some thoughts about the camaro...a new yorkers point of view

[06stalliongt]

Originally Posted by TheMadHatter99

+1000000000000000

My thoughts exactly. Make a lot of the "standard" equipment optional and offer a lower base price to attract more customers.

I'm afraid with this pricing I just don't see GM reaching their six-figure sale goals.

its so easy to say this is affordable now but i think when most people go see the f&i guy at the dealership n start to talk bout monthly payments n all that good stuff they'll realize wht were talkin bout

[Evotion]

Originally Posted by 06stalliongt

the horse power may be the same...but ur gonna tell me that off the line at lets say englishtown, nj the v6 camaro will beat the mustang gt not in a million passes my friends...second ive done my research the 1ss barely has any options so yeah its a good deal if u wnt a strip down v8...the challenger r/t has plenty of options that wont make u feel left out if u didnt get an srt/8...but like ive said everyone has there own opinion...years ago if u ordered a v6 camaro u were prob a blonde chic frm long island...haha

Why should the V6 beat the GT? Is it supposed to.

I've been biting my tongue since the pricing was announced. Was I dissappointed in the pricing? Sure, maybe a little bit. Was I shocked? No.

In the Sept 08 issue of Road and Track it says "Despite the added cost of the IRS, Chevy is looking to keep the base prices in the $20,000-$30,000 bracket, while the SS model could be in the mid- to upper- $30,000 range." So they nailed it dead on!!

Motor Trend had the best take on all of your opinions. In the Sept 08 issue it says:
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"We stopped bringing Mustangs on our development rides because they were so far behind us in our rearview mirror," says Al Oppenheiser, GM's North American rear wheel drive vehicle cheif engineer and effectively the new Camaro's father. "It wasn't even worth taking them anymore," he continues, with the faintest of smirks.
You needn't be a Blue Oval booster or a soldier in the General's army to know that them's fightin' words. Whats more, Oppenheiser says his team brought along (and kept) the Dodge Charger, Nissan 350Z, and stretch targets like the Infinity G37.
"We've actually challenged ourselves to go upscale in sticker price and performance, to go after anything that could be called this segment--Mustang, Charger, Challenger. We're shooting for targets a lot higher in terms of sticker price," he says.
Key to the success of Camaro is the balance between performance and fuel-economy.
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So my dad who bought his 1969 Camaro 6cyl coupe is a "blonde chic frm long island..."? Well there's your problem... where you are from, blondes apparently are bald with more body hair than a gorilla.

IMO your first post is poorly thought out (and typed). You complain about Chevy putting a $30k (think lower) V6 on the market, and then post again about it being beat every time by a GT? I'd be a little more embarassed being associated with an 09 Mustang V6 Premium Coupe (MSRP $22,085, 210 HP).

In the end they are pricey... but you get what you pay for.

Sorry for the long post but I thought I would share that with those who haven't had a chance to see these stories.

[kalel]

This thread is killing me! This is a great deal for a car! I just compared it with over ten cars. I will give you one example. Comparably equipped, the 350z is over 34,000. The 2LT is less than 28,000.

[06stalliongt]

Originally Posted by Evotion

Why should the V6 beat the GT? Is it supposed to.

I've been biting my tongue since the pricing was announced. Was I dissappointed in the pricing? Sure, maybe a little bit. Was I shocked? No.

In the Sept 08 issue of Road and Track it says "Despite the added cost of the IRS, Chevy is looking to keep the base prices in the $20,000-$30,000 bracket, while the SS model could be in the mid- to upper- $30,000 range." So they nailed it dead on!!

Motor Trend had the best take on all of your opinions. In the Sept 08 issue it says:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
"We stopped bringing Mustangs on our development rides because they were so far behind us in our rearview mirror," says Al Oppenheiser, GM's North American rear wheel drive vehicle cheif engineer and effectively the new Camaro's father. "It wasn't even worth taking them anymore," he continues, with the faintest of smirks.
You needn't be a Blue Oval booster or a soldier in the General's army to know that them's fightin' words. Whats more, Oppenheiser says his team brought along (and kept) the Dodge Charger, Nissan 350Z, and stretch targets like the Infinity G37.
"We've actually challenged ourselves to go upscale in sticker price and performance, to go after anything that could be called this segment--Mustang, Charger, Challenger. We're shooting for targets a lot higher in terms of sticker price," he says.
Key to the success of Camaro is the balance between performance and fuel-economy.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
So my dad who bought his 1969 Camaro 6cyl coupe is a "blonde chic frm long island..."? Well there's your problem... where you are from, blondes apparently are bald with more body hair than a gorilla.

