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Camaro V8 LS3 / L99 Engine, Exhaust, and Bolt-Ons Bolt-Ons | Intakes | Exhaust

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Old 02-09-2012, 09:23 PM   #1
ztsmith86
 
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Everything LS3/L99 Oil Pumps

Gentlemen & Beautiful Ladies,

First off Robert (The Melling Oil Pump Engineer) called me. For all you naughty camaro5 members who are calling him .... please stop. He called me at work and asked how I would like my work phone to ring off the hook all day. Ok on to business.
For those who don’t realize this GM (usually) only makes enough parts for production of their vehicles. They don’t make a bunch of extras (oil pumps being my example) that are sold as GM replacements parts. This is where a company such as Melling comes in and reverse engineers GM’s (Camaro being my example) oil pump. Melling then becomes the manufacturer who makes all the replacement oil pumps that will be needed for repair. They
I'm going to address 5 oil pumps in the following order:

1. M295 - This is the stock GM oil pump for the LS3 Engine.
a. I talked directly to one of the engineers as GM who was involved as a tech for this specific oil pump. It is the recommended oil pump for an LS3 engine regardless of performance upgrades. It has no more issues with failures than any other performance/stock oil pump that anyone will be able to find in the world. The pressure relief valve “sticking” can happen in any oil pump with a pressure relief valve.

2. 10295 - This is the high pressure Melling upgrade for the M295 oil pump.
a. This is a recommended REPLACEMENT oil pump if you are an LS3 engine. It has a 10% increase in pressure over the stock M295 GM oil pump.

3. 10296 - This is the high volume Melling Upgrade for the M295.
a. This is another recommended REPLACEMENT oil pump if you are an LS3 engine. It has an 18% increase in volume over the M295 & 10295 oil pumps. (Note I did find out direct from Melling that it cannot run your stock LS3 oil pan dry). I was wrong about this. This oil pump will also require modifications if you intend to use it with a double roller timing set.

4. M355 - This is the stock GM oil pump for the L99 engine.
a. This oil pump will come on the L99 engines because of the different valvetrain configuration (VOD). It has a much high pressure/volume than a M295 found on the LS3 engines and is ABSOLUTELY NOT recommended for an LS3 engine.

5. 10355 - This is the Melling high volume performance upgrade for the M355.
a. This is the M355 REPLACEMENT oil pump if you are an L99 engine. It has an 33% increase in volume over the M295 & 10295 oil pumps. (Note I did find out direct from Melling that it cannot run your stock L99 oil pan dry). I was wrong about this.
b. This is very interesting, but even though this is what GM has Melling manufacture as a replacement oil pump for the GM M355 oil pump, Melling does not recommend this oil pump in any LS3/L99 engine. Basically they say even though this is what GM puts in their car they don’t recommend anyone use it , yet they do manufacture it as a replacement part for GM in replacement of the M355 oil pump for the L99 engine.

6. This is what I recommend (If you must have “piece of mind at night”). Texas Speed & Performance takes a STOCK M295 oil pump and then ports it for about a 10% increase in volume over the stock M295 oil pump and then SHIMS the internal parts. This by far the best option if you are considering buying an aftermarket (performance oil pump for your LS3 engine).

7. My final thoughts. I spoke with Texas Speed & Performance and they will openly tell you that you never need to replace your oil pump when doing performance upgrades. You never need to increase your stock pressure or volume. It doesn’t hurt you, but gives you no real benefits. TSP said it’s a waste of money. Let’s all think about it. How could increasing pressure or volume help you? A stock oil pump will provide you the pressure you need to maintain lubrication in your system. If you’re going to worry about your engine your money would be much better spent of harmonically balancing your engine, making sure you always change your oil & properly maintain it, regular service intervals, knowing your performance modifications have been properly installed by reputable shops, & correctly choosing a system that “works” together.

