years) and not even a convertible option. All of those are must haves for me and I could not justify paying that much and sacrificing the things I feel are important. And even after all that I still tried to talk myself into it but I just couldn't do it man. So as luck would have it, one random day my friend who is a car salesman told me he had a ZL1 coming in and that it had every option I wanted...sunroof, A10, nav, PDR, and a bunch of other stuff all at MSRP, I jumped on it. And I feel that this is the best car buying decision I have ever made in my life. Sorry for the long story. I just wanted to give you some insight into what makes me tick.

But I do feel that Ford will step their game up in the very near future. I feel that they will come back swinging for the fences.

[VAZL1]

Originally Posted by J_MaherAMG

To be honest, after re-reading my original post and comments I feel a little ashamed. I apologize for my comments towards you, and hope you will accept it, as they weren't fair. I try to be reasonable at all times, but I guess sometimes emotions can get the best of me and I don't think before I speak so to say. That doesn't excuse what I said or make it ok, but I do recognize mistakes when I make them. It was also nice to get a little insight as to your personal life, and as a health care professional I can conclude that you are a better person than I gave you credit for, and for that I apologize as well.

I can see why it wouldn't be a desirable car for you, and don't blame you for not liking it. I also agree that it could be considered just as much of a "one trick pony" as the Hellcat, as it certainly isn't breaking any drag racing records. To be 100% honest, when I bought my R, I have said to my father numerous times (who has a 15 Z51 Vette that I helped him spec), that his car has far more to offer in terms of comfort, build quality, interior materials, etc. and that for the amount I paid for my R it should have some aspects of the interior upgraded compared to the basic models.

In terms of the trash-talking and other facets, I have never been a party to that stuff. I've never been a Mustang fan really, have never considered buying one or owning one until this car. I wouldn't have been around when they poked fun at Hellcat ADM's, hell I wasn't aware that they also had to deal with that. From the outside it seems Ford is perfectly happy selling the inferior car in terms of performance, the only they care about is money really. They sell a slightly lower performing car for a little cheaper, and from the sales figures it looks like the lower price probably makes the difference. Those of us on the forums are the enthusiasts, but there are tons of buyers out there for almost all cars who just want to get something to be seen in, or just to cruise around in who don't care at all about just how capable even the 5.0 and SS are nowadays.

I've always been an enthusiast, and love cars with a passion. If I had enough money I would be like clone of Jay Leno... LOL I know some of the guys are giving that one fella a hard time, but I don't mind his posts as I've mentioned numerous times. If someone can debate and discuss different cars without getting too heated, I don't mind that one bit as it makes things interesting!

Cheers!

Glad to hear you two have settled your differences, both of you are very passionate and should be proud of that. The thing that separates you both from the average joe is you can recognize when you have let that passion get the best of you. My thoughts are both cars are awesome in their own right, I would be proud to own either

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by VAZL1

Glad to hear you two have settled your differences, both of you are very passionate and should be proud of that. The thing that separates you both from the average joe is you can recognize when you have let that passion get the best of you. My thoughts are both cars are awesome in their own right, I would be proud to own either

(Sniffle)...I just have something in my eye...

[J_MaherAMG]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

Thank you for being civil. And much respect to you for the apology, especially on a forum. I'll keep things civil with you from here out. And I hope you stick around.

Back when I was in the search for my next car I looked around and felt that the Camaro SS and Mustang GTs no longer could offer what I wanted in terms of performance. I wanted to take it to the next level. I told my friends I would get one of the "big boys" next. So that led me to consider everything out there from M4s to Z06s to GTRs and everything in between. I wrote off the GT350R because they were all in the $90K and up range. At that price I was not getting a Mustang (no offense meant at all). I then considered the regular GT350. I saw many of them in used condition with low miles for around low 50s. I really thought about it but I just could not get over the fact that it was only a 12.2 sec car. And like I said, I know it isn't built for that. But I take lots of trips to Mexico, nahm sayin...lol!! And another thing that I disliked is that there is no sunroof option, no heated/cooled seats, no heated steering wheel, no automatic trans (got tired of dealing with manual trans for years) and not even a convertible option. All of those are must haves for me and I could not justify paying that much and sacrificing the things I feel are important. And even after all that I still tried to talk myself into it but I just couldn't do it man. So as luck would have it, one random day my friend who is a car salesman told me he had a ZL1 coming in and that it had every option I wanted...sunroof, A10, nav, PDR, and a bunch of other stuff all at MSRP, I jumped on it. And I feel that this is the best car buying decision I have ever made in my life. Sorry for the long story. I just wanted to give you some insight into what makes me tick.

