camaro IV fest Nominations

[Doc]

Originally Posted by JusticePete

I don't see full road course events in the future of C5FEST for a number of reasons. First and foremost, C5FEST is a social event with car stuff wrapped around the social aspects. The rule for road course driving is no different than flying. It is 12 hours bottle to throttle. That rule alone would eliminate about 98% of those that attend the C5FEST.

Second, road course events, even HPDE style, require serious preparation of car and driver. It is an intense experience that demands the full focus of the drivers. When the day ends, if you were serious about your track time the only thing you want to do is go to bed. For the drivers that participate a road course day is great. As part of a social event I don't see how it fits with what has made C5FEST unique among car events.

I'll stop here at #3. We set the AC course up so that virtually all the cars that attend are capable of participating. The course will always have a small straight that allows the driver to get serious speed, followed by cones that scrub off speed without burning up brakes. If your car is safe for daily driver use, it should be autocross ready. This allows 98% of the people that attend C5FEST able to participate. We setup the course adjacent to the vendor midway, car show and drags so that everyone at the FEST is able to interact. We use the AC to promote the interactions of the spectators with the drivers. Drivers are allowed to take passengers on runs. The C5FEST CamaroCross has evolved to support the event, protect the cars and by far and away the most important aspect is to allow the driver's to have fun in a more relaxed environment than is possible at a road course.

C5FEST III is the 1st Muscle Car event we know of that had more people run the CamaroCross than drag race. That leads us to believe the CamaroCross is what you want. If it isn't, I am sure they are more than willing to listen.

This is a serious bummer as road course is the only type of event I like to run in. I don't do drags and don't really care for autocross. I don't see why there can't be all 3 like there was at Firebird. Instead of just turning into an expensive-to-attend tailgate party each year, there could be driving-specific things like clinics on "what to mod and why", "enhancing driving safety", "How to drive fast on the track", etc.

There are all kinds of creative things that could be done to help people get ideas for things they can do to their cars, things they can do WITH their cars so there's more than just drags, autocross, party. Those 3 are fine and all but not everyone drinks or wants to get drunk. It would be great if there were clinics/events in the evening that were social but focused around specific topics related to Camaros and driving/using/modding them.

If you're into autocross, imagine driving in the day, then in the evening there's a workshop/group that focuses on autocross where someone who just drove in the event earlier can learn how to get better at it. It would be a great way for vendors to showcase their products and instruct at the same time.

I can autocross locally, I can do drags locally, I can certainly tailgate and party locally if I want to. I don't need to spend thousands and take a week off work to do those things. There should be a compelling reason to spend that money and time to attend a C5 fest because there's some really cool stuff/things at one that you can't get anywhere else. Yes the fellowship is great, yes it's cool to see hundreds of Camaros in one spot but there's such a great opportunity to add that "something extra" to make it THE cool event of the year, like a Camaro Olympics or something.

The clinics/workshops could be pulled together from what's mostly already there at the fest. The only additions would be the possible invitation of speakers/experts/automotive celebrities that might be willing to attend and speak to the attendees. Maybe someone like Jay Leno would be willing to do a talk on collecting cars; doing car shows; what judges look for and what it takes to be a collector. Things like that.

I would hate to see C5 fests become just drags, autocross and party when it could be so much more. It's a once-in-a-year opportunity to collect and focus value in a way that can't be found any other way.

Maybe I'm the only one that feels this way... I don't know but that's my 2 cents on it for what it's worth.

[JusticePete]

Originally Posted by Doc

This is a serious bummer as road course is the only type of event I like to run in. I don't do drags and don't really care for autocross. I don't see why there can't be all 3 like there was at Firebird. Instead of just turning into an expensive-to-attend tailgate party each year, there could be driving-specific things like clinics on "what to mod and why", "enhancing driving safety", "How to drive fast on the track", etc.

