Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums - Camaro5.com
 
Bigwormgraphix
Go Back   Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums - Camaro5.com > Engine | Drivetrain | Powertrain Technical Discussions > Camaro V8 LS3 / L99 Engine, Exhaust, and Bolt-Ons


Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 02-09-2012, 08:23 PM   #1
ztsmith86
 
ztsmith86's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Camaro 2SS/RS
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Ames, IA
Posts: 331
Everything LS3/L99 Oil Pumps

Gentlemen & Beautiful Ladies,

First off Robert (The Melling Oil Pump Engineer) called me. For all you naughty camaro5 members who are calling him .... please stop. He called me at work and asked how I would like my work phone to ring off the hook all day. Ok on to business.
For those who don’t realize this GM (usually) only makes enough parts for production of their vehicles. They don’t make a bunch of extras (oil pumps being my example) that are sold as GM replacements parts. This is where a company such as Melling comes in and reverse engineers GM’s (Camaro being my example) oil pump. Melling then becomes the manufacturer who makes all the replacement oil pumps that will be needed for repair. They
I'm going to address 5 oil pumps in the following order:

1. M295 - This is the stock GM oil pump for the LS3 Engine.
a. I talked directly to one of the engineers as GM who was involved as a tech for this specific oil pump. It is the recommended oil pump for an LS3 engine regardless of performance upgrades. It has no more issues with failures than any other performance/stock oil pump that anyone will be able to find in the world. The pressure relief valve “sticking” can happen in any oil pump with a pressure relief valve.

2. 10295 - This is the high pressure Melling upgrade for the M295 oil pump.
a. This is a recommended REPLACEMENT oil pump if you are an LS3 engine. It has a 10% increase in pressure over the stock M295 GM oil pump.

3. 10296 - This is the high volume Melling Upgrade for the M295.
a. This is another recommended REPLACEMENT oil pump if you are an LS3 engine. It has an 18% increase in volume over the M295 & 10295 oil pumps. (Note I did find out direct from Melling that it cannot run your stock LS3 oil pan dry). I was wrong about this. This oil pump will also require modifications if you intend to use it with a double roller timing set.

4. M355 - This is the stock GM oil pump for the L99 engine.
a. This oil pump will come on the L99 engines because of the different valvetrain configuration (VOD). It has a much high pressure/volume than a M295 found on the LS3 engines and is ABSOLUTELY NOT recommended for an LS3 engine.

5. 10355 - This is the Melling high volume performance upgrade for the M355.
a. This is the M355 REPLACEMENT oil pump if you are an L99 engine. It has an 33% increase in volume over the M295 & 10295 oil pumps. (Note I did find out direct from Melling that it cannot run your stock L99 oil pan dry). I was wrong about this.
b. This is very interesting, but even though this is what GM has Melling manufacture as a replacement oil pump for the GM M355 oil pump, Melling does not recommend this oil pump in any LS3/L99 engine. Basically they say even though this is what GM puts in their car they don’t recommend anyone use it , yet they do manufacture it as a replacement part for GM in replacement of the M355 oil pump for the L99 engine.

6. This is what I recommend (If you must have “piece of mind at night”). Texas Speed & Performance takes a STOCK M295 oil pump and then ports it for about a 10% increase in volume over the stock M295 oil pump and then SHIMS the internal parts. This by far the best option if you are considering buying an aftermarket (performance oil pump for your LS3 engine).

7. My final thoughts. I spoke with Texas Speed & Performance and they will openly tell you that you never need to replace your oil pump when doing performance upgrades. You never need to increase your stock pressure or volume. It doesn’t hurt you, but gives you no real benefits. TSP said it’s a waste of money. Let’s all think about it. How could increasing pressure or volume help you? A stock oil pump will provide you the pressure you need to maintain lubrication in your system. If you’re going to worry about your engine your money would be much better spent of harmonically balancing your engine, making sure you always change your oil & properly maintain it, regular service intervals, knowing your performance modifications have been properly installed by reputable shops, & correctly choosing a system that “works” together.

