New photos: Camaro Z28 Testing Against GT500 - Page 33 - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

Cowboy from Hell · 08-23-2010, 01:06 PM

Well you never know GM could give the Z28 Camaro a similar wieght saving treatment as they gave the Z06 Corvette.

Ok it's doubtful due to cost... but a man can dream!!

chain777 · 08-23-2010, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jayman

the cts-v is not all wheel drive. Never has been and never will be.

Yea, really. If you're going to tell someone, a mod no less, that they don't know what they're talking about, at least get your facts right.

Back to the topic. I'm sure they are trying to match or exceed the performance of the GT500. And I'm also sure Ford isn't resting on it's laurels. The rate that Ford is introducing new or significantly upgraded products is impressive right now. They're on a roll.

I can't wait to see what GM has to answer back with the Z/28. It just keeps getting better.

blufin · 08-23-2010, 01:40 PM

CTS-V is all wheel drive? Better check your facts a little better.

*DGthe3* · 08-23-2010, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rez333

You don't know what you're talking about, obviously. The 2011's track time of 2:58s is right up there with the Z06 and 6s faster than an all-wheel-drive CTS-V. No other company has managed to make a 2-wheel-drive car over 3800lbs go that fast. All cars 3800lbs or heavier getting those times are all AWD.

Do you really think GM knows how to make a 4000lb Z/28 faster than the AWD CTS-V and as fast as a 3175lb Z06? I didn't think so. Ford's achievement is magical because when you look at it, it sounds impossible.

I look at it and it doesn't sound impossible. Its not like the GTR vs Z06 'ring times from a couple years ago. Different drivers on different days can account for a couple seconds without much issue. Thats why I like the Lightning Lap competition from Car&Driver. And if you look at their times between different years, you can see several seconds difference between unchanged models.

rez333 · 08-23-2010, 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jayman

the cts-v is not all wheel drive. Never has been and never will be.

I suppose this article is wrong then:
http://carscoop.blogspot.com/2010/05...arts-from.html

Granted though, it's true from different years of the Lightning Lap that the results seem inconsistent; but I just don't see how the Z/28's handling could outmatch the CTS-V. The CTS-V already gets a 3.9s 0-60 so we know it's fast in a straight line, and with the magnetic shocks we know it has amazing handling too. I just don't see GM making a cheaper car (Z/28) go faster than the CTS-V.

Take the Camaro SS for instance. You would think they would have produced a car that clearly outmatches the 2010 Mustang GT, but no it didn't. The 100+HP advantage could easily account for some of the areas where the SS was superior to the GT, but the GT beat the SS in many handling areas.

chain777 · 08-23-2010, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rez333

I suppose this article is wrong then:
http://carscoop.blogspot.com/2010/05...arts-from.html

>

No, it's right. The regular CTS is available in AWD, but not the V.

91Z28350 · 08-23-2010, 03:41 PM

The CTS series is available AWD. The CTS-V is rear wheel only.

*DGthe3* · 08-23-2010, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rez333

I suppose this article is wrong then:
http://carscoop.blogspot.com/2010/05...arts-from.html

Granted though, it's true from different years of the Lightning Lap that the results seem inconsistent; but I just don't see how the Z/28's handling could outmatch the CTS-V. The CTS-V already gets a 3.9s 0-60 so we know it's fast in a straight line, and with the magnetic shocks we know it has amazing handling too. I just don't see GM making a cheaper car (Z/28) go faster than the CTS-V.

Take the Camaro SS for instance. You would think they would have produced a car that clearly outmatches the 2010 Mustang GT, but no it didn't. The 100+HP advantage could easily account for some of the areas where the SS was superior to the GT, but the GT beat the SS in many handling areas.

The MR shocks are as much for ride comfort as they are for performance. The Camaro could do without them and have equally good handling, but it would be a lot harsher. Then there is the weight advantage it will have over the CTS-V. GM already makes a cheaper car than the CTS-V that outperforms it, it's the Corvette Grand Sport.

For the Mustang, you are ignoring the fact that nearly all the comparisons with the 2010 GT were against the track pack equipped cars. Even then, I don't recall too many instances where the GT ran quicker times than an SS. It might have posted better numbers for calibrated tests, but it wasn't enough to top the overall performance of the Camaro.