There are all kinds of creative things that could be done to help people get ideas for things they can do to their cars, things they can do WITH their cars so there's more than just drags, autocross, party. Those 3 are fine and all but not everyone drinks or wants to get drunk. It would be great if there were clinics/events in the evening that were social but focused around specific topics related to Camaros and driving/using/modding them.

If you're into autocross, imagine driving in the day, then in the evening there's a workshop/group that focuses on autocross where someone who just drove in the event earlier can learn how to get better at it. It would be a great way for vendors to showcase their products and instruct at the same time.

I can autocross locally, I can do drags locally, I can certainly tailgate and party locally if I want to. I don't need to spend thousands and take a week off work to do those things. There should be a compelling reason to spend that money and time to attend a C5 fest because there's some really cool stuff/things at one that you can't get anywhere else. Yes the fellowship is great, yes it's cool to see hundreds of Camaros in one spot but there's such a great opportunity to add that "something extra" to make it THE cool event of the year, like a Camaro Olympics or something.

The clinics/workshops could be pulled together from what's mostly already there at the fest. The only additions would be the possible invitation of speakers/experts/automotive celebrities that might be willing to attend and speak to the attendees. Maybe someone like Jay Leno would be willing to do a talk on collecting cars; doing car shows; what judges look for and what it takes to be a collector. Things like that.

I would hate to see C5 fests become just drags, autocross and party when it could be so much more. It's a once-in-a-year opportunity to collect and focus value in a way that can't be found any other way.

Maybe I'm the only one that feels this way... I don't know but that's my 2 cents on it for what it's worth.

Doc,

I doubt you are alone in thinking this way and I understand why you feel as you do. Thank you for posting.

[f5journal]

Originally Posted by GTAHVIT

You get my nomination for member of the year.

Thanks...missed you at fest..Spike told me you could not make it

Originally Posted by PQ

Or Ass Kisser of the year................




You know I'm kidding f5. lol

I've worked in Corporate America for 40 years. It comes with the territory. It's sometimes called survival. That was tactic A, this is Tactic B

[PQ]

Originally Posted by Doc

This is a serious bummer as road course is the only type of event I like to run in. I don't do drags and don't really care for autocross. I don't see why there can't be all 3 like there was at Firebird. Instead of just turning into an expensive-to-attend tailgate party each year, there could be driving-specific things like clinics on "what to mod and why", "enhancing driving safety", "How to drive fast on the track", etc.

There are all kinds of creative things that could be done to help people get ideas for things they can do to their cars, things they can do WITH their cars so there's more than just drags, autocross, party. Those 3 are fine and all but not everyone drinks or wants to get drunk. It would be great if there were clinics/events in the evening that were social but focused around specific topics related to Camaros and driving/using/modding them.

If you're into autocross, imagine driving in the day, then in the evening there's a workshop/group that focuses on autocross where someone who just drove in the event earlier can learn how to get better at it. It would be a great way for vendors to showcase their products and instruct at the same time.

I can autocross locally, I can do drags locally, I can certainly tailgate and party locally if I want to. I don't need to spend thousands and take a week off work to do those things. There should be a compelling reason to spend that money and time to attend a C5 fest because there's some really cool stuff/things at one that you can't get anywhere else. Yes the fellowship is great, yes it's cool to see hundreds of Camaros in one spot but there's such a great opportunity to add that "something extra" to make it THE cool event of the year, like a Camaro Olympics or something.

The clinics/workshops could be pulled together from what's mostly already there at the fest. The only additions would be the possible invitation of speakers/experts/automotive celebrities that might be willing to attend and speak to the attendees. Maybe someone like Jay Leno would be willing to do a talk on collecting cars; doing car shows; what judges look for and what it takes to be a collector. Things like that.

I would hate to see C5 fests become just drags, autocross and party when it could be so much more. It's a once-in-a-year opportunity to collect and focus value in a way that can't be found any other way.

Maybe I'm the only one that feels this way... I don't know but that's my 2 cents on it for what it's worth.

