[Banshee]

Originally Posted by SUMMIT WHITE SS

First off, this is not suppose to be a direct competitor to the GT350. That car with the track pack is almost 60 grand. Technically, since it is a package you can get on the SS, it should be compared to a GT with the performance pack. It will get compared to the GT350 as it's performance will be so far past the GT performance pack, that the GT350 will be it's best competition numbers wise. I can see this car beating a base GT350, and giving a GT350 performance pack a real headache for what I bet will be about 15 grand less...

A GT 350 with track pack is $55,195. Less features? sure....depends on what you want.

I am speculating the reason the 1LE will only be in a 1SS is due weight and cost of the 2SS versus the GT 350 with track pack.

The price of a 1SS is $5,000 LESS then a 2SS and shaving weight and saving cash in the process.

People would absolutely balk at a 2SS with a 1LE because when it was all said and done, once you added the 1LE option ($4000+/-)to a 2SS with all the performance goodies checked off, it would be a $52,000 Camaro...the same ballpark as a GT 350 in price...but the GT 350 has a far better engine, unparalleled handling and would have a lighter curb weight...Thus, the 1LE is a non-competitor.

So the only was to compete, and yes, not a direct comparison (1LE and GT 350) was to ONLY allow the 1SS for weight and $$$ savings. The 1LE is not in the same category as the GT 350....no matter how you slice it.

[Waiting46]

Originally Posted by Banshee

A GT 350 with track pack is $55,195. Less features? sure....depends on what you want.

I am speculating the reason the 1LE will only be in a 1SS is due weight and cost of the 2SS versus the GT 350 with track pack.

The price of a 1SS is $5,000 LESS then a 2SS and shaving weight and saving cash in the process.

People would absolutely balk at a 2SS with a 1LE because when it was all said and done, once you added the 1LE option ($4000+/-)to a 2SS with all the performance goodies checked off, it would be a $52,000 Camaro...the same ballpark as a GT 350 in price...but the GT 350 has a far better engine, unparalleled handling and would have a lighter curb weight...Thus, the 1LE is a non-competitor.

So the only was to compete, and yes, not a direct comparison (1LE and GT 350) was to ONLY allow the 1SS for weight and $$$ savings. The 1LE is not in the same category as the GT 350....no matter how you slice it.

GM is on record saying the 350 had no impact in 1LE design, that 1LE was in the pipes before 350 was announced

As for a "far better engine" I believe that is a matter of preference...It is far more unique though

Only creature comforts the 1LE gives up are radio and spectrum lighting. 1LE still gets HUD and leather seats

[ChefBorOzzy]

Not in the same category, which will make it even more impressive when it outperforms a GT350 on the track which costs substantially more. If a 1LE package is 5-6k, we're looking at about a 43k dollar car with the chops to best the GT350.. The only thing a GT350 has on it is horsepower.

Better engine is debatable.. It's more unique.. Unparalleled handling? How do you know? Ford doesn't do handling as well as GM in same generation of vehicle.. Fact.

Side note, not sure how you say 4k for 1LE package and then state a 2SS would be 52 with it.. You're already getting performance goodies with 1LE so no reason to double up. Either say 1LE package would cost more or leave it be. With a 4k dollar package, the 2SS would be 46,300.. Well under a 55k dollar GT350 and SS also has more features. I think 4k is probably too low for package, bur we shall see.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by Banshee

A GT 350 with track pack is $55,195. Less features? sure....depends on what you want.

I am speculating the reason the 1LE will only be in a 1SS is due weight and cost of the 2SS versus the GT 350 with track pack.

The price of a 1SS is $5,000 LESS then a 2SS and shaving weight and saving cash in the process.

People would absolutely balk at a 2SS with a 1LE because when it was all said and done, once you added the 1LE option ($4000+/-)to a 2SS with all the performance goodies checked off, it would be a $52,000 Camaro...the same ballpark as a GT 350 in price...but the GT 350 has a far better engine, unparalleled handling and would have a lighter curb weight...Thus, the 1LE is a non-competitor.