IMO your first post is poorly thought out (and typed). You complain about Chevy putting a $30k (think lower) V6 on the market, and then post again about it being beat every time by a GT? I'd be a little more embarassed being associated with an 09 Mustang V6 Premium Coupe (MSRP $22,085, 210 HP).

In the end they are pricey... but you get what you pay for.

Sorry for the long post but I thought I would share that with those who haven't had a chance to see these stories.

i posted the racing thing cuz someone is comparin it to the gt mustang

[FenwickHockey65]

Originally Posted by 06stalliongt

i posted the racing thing cuz someone is comparin it to the gt mustang

Okay, not all of us are going to be racing our Camaros. You started this thread because you weren't satisfied with the Camaro's pricing. Value wise, the Camaro wins hands down. Same horsepower, less expensive, great fuel economy, and still plenty of standard features to keep you happy.

[Evotion]

Originally Posted by 06stalliongt

i posted the racing thing cuz someone is comparin it to the gt mustang

Ummm...O.K.

First of all please don't shoot me a when u clearly didn't read what I wrote.

And, I am trying to but sadly your posts are starting to make my eyes cross.

Finally, I am done with this thread. If I want someone to dodge every single valid point I make, I will talk to my 14 year old... it's just as frustrating, but I don't have to reach as far.

[JMAN311]

Originally Posted by 06stalliongt

the horse power may be the same...but ur gonna tell me that off the line at lets say englishtown, nj the v6 camaro will beat the mustang gt not in a million passes my friends...second ive done my research the 1ss barely has any options so yeah its a good deal if u wnt a strip down v8...the challenger r/t has plenty of options that wont make u feel left out if u didnt get an srt/8...but like ive said everyone has there own opinion...years ago if u ordered a v6 camaro u were prob a blonde chic frm long island...haha

Originally Posted by 06stalliongt

i posted the racing thing cuz someone is comparin it to the gt mustang

Well you drive a 300hp V8 GT and your bashing the 300hp V6 for not being a "muscle car" what else am I supposed to think? And if you weren't comparing horsepower what did you mean by "balls to the wall power"? The fact that it's a V6 and not a V8? 2 extra cylinders = muscle car?

Yeah the mustang GT would beat it with equal skilled drivers cause it's like 300 lbs lighter and has about 50 lb/ft of torque more, is that the power you are talking about?

And if you wanna just play the stereotyping game the same could be said about the Mustang V6 that looks just like what you drive stock cept you have an extra exhaust pipe out the back. So I can only think you just have an issue with v6's and not Camaros.

[ucla1ove3]

evotion so true so true

[The_Stache]

Originally Posted by kalel

This thread is killing me! This is a great deal for a car! I just compared it with over ten cars. I will give you one example. Comparably equipped, the 350z is over 34,000. The 2LT is less than 28,000.

Thats the problem is we arn't comparing cars.. we are comparing business models.

Ford looked at the market.. RWD 2 door coupes and said " we will make the cheapest fun, good looking car we can" and did it. THATS why they have sold 6 digits for the last 3 years (08 sales have dropped).

GM looked and said "WE CAN DO THAT" and turned around and made a GREAT CAR that because of content is priced to high. NOW the business model has changed from making a good looking fun car to "lets make the best in class and charge appropriately and expect it to sell like the cheap car".

And in business school this doesn't fly...

PS I am NOT saying the camaro is a bad deal, I am saying the business model isn't going to net the mustang numbers and the reasons why.

[ucla1ove3]

diarmadhi i agree 100 percent with what you just said, that's exactly how i feel and could NOT have said it better myself

[MajorTom]

Originally Posted by JMAN311

So a 300hp V6 isn't "balls to the wall power" but a 300hp mustang V8 for $3K more is?

Uh, the Mustang GT will outperform the V6 Camaro all day long. I'm not a Mustang fan, but people who were expecting their fully loaded V6 to come in at a 24k price and their fully loaded V8s to start at 30k were out of their minds. The car will out perform the Mustang and the Challenger.