The cost of this would be massive. A lot of vendors didn't even make money the weekend. I agree it would be really cool but it would cost a lot more too. You'd have to have members pay for the seperate events and clinics because to have one cost for the whole thing would be essentially more of the same. A high cost for people who are only interested in certain things.

We'd definitely need vendors to step up and run the events. But the Autocross is hands full enough as we've found out. And Pedders has busted ass and went through great expense to make it work.

I know I sound pessimistic but I think I'm right here. Not that we couldn't do it but I think the cost would only cause more people to have the same sentiment as you do now.

Unless we can put together seperate paid clinics at the show. Or volunteered manned clinics with experts to run them that cost nothing to the members. This would be ideal and Doc, you have a lot of respect here so maybe you can put this together?

Just remember that there is still not a paid and dedicated staff. And that has created problems. There have been grumblings that C5 is making money and charging higher costs and is only in it to make money. Which is contrary to the reason for the fest in the first place. And yet we still have no paid staff to run it.

We've all got ideas to make it run smoother. I know I do. But with just drags and auto cross it's not as smooth as it should be.

[PQ]

Originally Posted by f5journal

I've worked in Corporate America for 40 years. It comes with the territory. It's sometimes called survival. That was tactic A, this is Tactic B

[Doc]

Originally Posted by PQ

The cost of this would be massive. A lot of vendors didn't even make money the weekend. I agree it would be really cool but it would cost a lot more too. You'd have to have members pay for the seperate events and clinics because to have one cost for the whole thing would be essentially more of the same. A high cost for people who are only interested in certain things.

We'd definitely need vendors to step up and run the events. But the Autocross is hands full enough as we've found out. And Pedders has busted ass and went through great expense to make it work.

I know I sound pessimistic but I think I'm right here. Not that we couldn't do it but I think the cost would only cause more people to have the same sentiment as you do now.

Unless we can put together seperate paid clinics at the show. Or volunteered manned clinics with experts to run them that cost nothing to the members. This would be ideal and Doc, you have a lot of respect here so maybe you can put this together?

Just remember that there is still not a paid and dedicated staff. And that has created problems. There have been grumblings that C5 is making money and charging higher costs and is only in it to make money. Which is contrary to the reason for the fest in the first place. And yet we still have no paid staff to run it.

We've all got ideas to make it run smoother. I know I do. But with just drags and auto cross it's not as smooth as it should be.

I know a lot of vendors didn't make money which is why I thought of clinics. The same vendors that are already there could put on clinics/workshops focused around the uses of their product. The only extra cost would be a building/hall/room to hold the workshops. The hotels might have something available that wouldn't be too expensive to use.

I know Pedder's put a lot of effort into autocross. What if Pete and crew could do a clinic in the evening showcasing Pedder's products to people who drove earlier in the day? Once you've experienced body roll, understeer, etc. then you know exactly what they're talking about and why a particular product would be what you want/need. Everybody is already there, they just need a place to meet.

I'm not sure it would cost all that much more. I know everything is volunteer but maybe tapping into what's already there would allow "adding" extra value without adding extra cost (or much of it anyways). Would people be interested in listening to a talk by Scott? Al? Any, all or most of the Camaro team that's already in attendance?

Would vendors who are already there be interested in putting on focus workshops?

I'm trying to think of ways to re-purpose what's already there to help the vendors at least break even if not actually make money, have more variety of interesting things for the attendees without adding much if any extra cost. I know it's all volunteer which is pretty amazing that they can stage an international event of this magnitude. I'd be willing to help to a point depending on where it is and what I'd be able to actually do.

Do the volunteers/staff have conference calls? How do you guys actually organize things?

[JusticePete]

Doc,

I would be more than willing to do a clinic at the event. My biggest problem is lack of time at the FEST. FEST II we had the SCCA bail on running the event Thursday before the FEST started. This year we purchased timing equipment and found out that the spectators bodies absorb the low power radio signals and reduce effective range. We never tested the equipment with 80 or more spectators. Next year should be the smooth year with 100% of the volunteer dedicated staff committed to returning.