Lastly I’m sure there will be members who are still skeptical of my write-up, but I insure I spoke with key people who are involved in the behind the scenes work of all of these pumps. From GM to Melling I spoke directly to the engineers who build and test these pumps. For anyone who is curious I run the plain stock M295 oil pump in my engine and have no plans to ever swap it unless I pass the GM mileage service schedule for the life of the pump. I’m sure no one has even come close to hitting this mark! Thanks for reading.
__________________

2010 Camaro 2SS/RS LS3 Inferno Metallic
----------------------
TSP 1 7/8" Long Tube Headers 304 SS MagnaFlow 2.5 Street Series Catback Exhaust K&N Cold Air Intake Comp Cams Camshaft227/235 .639"/.646"114LSA+2.5 REV 2.165 Hollow Stem Stainless Steel Valves Manley1.59 Stainless Steel Exhaust Valves GM LS7 Hydraulic Lifter Kit Katech CR-5 Timing Chain Manley Hardened Pushrods Comp Cams LSX Rocker Arm Trunion Kit A.I.R. Ported Cylinder Heads Catalytic Converter Delete
ztsmith86 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2012, 08:40 PM   #2
mikeSS


 
mikeSS's Avatar
 
Drives: 2015 c7
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: MI
Posts: 7,461
good info
mikeSS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2012, 09:29 PM   #3
brantley847
v It bites.
 
brantley847's Avatar
 
Drives: 2011 IBM 2SS/RS
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 3,405
ok.. then what is recommended for an LS3 conversion from the L99?
__________________
2011 2SS/RS
Performance: 439 RWHP A6: 226/236 Comp Cam, Kooks 1-7/8, CAInc, Borla S type, FTI Converter, Vmax TB, Rx Catch Can, Trans cooler, SLP 160 termo, Melling high volume, Eibach Springs/Sways 1" drop, Whiteline complete bushing kit.
Appearance:Smoked side markers and black bowties. Blk / Blue Carbon Fiber interior trim.

Next in order: F14s, 3.70 gears, DSS Axles, End links/Toe rods/trailing arms, Ported heads, S/C.







1100 7/02 Ordered
3800 8/09 Order produced
4200 8/13 Shipped
6000 8/24 HOME!
brantley847 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2012, 09:31 PM   #4
Cheesehead1
 
Cheesehead1's Avatar
 
Drives: 2011 2SS/RS RJT
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Racine, WI
Posts: 158
10295
__________________
CAI Inductions Cai, GHL Catback, MGW shifter, Phadt Trailing arms, 20% tint, Skip shift elim, Heritage grill, Black tail light bezels. best time 12.85 @ 110 2.04 60'
Cheesehead1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2012, 09:35 PM   #5
bmbbl be

 
bmbbl be's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 CAMARO SS
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: tallmadge, ohio
Posts: 1,308
i have the ls3 conversion and my oil pressure is the same as it was stocl L99
bmbbl be is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2012, 09:36 PM   #6
RED DEMON SS
OFF THE CHAIN
 
RED DEMON SS's Avatar
 
Drives: PSHHH UWISH
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: This Side Of Hell
Posts: 8,442
Quote:
Originally Posted by bmbbl be View Post
i have the ls3 conversion and my oil pressure is the same as it was stocl L99
+1
__________________
RED DEMON SS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2012, 09:39 PM   #7
jeffny09


 
jeffny09's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 camaro
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: new york
Posts: 5,625
Send a message via AIM to jeffny09 Send a message via Yahoo to jeffny09
Again, thank you for your time in getting this info
__________________
top 10 reason why real men drive stick.