But I do feel that Ford will step their game up in the very near future. I feel that they will come back swinging for the fences.

You as well sir, and I'll stick around to keep you guys on your toes

For sure man, and as crazy as it sounds, some of the early 2016 Rs up here were selling for $150K plus...

Even if I could afford it, I wouldn't pay that price either, and would definitely be in a GT3 or something similar haha as a "do-it-all" car, the ZL1 is hard to beat right now, especially for the price of it. Hell man, up here the base price starts below $70K... and there are only a few thousand $'s worth of options to add on, so you get HUGE bang for the buck for that car up here. Considering the the US-CAD rate right now, I think they're probably losing money on every one they sell, which would explain why they're limiting Canadian allocations. Ford on the other hand got the exchange rate included and then some... LOL

It certainly isn't a real threat at the strip thats for sure. We have no road courses in my province, and not even a 1/4 mile strip, just a small 1/8th mile :( only had the car out there once, and even with 315 Cup 2's I couldn't get better than a 2.2 60ft. I'm a bit of an amateur to be honest, but it definitely isn't a friendly car for drag racing if that is the buyers forte.

The non-R "Convenience" package had heated/cooled seats! But they were the "sofa" seats, not the racy Recaros. Our weather here doesn't get hot enough for me to miss the cooled seats, but I still find myself using them when in my father's vette, would be major plus in hotter climates.

Sounds like you're into drag racing a bit, but have you done any track time in your car yet or do you plan to? I recently got back from Utah where I did the "GT350 Track Attack" program that buyers get with the car, and although it was a relatively smaller, technical track, it amazed me how quickly you become acclimatized to the speed, even though I was only getting up to maybe 110-115mph. I had a blast and never felt as though the car was slow along the main straights, but there were a couple times where I thought to myself that if I had more power I would be confident enough to use it. That could very well change though if we were hitting 140+ like on a lot of other tracks where my courage might waver haha

I think the 350/R is the last Mustang we'll see that is very "analog" in the sense that it doesn't have many electronic features or amenities. The 2018 5.0 is getting the new digital cluster which I think is really cool, and I really like that aspect in the vettes as well, which I assume is the same that you guys got. If I were to take 2 features though that I think is absolutely necessary on their next halo stang, or track special for that matter, is the rev-matching and PDR. I love how it can be turned on/off in your cars with the click of the button, and would make on track driving so much less stressful, as I'm not the best at heel-toe. PDR would just be super cool to have, and eliminate the whole go-pro overlaying video with other software that still doesn't come out as good in the end. I think the GT500 (if it ever comes) will probably have a version of the 10spd auto, and I think a lot of people were hoping the MY18 350's would get a version of the DCT in the GT, which was never going to happen in my mind.

And long stories are great, I have probably what most would call a borderline unhealthy obsession with cars

[J_MaherAMG]

Originally Posted by kttxz06

I swear, thePill keeps having offspring.

If I were related to him I think I'd probably throw myself off a bridge

Oddly enough he doesn't seem to be the usual (read dumb) diehard fanboy, and actually seems to be somewhat intelligent, but highly delusional individual haha

My typical reaction when I read one of his posts (read drivel):

[ST1LE]

Originally Posted by VAZL1

Glad to hear you two have settled your differences, both of you are very passionate and should be proud of that. The thing that separates you both from the average joe is you can recognize when you have let that passion get the best of you. My thoughts are both cars are awesome in their own right, I would be proud to own either

+1!!

[Godfatha]

GT350R and ZL1 are both great cars. The ZL1's performance is better at the moment but those things are cyclical. I prefer Chevy but I'm a car guy in general and can appreciate Ford, Chevy, and Dodge cars.

[unavailablezl1]

Here is the same comparison but viewed by different people that weren't paid to review the two cars. They said the Camaro won....funny how that is...

http://www.lsxmag.com/news/camaro-zl...er-is-crowned/

[J_MaherAMG]

Originally Posted by unavailablezl1

Here is the same comparison but viewed by different people that weren't paid to review the two cars. They said the Camaro won....funny how that is...

http://www.lsxmag.com/news/camaro-zl...er-is-crowned/

To be fair that is a LS magazine... it would be like putting a poll in the GT350 section on Mustang forum and asking them to Vote for a winner..