There were two well founded complaints about C5 FEST III. One would be the slow start for the CamaroCross and the second was trying to run your car at both the drags and CamaroCross. There wasn't enough time.

Maybe we should be looking at a 3 day FEST? Then again, when you start looking at tracks that have a road course, drag strip and suitable area for CamaroCross with a Host Hotel close by the track that can accommodate more than 1,000 5th Gens in the parking lot few tracks will meet our requirements. This is not to say it can't be done.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by Doc

I know a lot of vendors didn't make money which is why I thought of clinics. The same vendors that are already there could put on clinics/workshops focused around the uses of their product. The only extra cost would be a building/hall/room to hold the workshops. The hotels might have something available that wouldn't be too expensive to use.

I know Pedder's put a lot of effort into autocross. What if Pete and crew could do a clinic in the evening showcasing Pedder's products to people who drove earlier in the day? Once you've experienced body roll, understeer, etc. then you know exactly what they're talking about and why a particular product would be what you want/need. Everybody is already there, they just need a place to meet.

I'm not sure it would cost all that much more. I know everything is volunteer but maybe tapping into what's already there would allow "adding" extra value without adding extra cost (or much of it anyways). Would people be interested in listening to a talk by Scott? Al? Any, all or most of the Camaro team that's already in attendance?

Would vendors who are already there be interested in putting on focus workshops?

I'm trying to think of ways to re-purpose what's already there to help the vendors at least break even if not actually make money, have more variety of interesting things for the attendees without adding much if any extra cost. I know it's all volunteer which is pretty amazing that they can stage an international event of this magnitude. I'd be willing to help to a point depending on where it is and what I'd be able to actually do.

Do the volunteers/staff have conference calls? How do you guys actually organize things?

We're in constant communication. I'd like to say we have it down to a science, but I couldn't do that with a straight face...at the end of the day, though - we have a "formula" for the Fest. A vision of what IS a Camaro5Fest, that we work to facilitate each year.

This year we had the drag racing clinics, and based on what I've heard/read - they were pretty well received.

One of the vital components to the Fest, however, is an atmosphere of calm and comraderie...there aren't a hundred things to do and you've got to pick 5.
If you wanted to do everything - you could! So adding things is something we approach very cautiously, because we feel the atmosphere we've got is superior to a lot of other shows out there, and we'd like to maintain it.

That all said - we're ALWAYS open to new ideas for improvements. And yours are good ones, I'm glad you shared! First, we need to pick a location...everything else flows from that decision.

[chef-beavis]

Not to detract from the current topic. Just my first chance to chime in since the Fest, which was my family vacation.

1) I followed Google maps directions from hotel to track. We ended up leading a parade of cars around the backside of the track until we gave up due to no entrance. We turned around and everyone followed (impromtu leader, not planned). We all drove around to the front and could find an entrance. We turned around again and drivers chatted, stopped, asked "How the h$ll do you get in?" of each other. We all finally found the entrance...and got our goodie bags with a map of the track, entrance location, event info, hotel info, etc.

Any thought of allowing pre-payment and sending that out prior to the Fest in the future? Seemed a little late to get 90% of what was in there.

2) The cruise around town was one of the biggest attractions for me and turned out to be a white-knuckled death ride. I won't beat a dead horse but in the future maybe something could be done on a local track with a photo of all the cars and the cruise being more rural with no hazards flashing! LOL

3) While I can appreciate the autoX needed corner workers and stuff, I had to bow out to keep the family happy. We were there for 2.25 days. I even had to take part of the time to do kids stuff (childrens museum) to make it a family trip. In all, it worked out good. Point? The was no way I could expect them to wait around or spend a four hour time slot working a corner (that sounds wrong) in order to take a turn. I never inquired at the Fest but did it really work this way in the end or was that just the edict given until enough workers were found? Is there any way to get sponsors, local clubs, or pay local people a bit of something to help out so that people that drove 5 hours or 2 days don't lose a 1/2 day to participate?

