09-30-2009, 05:28 PM | #113 |
Camaro➎ moderator
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Lets see how many want forged pistons? 3 members
How many dont care and dont want to pay the extra money to get forged for the 3 people demanding it? Everyone else Rodimus, seems like the Body in White is exactly what you and your forged piston demanding friends need. |
09-30-2009, 05:28 PM | #114 | |
A GM nut-swinger!
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09-30-2009, 05:48 PM | #115 | ||
Drives: CTS/CAMARO Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: SEMA/PERF INDUSTRY GUY
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Cost. Do you have ANY idea what an UltraLight Mahle forging costs? Their not going to throw some off the shelf crap in this motor. You two act like it's an ultimatum to GM, "forged pistons or I'm not buying it" FINE, don't. The reality is it's more like "This is how we will built it, IF we build it." The government is trying damn hard to make these cars go away. Enjoy them while you can. PS, Robin, thank you for your posts. Of coarse you are dead on and in a position to know. You have more patience than I do. I hope to see you at SEMA and say Hi.
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09-30-2009, 05:50 PM | #116 | |
Drives: 2006 Silverado SS, 2009 G8 GT Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: PNW
Posts: 13,313
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I will take his word for what its worth! I trust them when they say "The supercharged LSA motor is the real deal" The Camaro is not being built for YOU. It is being built for the masses. Stock will be more than enough for majority of the people who buy this car. |
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09-30-2009, 06:49 PM | #117 |
Drives: '03 Monte Carlo SS Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: VaBeach VA
Posts: 348
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Does the LSA Need forged piston... NO
Prior to going into production the LSA spent many many hours in design, development, testing and stress testing. Stock its putting down 556 hp at the crank and has to last at least GMs powertrain warrantee period. If you don't trust the engineers, you can trust the bean counters here. The vast majority of buyers are going to have the Z/28 for bragging rights. A small number are going go out and PLAY with it. A statistically insignificant number of buyers are going to push it to the wall. If the LSA goes into the Z/28 AND you want it to make more power, put up your OWN money and shut up about it. The arguments for swapping out a couple components for ones that are only a little bit more expesnive are stupid. You what thats called? Its call feature creep. There is almost no part on the engine that couldn't be replaced with something that would make it run faster stronger etc. Real world scenario under open conditions: 1 We'll swap part A for B its only $200 more. 2 Sweet everyone will go for that. 1 Oh Oh lets also swap Part C for D, that only another $300 2 Riiight that'll be killer. 1 Hey while were doing that lets swap parts E-L for parts M-T. That's only another $100 per part 2 Awesome noone could deny that would make this a sceamer of an engine. .... Eventually you get to the point that even the block is forged titanium, weighs 100lbs fully built, can be used as both a nitro methane funny car / grocery getter and costs $100k Guarranteed, where you say stop thats as expensive as I want, somone else is clammoring for the next part you don't want to pay for. If YOU don't want the LSA as is, fine no skin off my nose. Buy an SS get the stock LS3 get your own forged pistons, crank, cam, and 2.6L Blower and put down just short of lethal HP if you want. |
09-30-2009, 07:15 PM | #118 | |
Waiting...
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09-30-2009, 07:24 PM | #119 |
RealSick/SuperSport
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wow talk about beating a subject to death!!!< case and piont forged is better, will gm do it, NO!!! end of story, thank you come again
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09-30-2009, 07:43 PM | #120 | |
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09-30-2009, 07:44 PM | #121 |
09-30-2009, 08:12 PM | #122 | ||
I used to be Dragoneye...
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Fantastic entry...and truly, a real-world perspective. "Dyno Queen" was a great way to describe it, because it's absolutely true. Bigger is not always better, and I salute you, Robin -- for taking the time and having the sense to point that out. For those of you who doubt that philosophy, go read a review on the new 700-some hp Super Snake....read how "great" it is to drive outside of burning your tires off with a mere blip of the throttle........ Quote:
Like, Number 3 said...nobody is saying that forged pistons aren't strong...or that it wouldn't benefit that small (VERY small) percentage of people who would need them...what we're saying, is that there reasons not to go this route as well. |
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09-30-2009, 08:16 PM | #123 | |
Account Suspended
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Location: Metal Metal Land
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This isnt a bmw, volvo, infinity, lexus or Jaguar, its a camaro...performance comes first and foremost. The average z28 guy is going to feel stupid when the ss guys running maggies and turbos and vortechs are putting out just as much power as them for less coin. But they will have a differnt hood. In all honesty I wont buy a z28 either way, because I cant afford it. The camaro is supposed to be a cheap best bang for the buck car. Not a caddy. Id be willing to bet that the guys that are okay with a lesser motor are also the ones crying about it getting a 4 star front crash rating though. Forged is better plain and simple, and as a consumer if you didnt demand the most for your money something is wrong with you. Im not saying the car wont be nice or fast, ect ect, but why wouldnt you want the best components for it. I bought a Camaro because it was a better car vs a Mustang GT. People that are not going to want to mod the cars will do the same thing when the z28 comes out and see that the GT500 is a better buy. |
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09-30-2009, 08:41 PM | #124 | |
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i'm not arguing that forged pistons arent better yes they are. but the engine is already capable of more power then 99% of the people who modify cars will need. plain and simple 99% of the people who mod cars will be extremely happy with 700-800whp and will stop there. cuz honestly after that the car will be kinda useless on the street. that 1% thats going to go above that will most likely be doing a stroker thus already forging the engine, probably swapping to a massive 4.0+L twinscrew or twin turbo. like i'd be more then happy with 700whp capable engine but give me better interior material. i'm not saying give me ferrari or lambo quality, but give me the quality of what other cars in the same price range have. soft touch, nicer quality. design, gm's designs i like, its simple. but give me nice quality. give me real quality leathers. shit throw some suede here in there. no hard plastics. thats where gm is failing at. even the vette has hard plastic interior. hard plastic = garbage = cracks real fast. and as far as z28 owners feeling stupid. umm yeah sure, the SS already costs damn near 40k, maggie installed is another 8-9k that gives u 530whp average. nice more power then a stock z28. but once that ss wants to play at 700whp then have fun replacing rods and pistons, cuz a stock internal z28 will be able to handle that type of power. so in the end uve spent more on ur SS for the same power the z28 is making w/ a blower swap. |
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09-30-2009, 08:44 PM | #125 |
I used to be Dragoneye...
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Can you explain this one? I'm just not sure what you mean. Why would people not interested in modification see a GT500 as a better buy due to pistons?
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09-30-2009, 09:23 PM | #126 | |
A GM nut-swinger!
Drives: A Car Join Date: May 2009
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I appreciate when the guys that know come on here and set the word straight, lot of the things that Number3 and Q-ship said has been said before and beaten to death and fallen on deaf ears. I agree with everything they have said. I come on here trying to help people understand from my perspective/experience as a "grease monkey" and that does not work. I give up.
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