*radz28* · 08-24-2010, 12:37 PM

I believe we're going to see a great improvement in handling from SS. I'm sure there will still be some bugs to be worked out, but with SS being out for a few years by the time Z28 arrives, I think that's plenty of opportunity to look and feel out what the deficiencies are. We know they are not looking into what the aftermarket is doing to the cars, and I think they won't be as tied to trying to make the care pleasable to as many people as they had to with SS/LS/LT. They needed to re-establish CAMARO, and now they can focus on trying to keep us enthusiasts interested and coming into the showrooms. More aggressive suspension, some trade-offs in terms of NVH for some more power and traction, and I think the doubters will be relatively impressed.

JMVHO.

rez333 · 08-24-2010, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DGthe3

The MR shocks are as much for ride comfort as they are for performance. The Camaro could do without them and have equally good handling, but it would be a lot harsher. Then there is the weight advantage it will have over the CTS-V. GM already makes a cheaper car than the CTS-V that outperforms it, it's the Corvette Grand Sport.

For the Mustang, you are ignoring the fact that nearly all the comparisons with the 2010 GT were against the track pack equipped cars. Even then, I don't recall too many instances where the GT ran quicker times than an SS. It might have posted better numbers for calibrated tests, but it wasn't enough to top the overall performance of the Camaro.

my bad about the AWD.

To your point, I guess we will have to see. You have some good points, but I might add that the Corvette is a sports car, the Camaro technically is not. The Corvette easily out-performs the CTS-V by virtue of its substantial weight advantage, a substantial weight-advantage that the Z/28 does not have. I would also argue that the CTS-V platform is a better performance platform than the Camaro's Zeta platform.

The real competition will be in 2014 when the new platforms come out for Camaro and Mustang. That will be a glorious war to behold, as the Camaro will lose its weight disadvantage and the Mustang will lose its SRA.

jayman · 08-24-2010, 11:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rez333

my bad about the AWD.

To your point, I guess we will have to see. You have some good points, but I might add that the Corvette is a sports car, the Camaro technically is not. The Corvette easily out-performs the CTS-V by virtue of its substantial weight advantage, a substantial weight-advantage that the Z/28 does not have. I would also argue that the CTS-V platform is a better performance platform than the Camaro's Zeta platform.

isn't the cts-v on a slightly modified zeta platform right now?

*DGthe3* · 08-24-2010, 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jayman

isn't the cts-v on a slightly modified zeta platform right now?

Sorta. Zeta is based off Sigma but its more than 'slightly modified'. There are probably more differences than similarities.

*Mr. Wyndham* · 08-25-2010, 08:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jayman

isn't the cts-v on a slightly modified zeta platform right now?

Quote:

Originally Posted by DGthe3

Sorta. Zeta is based off Sigma but its more than 'slightly modified'. There are probably more differences than similarities.

I'm sure Fen could deliver a paper on the differences...but basically -- Sigma is an IRS RWD platform. Zeta is an IRS RWD platform -- that's where the similarities end.

Zeta features a more advanced IRS setup, but "less" advanced front. Zeta is mildly lighter, cheaper, and more modular than Sigma. Sigma is more refined, leading to its Cadillac-exclusive service. Sigma is also much older than the Zeta platform.

I don't know details...but they are very different.

Napper · 08-27-2010, 05:59 AM

Just one thing.

now that the 11 Gt500 SvtPP is a great handler, beat the Grand Sport around VIR
and has th muscle to run low 12's stock.....

what says this Shelby doesn't become the Golden egg......a collectable...

as they are going to cammer engines....it will be the last small block Shelby and maybe that enough to make it a collectable.

tough call. Don't hate me ...but i like the GT500. considering you can get a loaded up one for 50k otd

thats alost of car. its a pulley swap /plugs and canned tune (700dollars away from crushing A Zl575)

i priced out the mods.....1200 installed and your making 570 rwhp

that 5.4 is bullet proof...Ford Gt (40's) make over 1000 hp with this very same motor.
6 bolt main.

The Z28 is in a hard place... The vette and the caddy stand in its way......

I'm a GM guy, but occasionally i'll buy dodge or Ford.....i've had an Srt and a Svt product.

i can honestly say i was quite pleased with both.

One thing for certain these are great times!!