4) Family vacation. What does everyone think? I personally did not mind the parking lot bar. My fiance' was not a big fan; just being honest. I am new to parenting but was always led to believe that doing stuff like this as a family led to a great childhood and lifelong love of cars. We left our 2 y/o with grandma and brought our 5 and 8 y/o girls to the Fest. I was proud of them. They took shoes off in the car, didn't kick seat backs, were respectful of my car and ALL others. They didn't tough a thing they were not supposed to! Can all the adults say the same? I and others came away with damage. Luckily mine was minor. On Saturday night my fiance' would not participate in hanging out in the parking lot with the kids. I found out later it was largely due to overhearing someone on Friday nigth making a sh&tty comment loudly about, "I can't believe they have their kids out here." We were way in the back of the parking lot, by the truck repair place, sitting by the guy that had his theater set up in his trunk playing Transformers. My girls were sitting on the ground playing Leapsters, not harming a soul, while we talked with a couple friends and shared about two beers each. They were nowhere near the TX bar, or the girls making out by the hotel entrance (must be the country music), or the girls in 8" heels and spandex dresses.

What do you guys think? Family event or no? Big social networking hook-up swingers fest? Not offended, either way, and I'm no kind of prude. I play in a rock band and ride a Harley and enjoy life as much as anyone. I just took this option over Sturgis because I thought it was something the entire family could enjoy.

Thoughts? Never come back? Screw the people that made the comments?

Mods? Organizers? Your thoughts would be particularly welcome.

[f5journal]

I think you may be overeacting to a few isolated things. Remember there are all sorts of folks on here of all age groups. I say ignore the comments. I saw you guys there and I believe I overheard that comment. One of the GM reps had his whole family and stopped and talked to half the parking lot. Many folks had their somewhat older children there too.

[PQ]

Originally Posted by Doc

I know a lot of vendors didn't make money which is why I thought of clinics. The same vendors that are already there could put on clinics/workshops focused around the uses of their product. The only extra cost would be a building/hall/room to hold the workshops. The hotels might have something available that wouldn't be too expensive to use.

I know Pedder's put a lot of effort into autocross. What if Pete and crew could do a clinic in the evening showcasing Pedder's products to people who drove earlier in the day? Once you've experienced body roll, understeer, etc. then you know exactly what they're talking about and why a particular product would be what you want/need. Everybody is already there, they just need a place to meet.

I'm not sure it would cost all that much more. I know everything is volunteer but maybe tapping into what's already there would allow "adding" extra value without adding extra cost (or much of it anyways). Would people be interested in listening to a talk by Scott? Al? Any, all or most of the Camaro team that's already in attendance?

Would vendors who are already there be interested in putting on focus workshops?

I'm trying to think of ways to re-purpose what's already there to help the vendors at least break even if not actually make money, have more variety of interesting things for the attendees without adding much if any extra cost. I know it's all volunteer which is pretty amazing that they can stage an international event of this magnitude. I'd be willing to help to a point depending on where it is and what I'd be able to actually do.

Do the volunteers/staff have conference calls? How do you guys actually organize things?

I thought you were talking about hands on clinics like driving/staging etc.......... Some text book clinics would be cost effective and quite informative. And then vendors could do what they wanted to make a demonstrative activity if they wanted.

I can tell you this though...... as I found out with the exhaust line-up, the interest definitely turned out to be there but without putting it on the list of functions to be taken seriously it will be hard to do. I dropped the ball on that one as Joe told me to let him know so he could add it.

Like the car show and cruise, it would need to be coordinated very well to be successful.

I guess we need to define exactly what we intend the fest to be. It has already morphed into more than was intended imo.

[Dr Jkel]

Originally Posted by chef-beavis

Not to detract from the current topic. Just my first chance to chime in since the Fest, which was my family vacation.