It amazes me that someone would say the Camaro needs two different V8 models like the Dodge and Mustang. 1SS 2SS anyone? There's one with the less plush interior that will do 0-60 in 4.6 seconds. Then there's one that will ALSO do 0-60 in 4.6 seconds and has leather and a few more options. It's a great deal. You pay for more interior options, but you get the same performance. You get all around better performance than the Mustang, and you can get comparable performance in the Challenger but for 40k as opposed to 32 or so.

The Mustang offers a V8 with 300hp that will do 0-60 in 5.1 seconds and for 32k it'll have leather and everything you want. For 3k more you'll get the better suspension and chassis of the Camaro with leather as well. Not to mention another 122hp. That's not unreasonable if you ask me.


People who are saying this pricing is too high and that GM screwed everything up by pricing it so high and that Ford and Dodge did it right are out of their freaking minds. Or maybe they're just butthurt because they hoped for the Camaro to be 28k fully loaded. Idiots.

The Dodge for example: You can get a R/T that comes stripped down, does 0-60 in 5.2 seconds or so and a mid 13 second 1/4 mile for 30k. With options that price can skyrocket to 39k and that price comes with no extra performance. You can get the SRT-8 model which starts at 40k and comes well equipped. For a few grand more you can get all options. The Camaro will be faster and better made than either of those and be cheaper in a performance per dollar aspect as well as performance per luxury aspect too.

^Is that a good deal?

The Camaro will be 35-36k very well equipped. Better deal than the Dodge.

V8 Camaro with great engine, brakes and suspension: 31k

V8 Mustang with lesser engine, brakes and suspension: 29k

V8 Challenger with lesser engine, brakes and suspension: 30k

Camaro with Leather and previously mentioned performance:35k

Mustang comparably equipped: 32-33k

Challenger comparably equipped 40k (!!!)

breaking it down like that should put it in perspective for a lot of people.

The Camaro is the best deal period. It's unfortunate that not everyone can afford it, but that's the way things are. People will always look to spend as little as possible.

And whoever said a Muscle car by definition has a eye-catching interior hasn't seen the last gen mustang and camaro. That's never been a Muscle Cars strongsuit. It's only been a few years since the Mustang has had an even tolerable interior and it obviously sets the bar since it's the first example in the class.

[MajorTom]

Originally Posted by diarmadhi

GM looked and said "WE CAN DO THAT" and turned around and made a GREAT CAR that because of content is priced to high. NOW the business model has changed from making a good looking fun car to "lets make the best in class and charge appropriately and expect it to sell like the cheap car".

I honestly think they charged cheap prices considering just how much development, performance and features come on the Camaro.

I agree that the car probably won't sell as well as the Mustang because of those reasons. It costs more and right away that'll be a deal breaker for a lot of people. The look is a bit more edgy and for some people it may be too much. But if they go to both dealers and see how much both cars cost equally equipped, they'll see that the difference is maybe a few grand and they just might notice that you get a lot more features and performance for only a few grand more. That few grand may very well be the deal breaker for some people so it won't matter if the Camaro is the performance bargain of the class.

[06stalliongt]

look this thread is jumpin in alot of directions in my opinion this is what chevy should have done...[
camaro v6 or w/ RS...comes with a similar motor thats in the g6 gxp 3.6 250hp 251ft lb
base price: 21,500
w/ rs $23,500

camaro z28 similar looking to the ss but with stripes and decals in true Z28 fashion with a more modern 5.7L 350 w/the cylinder deactivation similar to the monte ss in 2008(for those whore are concerned bout gas) and some of the options that are avail on the ss
base price: $ 26,000- 29,000(w/all options)

and finally the ss: the way it is now

this would seem more resonable and it would give a buyer more choices....this is my opinion and i dnt care what everyones will say im not here to win a popularity contest just tryin vent...im in no way a ford guy yes i did own a mustang gt but ive also had 2 trans ams n 1 IROC Z n i now have a chevy avalanche...im a camaro enthusiast like everyone else on here n i just want to see this car done rite heritage is very impt these days!!

[QS78]

totally agree with u ..... the car lacks basic features which come as standard with many other cars !!

please guys dont compare with current Mustang pricing just wait till they release the 2010 mustang .... apple to apple ....