So the only was to compete, and yes, not a direct comparison (1LE and GT 350) was to ONLY allow the 1SS for weight and $$$ savings. The 1LE is not in the same category as the GT 350....no matter how you slice it.

This remains to be seen. The GT350 is good, but it is not the "hero" car you seem to portray it as. That status is reserved for the "R" model. I think the 1LE will put Ford in its place...again.

A 2SS 1LE would be roughly equivalent to a GT350 with track and tech packages, which isn't possible, but would theoretically cost ~$62,000. But a 2SS 1LE isn't possible either, so the point is moot.

[Arodr395]

The only gripe I have with the new 1LE is that it has so much wheel gap in the front and especially in the rear. What reason did GM have to do that? Not even the regular 2016 SS or the new mustangs have that much wheel gap...

[ST1LE]

Originally Posted by Banshee

I don't get it...ONLY available V8 is a 1SS?

2103 1LE 2SS outsold 1SS by 3 to 1 (1413 2SS 413 1SS)
2014 1LE 2SS 1792 units to 676 for 1SS or roughly 2.5 to 1 ratio..
2015?

I am no marketing guy...GM deletes the 2SS 1LE and ADDS a 1LT and 2LT?

WTF?

I see a Competition Orange track pack 350 GT in my future parked next to the 1LE.

You do know a 1SS-1LE is still more equipped than a GT350TP right? So complaining how 2SS is not available and then spending approx $12K more for a less equipped vehicle does not add up.

[ST1LE]

Originally Posted by Banshee

A GT 350 with track pack is $55,195. Less features? sure....depends on what you want.

I am speculating the reason the 1LE will only be in a 1SS is due weight and cost of the 2SS versus the GT 350 with track pack.

The price of a 1SS is $5,000 LESS then a 2SS and shaving weight and saving cash in the process.

People would absolutely balk at a 2SS with a 1LE because when it was all said and done, once you added the 1LE option ($4000+/-)to a 2SS with all the performance goodies checked off, it would be a $52,000 Camaro...the same ballpark as a GT 350 in price...but the GT 350 has a far better engine, unparalleled handling and would have a lighter curb weight...Thus, the 1LE is a non-competitor.

So the only was to compete, and yes, not a direct comparison (1LE and GT 350) was to ONLY allow the 1SS for weight and $$$ savings. The 1LE is not in the same category as the GT 350....no matter how you slice it.

I sort of agree with you, but the fact the 1LE will likely be faster than the base GT350 I think there is a lot of grey area there. Not the same category as far as the unique engine, etc, but in the end of the day we are talking track cars and all that matters are track times in this category so I think they are certainly in the same category.

[ST1LE]

Originally Posted by Arodr395

The only gripe I have with the new 1LE is that it has so much wheel gap in the front and especially in the rear. What reason did GM have to do that? Not even the regular 2016 SS or the new mustangs have that much wheel gap...

You are right, its HUGE! Also my only complaint, but I know it is about performance, ever if that means sacrificing a mean stance.

The 5th Gen 1LE also sat higher than the SS, and the wheel gap looks worse with the stretched rear tire.

[SS 1LE]

Originally Posted by Banshee

A GT 350 with track pack is $55,195. Less features? sure....depends on what you want.

A GT350 with the track pack is $56,495 (you forgot the $1300 gas guzzler tax). With a lot less features, and have you seen the cheap looking center stack if you don't get the tech pack? So with he SS/1LE most likely coming in around $43,000 that makes the Camaro over $13,000 cheaper. That is a big difference.

Originally Posted by Banshee

...but the GT 350 has a far better engine, unparalleled handling and would have a lighter curb weight...Thus, the 1LE is a non-competitor.

Better, maybe, depends on your needs. "Far better", well not even close...heck, the LT1 makes MORE torque. The regular SS comes pretty close to (non R) GT350 handling, and from what I've just read, matches the M4 which is like twice the price. The SS/1LE I feel will easily beat the regular GT350, and at least match, if not improve on the the GT350 track pack in many ways, for less money.

Originally Posted by Banshee

The 1LE is not in the same category as the GT 350....no matter how you slice it.