1) I followed Google maps directions from hotel to track. We ended up leading a parade of cars around the backside of the track until we gave up due to no entrance. We turned around and everyone followed (impromtu leader, not planned). We all drove around to the front and could find an entrance. We turned around again and drivers chatted, stopped, asked "How the h$ll do you get in?" of each other. We all finally found the entrance...and got our goodie bags with a map of the track, entrance location, event info, hotel info, etc.

Any thought of allowing pre-payment and sending that out prior to the Fest in the future? Seemed a little late to get 90% of what was in there.

2) The cruise around town was one of the biggest attractions for me and turned out to be a white-knuckled death ride. I won't beat a dead horse but in the future maybe something could be done on a local track with a photo of all the cars and the cruise being more rural with no hazards flashing! LOL

3) While I can appreciate the autoX needed corner workers and stuff, I had to bow out to keep the family happy. We were there for 2.25 days. I even had to take part of the time to do kids stuff (childrens museum) to make it a family trip. In all, it worked out good. Point? The was no way I could expect them to wait around or spend a four hour time slot working a corner (that sounds wrong) in order to take a turn. I never inquired at the Fest but did it really work this way in the end or was that just the edict given until enough workers were found? Is there any way to get sponsors, local clubs, or pay local people a bit of something to help out so that people that drove 5 hours or 2 days don't lose a 1/2 day to participate?

4) Family vacation. What does everyone think? I personally did not mind the parking lot bar. My fiance' was not a big fan; just being honest. I am new to parenting but was always led to believe that doing stuff like this as a family led to a great childhood and lifelong love of cars. We left our 2 y/o with grandma and brought our 5 and 8 y/o girls to the Fest. I was proud of them. They took shoes off in the car, didn't kick seat backs, were respectful of my car and ALL others. They didn't tough a thing they were not supposed to! Can all the adults say the same? I and others came away with damage. Luckily mine was minor. On Saturday night my fiance' would not participate in hanging out in the parking lot with the kids. I found out later it was largely due to overhearing someone on Friday nigth making a sh&tty comment loudly about, "I can't believe they have their kids out here." We were way in the back of the parking lot, by the truck repair place, sitting by the guy that had his theater set up in his trunk playing Transformers. My girls were sitting on the ground playing Leapsters, not harming a soul, while we talked with a couple friends and shared about two beers each. They were nowhere near the TX bar, or the girls making out by the hotel entrance (must be the country music), or the girls in 8" heels and spandex dresses.

What do you guys think? Family event or no? Big social networking hook-up swingers fest? Not offended, either way, and I'm no kind of prude. I play in a rock band and ride a Harley and enjoy life as much as anyone. I just took this option over Sturgis because I thought it was something the entire family could enjoy.

Thoughts? Never come back? Screw the people that made the comments?

Mods? Organizers? Your thoughts would be particularly welcome.

Chev...all you need to do is find the ACE5 group from Atlanta...we had kids in our group and ZERO Problems, we did drink but no one acted like an idiot.

IMO is should be family friendly for EVERYONE to include kids...they are the next generation of car owners......Within reason after 10pm things do get kinda loud in the parking lot but genrally kids are in bed at that time/

We would love to have you in the ACE 5 Group or just to stop by and visit.

Fbodygathering is another great event mainly a gathering of friends and a car show breaks out...it is a blast.

[SSE 4 2SS]

Originally Posted by JusticePete

Very cool. SSE, when are you back from your next duty on a rig? MLEE most weekends would work for you if there is no H-Town event? I know TAG will take some planning since he is frequently on duty during the weekends. I'll work on getting it sorted.

I'm home right now, well I'm at the shop....but I'm off the rig for the next three weeks.

[JusticePete]

Originally Posted by SSE 4 2SS

I'm home right now, well I'm at the shop....but I'm off the rig for the next three weeks.

Noted sir!