2012 ZL1 Compared to the 2012 GT500

[a_Username]

Originally Posted by OLD_GOAT

There are lots of Ford fanbois who wouldn't buy a $55.000 Camaro.

Oh I disagree.

[casper sc/1ss/rs]

this is so funny but interesting i hope it dont stop now

[casper sc/1ss/rs]

Originally Posted by fiascoes1

What the hell are you doing in this site, you are a camaro hater! If you are looking like it says in your headline, go look at a ford forum! : chevy:

whooooo chevy.well said!!

[ironpeddler]

I think that Ford is really, really happy right now with the current specs of the ZL1. I'm basing this off of the motortrend article about the 2015 mustang, the next gen mustang. So if the article is false I appologize for my post. Basically it said that there will not be a gt500 when the next gen mustang comes out in 2015. The current gt500 will be in production for at least a few more years even when the next generation v6/v8 models come out. It will be a few years after that before they release the new gt500/cobra or w/e it will be called. The current gt500 will be in production probably about as long as the new ZL1 coming out IMHO. They ZL1 will be in production for at least a few years for CHevy to justify all the r&d cost of the car. So FOrd has said that they are boring out the 5.4 to a 5.8L and slapping a TVS blower on it, to compete with the new ZL1. This will probably happend sometime pretty soon actually.

Basically why I am saying this is because I'm suprised that chevy really didn't look to far ahead when designing the current ZL1. IT's out for a year maybe even less and then Ford is going to offer a bored out 5.4 to a 5.8 with a tvs blower that I can almost gurantee will be over 600hp. With the weight difference of the two and the zl1 making less power...do you see?? Why compare the ZL1 to a car that's out now, compare it to the car it will be going up against which will be the 2013/2014 gt500 not the 2012. You guys are doing exactly what chevy did, comparing a car that's not in production yet to a car that is. Build a future car to compete against a future car or get burnt. It would have been so easy for Chevy to bump hp up to 600, why not just go ahead and do it?

That brings us to the suspension. So many people think that the IRS will enable you to outrun a lighter, more HP mustang because you have magnetic ride control?? ZL1 has magnetic ride control this and that and Ford chariot suspension sucks. Well not really. Get a ZL1 with magnetic ride control and race a lighter more powerful gt500 with chariot suspension and let me know what happens. As some have already said, yet so many decline to understand, the only time you will see a difference between IRS and SRA is on bumpy roads. That is the only time that IRS will out-do FOrd's current SRA. Only on bumps or rough roads people. On a strip or track or street roads that are smooth the current the two different suspensions will probably be about equal. I understand that some of the streets are rough out there and the camaro will be better on those rough roads. But to think that the camaro is going to out-run or out-duel the mustang I just don't know. It is going to be at least 200 lbs. heavier, will make less power than the 2013 mustang, doesn't have forged internals, looks are completely subjective. Does the LSA have an aluminum block? You have to look at the big picture, encompass everything. You can't just be like IRS makes ZL1 better than gt500 because I'm a fanboi. That's not how it works. What about everything else that the gt500 offers that the ZL1 doesn't???????????????????????

Chevy should have planned for this IMHO. Did they think Ford was just going to sit by and let the ZL1 take over? AGain this post was made after reading the motortrend article about the next generation (2015) mustang. If that article is un-true then my post is probably a mute point. If the article is true then my post has merit to it.

[IOMZL1]

This assumes te ZL1 is maxed out - why show all of thier hand now when they don't need to? So the GT500 ups the HP for 2013 - maybe GM already has an answer to unleash 6 months after the 2012 in the 2013 model year. Maybe after track testing they decided on 580 because that was good enough to put them well ahead of the GT500 knowing that if Ford steps it up they have some more tricks left. They aren't blind - I'm sure they've considered these things. In 2014 it will be an all new platform for the Camaro as well so no need to dispute that now.

As for IRS, yes it shines over the live axle when there are bumps. How many roads and tracks are super smooth? I'd personally rather have the IRS knowing I've got it covered either way. 'well you won, but let's take it to a smooth surface' not what I want to be saying - especially for a $55000 car.

Edit: yes forged internals are great but why add cost where it is not necessary? If it makes the HP and the engine holds up does it matter? The only argument I can think of is extreme modding but that doesn't matter to GM, at least not when trying to provide the biggest bang for the buck.

Yes the LSA block is aluminum. I think everyone praising the ZL1 is looking at the entire package. The only downside I can see is the weight as of now - what does the GT500 offer to trump ZL1 other than a convertible?

[2012ZL1]

den318=troll.