08-23-2010, 01:40 PM	#451
blufin Drives: Fire Engine Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: WPB, Florida Posts: 1,415	CTS-V is all wheel drive? Better check your facts a little better. __________________ 12.618 @ 110.75 Bone Stock 1/4 mile 8.165 @ 86.52 Bone Stock 1/8 mile 11.189 @ 124.44 on a 1.73 60' TVS2300 3.4 pulley, JRE tuned, Kooks LT headers and HF cats, MBRP catback exhaust, CAI intake, ADM scoop. Stock wheels/tires. Sold

08-24-2010, 12:37 PM	#457
radz28 Petro-sexual Drives: Ultra-Grin Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Crazy Coast Posts: 15,198 View My Garage	I believe we're going to see a great improvement in handling from SS. I'm sure there will still be some bugs to be worked out, but with SS being out for a few years by the time Z28 arrives, I think that's plenty of opportunity to look and feel out what the deficiencies are. We know they are not looking into what the aftermarket is doing to the cars, and I think they won't be as tied to trying to make the care pleasable to as many people as they had to with SS/LS/LT. They needed to re-establish CAMARO, and now they can focus on trying to keep us enthusiasts interested and coming into the showrooms. More aggressive suspension, some trade-offs in terms of NVH for some more power and traction, and I think the doubters will be relatively impressed. JMVHO. __________________ '20 ZL1 Black "Fury" A10, PDR, Exposed CF Extractor Magnuson Magnum DI TVS2650R // RFBG // Soler 103 // TooHighPSI Port Injection // THPSI Billet Lid // FF // Katech Drop-In // PLM Heat Exchanger // ZLE Cradle bushings // BMR Chassis-Suspension Stuff // aFe Bars // Diode Dynamics LEDs // ACS Composites Guards // CF Dash // Aeroforce // tint // other stuffs

08-27-2010, 05:59 AM	#462
Napper Drives: 2SS RS A6/ CTS-V A6 LSA Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: SE Florida Posts: 258	Just one thing. now that the 11 Gt500 SvtPP is a great handler, beat the Grand Sport around VIR and has th muscle to run low 12's stock..... what says this Shelby doesn't become the Golden egg......a collectable... as they are going to cammer engines....it will be the last small block Shelby and maybe that enough to make it a collectable. tough call. Don't hate me ...but i like the GT500. considering you can get a loaded up one for 50k otd thats alost of car. its a pulley swap /plugs and canned tune (700dollars away from crushing A Zl575) i priced out the mods.....1200 installed and your making 570 rwhp that 5.4 is bullet proof...Ford Gt (40's) make over 1000 hp with this very same motor. 6 bolt main. The Z28 is in a hard place... The vette and the caddy stand in its way...... I'm a GM guy, but occasionally i'll buy dodge or Ford.....i've had an Srt and a Svt product. i can honestly say i was quite pleased with both. One thing for certain these are great times!! __________________ 10 2SS(7Psi)/10 CTS-V(9Psi) L99, ADM RACE CAI, TVS 2300,LG- Headers and X pipe ,catless 3 inch back w/Magnaflows , Ngk plugs,Msd wires,180 stat,Springs ( lowered 1"- looks solidly correct)Sways and endlinks,BMR trailing arms, Slotted rotors and Hawk HPS ,tuned ,Black out bowtie and custom (black)"SS" on sides /midnight rims (8psi) 2010 Raven (triple black.)CTS-v , crank pulley, Bubb CAI , AR Headers, custom catlessback. magnaflows. tune ( 9psi) former LS7, LS2 and LS1 owner.(Zo6, GTO's, WS6) Last edited by Napper; 08-27-2010 at 06:43 AM.

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08-23-2010, 01:06 PM	#449
Cowboy from Hell Drives: don't ask!! Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Chilliwack B.C Posts: 60	Well you never know GM could give the Z28 Camaro a similar wieght saving treatment as they gave the Z06 Corvette. Ok it's doubtful due to cost... but a man can dream!!

08-23-2010, 03:41 PM	#455
91Z28350 Drives: 2012 GT500 SVTPP 2010 Traverse LTZ Join Date: May 2009 Location: Roanoke,TX Posts: 665	The CTS series is available AWD. The CTS-V is rear wheel only.