10. A manual transmission is the ultimate in control
9. You can use automotive jargon and not sound like a total tool
8. You can't spell "manual" without "man"
7. Manual transmissions prove you can do more than one thing at a time
6. You can't drift in an auto
5. You can't pull fancy moves in an automatic
4. You get better fuel economy with a stick
3. You’ll never look like a chump if you can drive stick
2. Manual transmission cars are faster
1. Women like a guy who is good with his hands.

jeffny09 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2012, 09:40 PM   #8
ztsmith86
 
ztsmith86's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Camaro 2SS/RS
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Ames, IA
Posts: 331
Quote:
Originally Posted by bmbbl be View Post
i have the ls3 conversion and my oil pressure is the same as it was stocl L99
According to Melling that would be "VERY BAD"
__________________

2010 Camaro 2SS/RS LS3 Inferno Metallic
----------------------
TSP 1 7/8" Long Tube Headers 304 SS MagnaFlow 2.5 Street Series Catback Exhaust K&N Cold Air Intake Comp Cams Camshaft227/235 .639"/.646"114LSA+2.5 REV 2.165 Hollow Stem Stainless Steel Valves Manley1.59 Stainless Steel Exhaust Valves GM LS7 Hydraulic Lifter Kit Katech CR-5 Timing Chain Manley Hardened Pushrods Comp Cams LSX Rocker Arm Trunion Kit A.I.R. Ported Cylinder Heads Catalytic Converter Delete
ztsmith86 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2012, 09:41 PM   #9
ztsmith86
 
ztsmith86's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Camaro 2SS/RS
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Ames, IA
Posts: 331
Quote:
Originally Posted by brantley847 View Post
ok.. then what is recommended for an LS3 conversion from the L99?
I would recommend the TSP ported & shimmed M295, Melling would say you would be fine with a 10295 or 10296, but there are trade offs for those 2 pumps .... i.e. cost and noted items in my first post
__________________

2010 Camaro 2SS/RS LS3 Inferno Metallic
----------------------
TSP 1 7/8" Long Tube Headers 304 SS MagnaFlow 2.5 Street Series Catback Exhaust K&N Cold Air Intake Comp Cams Camshaft227/235 .639"/.646"114LSA+2.5 REV 2.165 Hollow Stem Stainless Steel Valves Manley1.59 Stainless Steel Exhaust Valves GM LS7 Hydraulic Lifter Kit Katech CR-5 Timing Chain Manley Hardened Pushrods Comp Cams LSX Rocker Arm Trunion Kit A.I.R. Ported Cylinder Heads Catalytic Converter Delete
ztsmith86 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2012, 09:47 PM   #10
ztsmith86
 
ztsmith86's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Camaro 2SS/RS
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Ames, IA
Posts: 331
If it adds any "good" to my original post I hold 2 engineering degrees from MIT and design water/wastewater systems all over the country. I have very practical and design knowledge of almost ever valve you could ever imagine ..... i.e. pressure relief valves. I'm not a engine expert by any means ... I really only state this info about me to give credit to my ability to assemble details
__________________

2010 Camaro 2SS/RS LS3 Inferno Metallic
----------------------
TSP 1 7/8" Long Tube Headers 304 SS MagnaFlow 2.5 Street Series Catback Exhaust K&N Cold Air Intake Comp Cams Camshaft227/235 .639"/.646"114LSA+2.5 REV 2.165 Hollow Stem Stainless Steel Valves Manley1.59 Stainless Steel Exhaust Valves GM LS7 Hydraulic Lifter Kit Katech CR-5 Timing Chain Manley Hardened Pushrods Comp Cams LSX Rocker Arm Trunion Kit A.I.R. Ported Cylinder Heads Catalytic Converter Delete
ztsmith86 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2012, 09:49 PM   #11
brantley847
v It bites.
 
brantley847's Avatar
 
Drives: 2011 IBM 2SS/RS
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 3,405
Quote:
Originally Posted by ztsmith86 View Post
I would recommend the TSP ported & shimmed M295, Melling would say you would be fine with a 10295 or 10296, but there are trade offs for those 2 pumps .... i.e. cost and noted items in my first post
I believe I ordered the 10296 with my cam swap... hmmm
__________________
2011 2SS/RS
Performance: 439 RWHP A6: 226/236 Comp Cam, Kooks 1-7/8, CAInc, Borla S type, FTI Converter, Vmax TB, Rx Catch Can, Trans cooler, SLP 160 termo, Melling high volume, Eibach Springs/Sways 1" drop, Whiteline complete bushing kit.
Appearance:Smoked side markers and black bowties. Blk / Blue Carbon Fiber interior trim.