Lastly I’m sure there will be members who are still skeptical of my write-up, but I insure I spoke with key people who are involved in the behind the scenes work of all of these pumps. From GM to Melling I spoke directly to the engineers who build and test these pumps. For anyone who is curious I run the plain stock M295 oil pump in my engine and have no plans to ever swap it unless I pass the GM mileage service schedule for the life of the pump. I’m sure no one has even come close to hitting this mark! Thanks for reading.
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Old 02-09-2012, 09:40 PM   #2
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good info
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Old 02-09-2012, 10:29 PM   #3
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ok.. then what is recommended for an LS3 conversion from the L99?
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Old 02-09-2012, 10:31 PM   #4
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10295
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Old 02-09-2012, 10:35 PM   #5
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i have the ls3 conversion and my oil pressure is the same as it was stocl L99
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Old 02-09-2012, 10:36 PM   #6
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i have the ls3 conversion and my oil pressure is the same as it was stocl L99
+1
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Old 02-09-2012, 10:39 PM   #7
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Again, thank you for your time in getting this info
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Old 02-09-2012, 10:40 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bmbbl be View Post
i have the ls3 conversion and my oil pressure is the same as it was stocl L99
According to Melling that would be "VERY BAD"
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TSP 1 7/8" Long Tube Headers 304 SS MagnaFlow 2.5 Street Series Catback Exhaust K&N Cold Air Intake Comp Cams Camshaft227/235 .639"/.646"114LSA+2.5 REV 2.165 Hollow Stem Stainless Steel Valves Manley1.59 Stainless Steel Exhaust Valves GM LS7 Hydraulic Lifter Kit Katech CR-5 Timing Chain Manley Hardened Pushrods Comp Cams LSX Rocker Arm Trunion Kit A.I.R. Ported Cylinder Heads Catalytic Converter Delete
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Old 02-09-2012, 10:41 PM   #9
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ok.. then what is recommended for an LS3 conversion from the L99?
I would recommend the TSP ported & shimmed M295, Melling would say you would be fine with a 10295 or 10296, but there are trade offs for those 2 pumps .... i.e. cost and noted items in my first post
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----------------------
TSP 1 7/8" Long Tube Headers 304 SS MagnaFlow 2.5 Street Series Catback Exhaust K&N Cold Air Intake Comp Cams Camshaft227/235 .639"/.646"114LSA+2.5 REV 2.165 Hollow Stem Stainless Steel Valves Manley1.59 Stainless Steel Exhaust Valves GM LS7 Hydraulic Lifter Kit Katech CR-5 Timing Chain Manley Hardened Pushrods Comp Cams LSX Rocker Arm Trunion Kit A.I.R. Ported Cylinder Heads Catalytic Converter Delete
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Old 02-09-2012, 10:47 PM   #10
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If it adds any "good" to my original post I hold 2 engineering degrees from MIT and design water/wastewater systems all over the country. I have very practical and design knowledge of almost ever valve you could ever imagine ..... i.e. pressure relief valves. I'm not a engine expert by any means ... I really only state this info about me to give credit to my ability to assemble details
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2010 Camaro 2SS/RS LS3 Inferno Metallic
----------------------
TSP 1 7/8" Long Tube Headers 304 SS MagnaFlow 2.5 Street Series Catback Exhaust K&N Cold Air Intake Comp Cams Camshaft227/235 .639"/.646"114LSA+2.5 REV 2.165 Hollow Stem Stainless Steel Valves Manley1.59 Stainless Steel Exhaust Valves GM LS7 Hydraulic Lifter Kit Katech CR-5 Timing Chain Manley Hardened Pushrods Comp Cams LSX Rocker Arm Trunion Kit A.I.R. Ported Cylinder Heads Catalytic Converter Delete
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Old 02-09-2012, 10:49 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ztsmith86 View Post
I would recommend the TSP ported & shimmed M295, Melling would say you would be fine with a 10295 or 10296, but there are trade offs for those 2 pumps .... i.e. cost and noted items in my first post
I believe I ordered the 10296 with my cam swap... hmmm
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2011 2SS/RS
Performance: 439 RWHP A6: 226/236 Comp Cam, Kooks 1-7/8, CAInc, Borla S type, FTI Converter, Vmax TB, Rx Catch Can, Trans cooler, SLP 160 termo, Melling high volume, Eibach Springs/Sways 1" drop, Whiteline complete bushing kit.
Appearance:Smoked side markers and black bowties. Blk / Blue Carbon Fiber interior trim.

Next in order: F14s, 3.70 gears, DSS Axles, End links/Toe rods/trailing arms, Ported heads, S/C.