[zurk80]

I'm not sure why I subject myself to reading all this non-sense, but I do. I am a GM guy all the way, however I can & do respect other non GM vehicles. I believe the ZL1 is going to be an awesome car. Currently the GT500 is KING because you can go down to your local Ford dealer & buy one today if you want. In seven months or so when ZL1's start arriving @ dealers, I'm quite certain they will best the GT500 in every test category. I'm only basing this on the known specs of the current GT500 & current ZL1 information we know. Yes the 2013 GT500 will be out about the same time as the 2012 ZL1 & yes Ford I'm sure will tweak said 2013 GT500. However, I don't see them being able to make vast improvements with the current platform & stay in the same price range it is currently in. Maybe they up the power a bit & maybe they make optional equipment standard or suspension upgrades available, but I think they will save their haymaker punch for the next platform Mustang. If that is the case then Chevrolet will soon follow with the new Camaro platform & the competition will start all over again. We won't really have an answer until Chevrolet let's outside sources test drive the ZL1 & then we will start to receive comparison #'s & reviews. I would be willing to bet the ZL1 comes out on top of most if not all performance categories, which is really what is important for these types of cars. All other categories are subjective & a winner in them can't really be determined. IMVHO of course.

[OLD_GOAT]

Like it or not, there are actually people who will only drive automatic cars. In this context the ZL1 wins, versus any Shelby. At least GM will get that customer.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by OLD_GOAT

Like it or not, there are actually people who will only drive automatic cars. In this context the ZL1 wins, versus any Shelby. At least GM will get that customer.

+1,000,000

[fiascoes1]

Originally Posted by ironpeddler

I think that Ford is really, really happy right now with the current specs of the ZL1. I'm basing this off of the motortrend article about the 2015 mustang, the next gen mustang. So if the article is false I appologize for my post. Basically it said that there will not be a gt500 when the next gen mustang comes out in 2015. The current gt500 will be in production for at least a few more years even when the next generation v6/v8 models come out. It will be a few years after that before they release the new gt500/cobra or w/e it will be called. The current gt500 will be in production probably about as long as the new ZL1 coming out IMHO. They ZL1 will be in production for at least a few years for CHevy to justify all the r&d cost of the car. So FOrd has said that they are boring out the 5.4 to a 5.8L and slapping a TVS blower on it, to compete with the new ZL1. This will probably happend sometime pretty soon actually.

Basically why I am saying this is because I'm suprised that chevy really didn't look to far ahead when designing the current ZL1. IT's out for a year maybe even less and then Ford is going to offer a bored out 5.4 to a 5.8 with a tvs blower that I can almost gurantee will be over 600hp. With the weight difference of the two and the zl1 making less power...do you see?? Why compare the ZL1 to a car that's out now, compare it to the car it will be going up against which will be the 2013/2014 gt500 not the 2012. You guys are doing exactly what chevy did, comparing a car that's not in production yet to a car that is. Build a future car to compete against a future car or get burnt. It would have been so easy for Chevy to bump hp up to 600, why not just go ahead and do it?

That brings us to the suspension. So many people think that the IRS will enable you to outrun a lighter, more HP mustang because you have magnetic ride control?? ZL1 has magnetic ride control this and that and Ford chariot suspension sucks. Well not really. Get a ZL1 with magnetic ride control and race a lighter more powerful gt500 with chariot suspension and let me know what happens. As some have already said, yet so many decline to understand, the only time you will see a difference between IRS and SRA is on bumpy roads. That is the only time that IRS will out-do FOrd's current SRA. Only on bumps or rough roads people. On a strip or track or street roads that are smooth the current the two different suspensions will probably be about equal. I understand that some of the streets are rough out there and the camaro will be better on those rough roads. But to think that the camaro is going to out-run or out-duel the mustang I just don't know. It is going to be at least 200 lbs. heavier, will make less power than the 2013 mustang, doesn't have forged internals, looks are completely subjective. Does the LSA have an aluminum block? You have to look at the big picture, encompass everything. You can't just be like IRS makes ZL1 better than gt500 because I'm a fanboi. That's not how it works. What about everything else that the gt500 offers that the ZL1 doesn't???????????????????????

Chevy should have planned for this IMHO. Did they think Ford was just going to sit by and let the ZL1 take over? AGain this post was made after reading the motortrend article about the next generation (2015) mustang. If that article is un-true then my post is probably a mute point. If the article is true then my post has merit to it.

Chevy can make changes for 2013,14,15, also we are comparing 2012 to 2012.