Next in order: F14s, 3.70 gears, DSS Axles, End links/Toe rods/trailing arms, Ported heads, S/C.







1100 7/02 Ordered
3800 8/09 Order produced
4200 8/13 Shipped
6000 8/24 HOME!
brantley847 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2012, 09:53 PM   #12
ztsmith86
 
ztsmith86's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Camaro 2SS/RS
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Ames, IA
Posts: 331
I won't hurt anything to install it just understand what it changes for you and that it is not a necessary install for any reason. You won't be able to use a double roller timing chain with that oil pump without performing modifications.
__________________

2010 Camaro 2SS/RS LS3 Inferno Metallic
----------------------
TSP 1 7/8" Long Tube Headers 304 SS MagnaFlow 2.5 Street Series Catback Exhaust K&N Cold Air Intake Comp Cams Camshaft227/235 .639"/.646"114LSA+2.5 REV 2.165 Hollow Stem Stainless Steel Valves Manley1.59 Stainless Steel Exhaust Valves GM LS7 Hydraulic Lifter Kit Katech CR-5 Timing Chain Manley Hardened Pushrods Comp Cams LSX Rocker Arm Trunion Kit A.I.R. Ported Cylinder Heads Catalytic Converter Delete
ztsmith86 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2012, 10:03 PM   #13
ztsmith86
 
ztsmith86's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Camaro 2SS/RS
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Ames, IA
Posts: 331
On a different note it would be really nice if someone would do a very detailed writeup about performance lifters for our engines. I'm considering doing it, but it takes so much time calling people and sifting through the details. Also there are a LOT of aftermarket lifters.
__________________

2010 Camaro 2SS/RS LS3 Inferno Metallic
----------------------
TSP 1 7/8" Long Tube Headers 304 SS MagnaFlow 2.5 Street Series Catback Exhaust K&N Cold Air Intake Comp Cams Camshaft227/235 .639"/.646"114LSA+2.5 REV 2.165 Hollow Stem Stainless Steel Valves Manley1.59 Stainless Steel Exhaust Valves GM LS7 Hydraulic Lifter Kit Katech CR-5 Timing Chain Manley Hardened Pushrods Comp Cams LSX Rocker Arm Trunion Kit A.I.R. Ported Cylinder Heads Catalytic Converter Delete
ztsmith86 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2012, 10:07 PM   #14
ztsmith86
 
ztsmith86's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Camaro 2SS/RS
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Ames, IA
Posts: 331
Another thought to people looking to achieve better flows out of your oil pumps. You could just use a lighter weight oil, there would be some trade offs, but a lighter weight oil would give you better flow characteristics through any oil pump
__________________

2010 Camaro 2SS/RS LS3 Inferno Metallic
----------------------
TSP 1 7/8" Long Tube Headers 304 SS MagnaFlow 2.5 Street Series Catback Exhaust K&N Cold Air Intake Comp Cams Camshaft227/235 .639"/.646"114LSA+2.5 REV 2.165 Hollow Stem Stainless Steel Valves Manley1.59 Stainless Steel Exhaust Valves GM LS7 Hydraulic Lifter Kit Katech CR-5 Timing Chain Manley Hardened Pushrods Comp Cams LSX Rocker Arm Trunion Kit A.I.R. Ported Cylinder Heads Catalytic Converter Delete
ztsmith86 is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Can we use the catchcan made for the G8? HaZe_X Camaro V8 LS3 / L99 Engine, Exhaust, and Bolt-Ons 16 05-05-2010 10:35 AM
Great Read and Info on Oil Weight Banshee Mechanical Maintenance: Break-in / Oil & Fluids / Servicing 1 11-23-2009 09:03 PM
synthetic motor oil? bigd1276 Mechanical Maintenance: Break-in / Oil & Fluids / Servicing 71 01-29-2009 12:28 PM
Major U.S. oil source is tapped KILLER74Z28 Off-topic Discussions 32 10-30-2007 09:47 AM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:07 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.