Which they may as well have, since the "comparison" in that article actually didn't involve any real testing/driving of the two cars, and was just a review of the review that MotorTrend posted

[KMPrenger]

Originally Posted by J_MaherAMG

If I were related to him I think I'd probably throw myself off a bridge

Oddly enough he doesn't seem to be the usual (read dumb) diehard fanboy, and actually seems to be somewhat intelligent, but highly delusional individual haha

My typical reaction when I read one of his posts (read drivel):

I was going to simply ask you your opinion of thePill. Now that you've said this...I'm OK with you. lol.

Years ago, when he posted on Camaro5.com (and I knew nothing about him) he seemed educated, or at least highly knowledgeable. Then he got banned, then after seeing his posts year and year and through the launch of the gen 6 Camaro, and on and on....it became apparent the guy is/was borderline legit crazy. I have never seen anyone so obsessed with trying to prove one car is better than the other. (through misleading information, to lies, to outright creating false stories). There are the outright fanboys.....and then on the higher pedestal, is thePill.

[J_MaherAMG]

Originally Posted by KMPrenger

I was going to simply ask you your opinion of thePill. Now that you've said this...I'm OK with you. lol.

Years ago, when he posted on Camaro5.com (and I knew nothing about him) he seemed educated, or at least highly knowledgeable. Then he got banned, then after seeing his posts year and year and through the launch of the gen 6 Camaro, and on and on....it became apparent the guy is/was borderline legit crazy. I have never seen anyone so obsessed with trying to prove one car is better than the other. (through misleading information, to lies, to outright creating false stories). There are the outright fanboys.....and then on the higher pedestal, is thePill.

So much yes! haha that is what I find so strange though right? Like some of his postings I've read in the past I've genuinely learned some things, and he does seem to know a lot about design.

But you're right in saying that he is obsessed with trying to prove these "conspiracy" type theories that A car is better than B car, and most of the time his "predictions" are just out in the wind. He'll post like 50 different "this car will have X engine and Y this and Z that", so when the car is revealed and it happens to be one of the 50 scenarios he mentioned he'll proclaim that he knew all along...

And all of the "insider" info he has I think comes from inside his own head And I've never before been so weirded out by someone always referring to themselves in the 3rd person

He and I have had many an hot debate

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by KMPrenger

I was going to simply ask you your opinion of thePill. Now that you've said this...I'm OK with you. lol.

I guess it's true: The enemy of my enemy is my friend.

[hognutz]

since I buy cars with money I would definitely buy the Zl1 over the R. the r just cost too much money for my income level. the markup is insane.

MSRP vs MSRP would be torn a bit. I think the R is a better looking car.

at the current pricing it is a .001 second decision for me.

[BlaqWhole]

I feel that the GT350 is a nice looking ride. But the difference in appeal of the Mustangs over the Camaro is not as drastic as people would make you believe. When I got my 10 Camaro SS I would get compliments all the time. Literally everywhere I went. When I got my 15 GT I got compliments but not as much. BTW, I got the 15 GT because of how amazing I felt they looked. I was disappointed in the performance, but it did have some cool features. Now that I have the ZL1, I get more compliments in it than I did in my SS AND GT combined. I had a cop follow me for a few miles and pull up next to me at a red light just to talk to me about my ZL1...and that was just about a week after I got it. All my neighbor's jaws dropped when they saw me after seeing the car parked in my spot. My co-workers talk about it all the time (lol). And last night on the way to work a bus pulled up next to me and the door opened and the driver started asking me about it. I get stopped at gas stations...one time a crowd started gathering because these two guys started asking me about it. Then a couple other people walked over. Then a couple gas station attendants came over. This car attracts a lot of attention and it really is a good looking car. I initially didn't like the 6th Gens BTW. But when my car arrived at the dealership I could not stop grinning. And all my friends fell in love with it. Some said this is the best looking car I've ever owned. And trust me there are many more stories. All less than 2 months of ownership. And when I tell people the features, like how it is a wifi hotspot and has wireless charging and PDR etc they go nuts. All at this price point. And the fact that it outperformed the GT350R is icing on the cake. Which is why I don't mind it losing MT's comparo. Because the wows and likes I get from others tells me how nice of a car it is. And the way I feel about it is more than enough. And the performance is the real reason I bought it.