[2012ZL1]

Originally Posted by ironpeddler

I think that Ford is really, really happy right now with the current specs of the ZL1. I'm basing this off of the motortrend article about the 2015 mustang, the next gen mustang. So if the article is false I appologize for my post. Basically it said that there will not be a gt500 when the next gen mustang comes out in 2015. The current gt500 will be in production for at least a few more years even when the next generation v6/v8 models come out. It will be a few years after that before they release the new gt500/cobra or w/e it will be called. The current gt500 will be in production probably about as long as the new ZL1 coming out IMHO. They ZL1 will be in production for at least a few years for CHevy to justify all the r&d cost of the car. So FOrd has said that they are boring out the 5.4 to a 5.8L and slapping a TVS blower on it, to compete with the new ZL1. This will probably happend sometime pretty soon actually.


Basically why I am saying this is because I'm suprised that chevy really didn't look to far ahead when designing the current ZL1. IT's out for a year maybe even less and then Ford is going to offer a bored out 5.4 to a 5.8 with a tvs blower that I can almost gurantee will be over 600hp. With the weight difference of the two and the zl1 making less power...do you see?? Why compare the ZL1 to a car that's out now, compare it to the car it will be going up against which will be the 2013/2014 gt500 not the 2012. You guys are doing exactly what chevy did, comparing a car that's not in production yet to a car that is. Build a future car to compete against a future car or get burnt. It would have been so easy for Chevy to bump hp up to 600, why not just go ahead and do it?

That brings us to the suspension. So many people think that the IRS will enable you to outrun a lighter, more HP mustang because you have magnetic ride control?? ZL1 has magnetic ride control this and that and Ford chariot suspension sucks. Well not really. Get a ZL1 with magnetic ride control and race a lighter more powerful gt500 with chariot suspension and let me know what happens. As some have already said, yet so many decline to understand, the only time you will see a difference between IRS and SRA is on bumpy roads. That is the only time that IRS will out-do FOrd's current SRA. Only on bumps or rough roads people. On a strip or track or street roads that are smooth the current the two different suspensions will probably be about equal. I understand that some of the streets are rough out there and the camaro will be better on those rough roads. But to think that the camaro is going to out-run or out-duel the mustang I just don't know. It is going to be at least 200 lbs. heavier, will make less power than the 2013 mustang, doesn't have forged internals, looks are completely subjective. Does the LSA have an aluminum block? You have to look at the big picture, encompass everything. You can't just be like IRS makes ZL1 better than gt500 because I'm a fanboi. That's not how it works. What about everything else that the gt500 offers that the ZL1 doesn't???????????????????????

Chevy should have planned for this IMHO. Did they think Ford was just going to sit by and let the ZL1 take over? AGain this post was made after reading the motortrend article about the next generation (2015) mustang. If that article is un-true then my post is probably a mute point. If the article is true then my post has merit to it.

Ya... but Fords are pooh.

[The IOM Ninja]

Originally Posted by 2012ZL1

Ya... but Fords are pooh.

The American Education System at it's best

[The IOM Ninja]

Originally Posted by IOMZL1

This assumes te ZL1 is maxed out - why show all of thier hand now when they don't need to? So the GT500 ups the HP for 2013 - maybe GM already has an answer to unleash 6 months after the 2012 in the 2013 model year. Maybe after track testing they decided on 580 because that was good enough to put them well ahead of the GT500 knowing that if Ford steps it up they have some more tricks left. They aren't blind - I'm sure they've considered these things. In 2014 it will be an all new platform for the Camaro as well so no need to dispute that now.

As for IRS, yes it shines over the live axle when there are bumps. How many roads and tracks are super smooth? I'd personally rather have the IRS knowing I've got it covered either way. 'well you won, but let's take it to a smooth surface' not what I want to be saying - especially for a $55000 car.

Edit: yes forged internals are great but why add cost where it is not necessary? If it makes the HP and the engine holds up does it matter? The only argument I can think of is extreme modding but that doesn't matter to GM, at least not when trying to provide the biggest bang for the buck.

Yes the LSA block is aluminum. I think everyone praising the ZL1 is looking at the entire package. The only downside I can see is the weight as of now - what does the GT500 offer to trump ZL1 other than a convertible?

The interior, the fact that it's not morbidly obese, until I hear the ZL1 in person the exhaust note (I have no reason to believe I'll be disappointed). The ZL1 will probably have a hefty dealer markup.

[OldScoolCamaro]

Originally Posted by ironpeddler

I
Chevy should have planned for this IMHO. Did they think Ford was just going to sit by and let the ZL1 take over? AGain this post was made after reading the motortrend article about the next generation (2015) mustang. If that article is un-true then my post is probably a mute point. If the article is true then my post has merit to it.

...thanks for your post....lets cut to the chase,your article is irrevelant...thank you for choosing Camaro5.com...LOL...