1100 7/02 Ordered
3800 8/09 Order produced
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Old 02-09-2012, 10:53 PM   #12
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I won't hurt anything to install it just understand what it changes for you and that it is not a necessary install for any reason. You won't be able to use a double roller timing chain with that oil pump without performing modifications.
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2010 Camaro 2SS/RS LS3 Inferno Metallic
----------------------
TSP 1 7/8" Long Tube Headers 304 SS MagnaFlow 2.5 Street Series Catback Exhaust K&N Cold Air Intake Comp Cams Camshaft227/235 .639"/.646"114LSA+2.5 REV 2.165 Hollow Stem Stainless Steel Valves Manley1.59 Stainless Steel Exhaust Valves GM LS7 Hydraulic Lifter Kit Katech CR-5 Timing Chain Manley Hardened Pushrods Comp Cams LSX Rocker Arm Trunion Kit A.I.R. Ported Cylinder Heads Catalytic Converter Delete
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Old 02-09-2012, 11:03 PM   #13
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On a different note it would be really nice if someone would do a very detailed writeup about performance lifters for our engines. I'm considering doing it, but it takes so much time calling people and sifting through the details. Also there are a LOT of aftermarket lifters.
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2010 Camaro 2SS/RS LS3 Inferno Metallic
----------------------
TSP 1 7/8" Long Tube Headers 304 SS MagnaFlow 2.5 Street Series Catback Exhaust K&N Cold Air Intake Comp Cams Camshaft227/235 .639"/.646"114LSA+2.5 REV 2.165 Hollow Stem Stainless Steel Valves Manley1.59 Stainless Steel Exhaust Valves GM LS7 Hydraulic Lifter Kit Katech CR-5 Timing Chain Manley Hardened Pushrods Comp Cams LSX Rocker Arm Trunion Kit A.I.R. Ported Cylinder Heads Catalytic Converter Delete
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Old 02-09-2012, 11:07 PM   #14
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Another thought to people looking to achieve better flows out of your oil pumps. You could just use a lighter weight oil, there would be some trade offs, but a lighter weight oil would give you better flow characteristics through any oil pump
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2010 Camaro 2SS/RS LS3 Inferno Metallic
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TSP 1 7/8" Long Tube Headers 304 SS MagnaFlow 2.5 Street Series Catback Exhaust K&N Cold Air Intake Comp Cams Camshaft227/235 .639"/.646"114LSA+2.5 REV 2.165 Hollow Stem Stainless Steel Valves Manley1.59 Stainless Steel Exhaust Valves GM LS7 Hydraulic Lifter Kit Katech CR-5 Timing Chain Manley Hardened Pushrods Comp Cams LSX Rocker Arm Trunion Kit A.I.R. Ported Cylinder Heads Catalytic Converter Delete
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Old 02-10-2012, 09:13 PM   #15
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As far as I know,plenty of L99's converted to LS3 are still running the factory L99 oil pumps with no issues.Correct me if I'm wrong.
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Old 02-10-2012, 10:09 PM   #16
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Very informative write up, thanks for the effort. Answered all my upgrade questions for my new cam.
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Old 04-04-2012, 09:53 PM   #17
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Thanks for the write up
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Old 04-04-2012, 10:07 PM   #18
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As far as I know,plenty of L99's converted to LS3 are still running the factory L99 oil pumps with no issues.Correct me if I'm wrong.
I have an L99 to LS3 converted motor and as far as I know am running the factory oil pump. No issues that I'm aware of..
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Old 04-05-2012, 02:04 AM   #19
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also just so you know all ls3 and l99 engines come with an active fuel managment(dod) oil pressure relief valve built into the oil pan ( yes even the ls3 engines have this, probly cheaper for gm just to build all the oil pans with this valve) , and if you leave it in you will always be limited to 50psi max, as the valve opens at 50 psi and blows the oil right back into the oil pan.

a 1/4" pipe plug fits perfect if you remove the valve, i have had mine out since i built my engine 12,000 miles ago and it works perfect with the l99 pump,, the factory oil filters have their own oil pressure relief built into them.
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Old 04-05-2012, 02:26 AM   #20
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I have never been a fan of aftermarket pumps. I've installed dozens because that is what people wanted, but I only recommend replacing them with stock if they are starting to go bad.
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Old 04-05-2012, 04:27 PM   #21
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Quote:
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As far as I know,plenty of L99's converted to LS3 are still running the factory L99 oil pumps with no issues.Correct me if I'm wrong.
+1


Probably that's just marketing
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Old 11-27-2012, 12:22 AM   #22
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HMMM...IM NOT BUYING THE "ANY OIL PUMP WITH A RELIEF VALVE STICKS PART"

GM NEEDS TO OWN THEY HAVE A SHITTY PART...MANY OWNERS PUMPS ARE STICKING AT LESS THEN 5000 MILES...MINE MADE IT TO 50,000.....NUFF SAID
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Old 07-01-2013, 08:35 PM   #23
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Interesting that GM is now trying to charge me $1700 for a new oil pump, stating that it failed because my car is cammed. My car has 20k miles on it.
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Old 07-02-2013, 11:30 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ztsmith86 View Post
If it adds any "good" to my original post I hold 2 engineering degrees from MIT and design water/wastewater systems all over the country. I have very practical and design knowledge of almost ever valve you could ever imagine ..... i.e. pressure relief valves. I'm not a engine expert by any means ... I really only state this info about me to give credit to my ability to assemble details
Things like Q and Re mean the same thing regardless of fluid type and application. Source: I have two engineering degrees from NJIT.

Thank you anyway for the information. There seems to be a lot of nitpicking on details like this here. Hopefully this will put some of it to rest.

PS-Fluid Mechanics was one of my favorite classes.
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Old 07-02-2013, 11:41 AM   #25
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Quote:
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As far as I know,plenty of L99's converted to LS3 are still running the factory L99 oil pumps with no issues.Correct me if I'm wrong.
This is truth.

Great info on what part numbers do what for folks though. Thanks for helpin it out!

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