I think a lot of people are going to be really butt hurt when the SS/1LE tests versus the GT350 happen...mainly people with pony logos on their cars.

[SS 1LE]

Originally Posted by ST1LE

... but in the end of the day we are talking track cars and all that matters are track times in this category so I think they are certainly in the same category.

Agreed.

[SS 1LE]

Originally Posted by Banshee

I don't get it...ONLY available V8 is a 1SS?

2103 1LE 2SS outsold 1SS by 3 to 1 (1413 2SS 413 1SS)
2014 1LE 2SS 1792 units to 676 for 1SS or roughly 2.5 to 1 ratio..
2015?

I am no marketing guy...GM deletes the 2SS 1LE and ADDS a 1LT and 2LT?

WTF?

I see a Competition Orange track pack 350 GT in my future parked next to the 1LE.

Did you actually read the full equipment list?

It's more like a 1.5SS if you ask me...what's really missing? The disco lights, blind spot warnings, fancy door sill plates, upgraded stereo, minor stuff with no place in a track day car IMO. And if you want the lights and sills, they are LPO options anyway...

The 1LE (not including all the performance upgrades obviously) has suede and leather trimmed seats (which is better than just leather), suede trimmed steering wheel and shift knob, Recaros, HUD, etc, all upgrades you can't get on a 1SS, and except the HUD, can't even get on a 2SS...

[ST1LE]

Originally Posted by SUMMIT WHITE SS

Did you actually read the full equipment list?

It's more like a 1.5SS if you ask me...what's really missing? The disco lights, blind spot warnings, fancy door sill plates, upgraded stereo, minor stuff with no place in a track day car IMO. And if you want the lights and sills, they are LPO options anyway...

The 1LE (not including all the performance upgrades obviously) has suede and leather trimmed seats (which is better than just leather), suede trimmed steering wheel and shift knob, Recaros, HUD, etc, all upgrades you can't get on a 1SS, and except the HUD, can't even get on a 2SS...

What is missing, only everything that doesn't help the car go faster.

I think GM has been peeking through my windows or using a mind reading device. They have quite literally given me EVERYTHING I wanted in the 1LE.

I wanted a 1SS from the start, as most 2SS goodies while sweet are not something I want. I only sad I could not get HUD and better seat material, so GM really gave me everything I could have wanted/expected from the 1LE by making the recaros leather/alcantara and adding teh HUD to the 1SS.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by SUMMIT WHITE SS

And if you want the lights and sills, they are LPO options anyway...

This is an important point...the lights, doorsills, and kneepads are LPOs and/or accessories. (I've already played around with builds...assuming the 1LE will cost $7000...and adding these items to the car is still less $$ than a 2SS with big brakes, NPP, and Mag Ride.)

The stereo isn't "bad", unless you're an audiophile. And those people are likely to swap out stuff anyways. Oh, and it doesn't say the word "Bose"...which we all know is half the cost...

Originally Posted by ST1LE

What is missing, only everything that doesn't help the car go faster.

I think GM has been peeking through my windows or using a mind reading device. They have quite literally given me EVERYTHING I wanted in the 1LE.

I wanted a 1SS from the start, as most 2SS goodies while sweet are not something I want. I only sad I could not get HUD and better seat material, so GM really gave me everything I could have wanted/expected from the 1LE by making the recaros leather/alcantara and adding teh HUD to the 1SS.

[Arodr395]

Originally Posted by ST1LE

You are right, its HUGE! Also my only complaint, but I know it is about performance, ever if that means sacrificing a mean stance.

The 5th Gen 1LE also sat higher than the SS, and the wheel gap looks worse with the stretched rear tire.

Yep, the 5th Gen 1LE also had this issue, thats why I immediately installed 1" (linear) lowering springs all around my 2014 1LE when I received it. But the 6th Gen 1LE looks to have even more wheel gap than the previous Gen 1LE, even with having 305's on the rear this time. I assume trying to find progressive lowering springs for the 6th Gen that will also work with the MRC system in the car will take some time.