Warranty Dispute . . . . advice?

[The Stig]

So about a month or so ago I started reading up on TSBs and problems that other people were noticing in their camaros. Turns out what I thought were just a bunch of little quirks of my car were actually TSBs and minor/major problems for the car. I love this car, and therefore have taken diligent notes about what gets done to her: dates, TSBs, handouts, etc. I've started to get fed up and I brought my complaints to GM customer service, well apparently my problems are pretty serious (I'm one dealership visit from Lemon Law for two separate problems). They are sending someone from Engineering to look at my car later this week. In short, I have no idea what I should do/say when the guy shows up outside of "I have a few problems." The serv. rep. said that if they couldn't fix the problems they would repurchase the car and I could get another one.

I guess I'm just asking for some advice,condolence, help, or what have you with this whole situation.Eleanor’s Work Log.doc

[ninety6]

I'd just be honest, show them that document, and politely explain the problems you've had. Good note taking, always a lifesaver in times like these...

[motorhead]

From the how detailed it looks like you are , I guess I don't have to ask if you got copies of all the service work that was performed on your car. This is needed for a lemon law suit if it comes to that.

[ninety6]

oh, you if you don't have backup sensors, you wouldn't have the "Collision/Detection Systems" option on your menu. Its for turning off the Beeping. I'm 99% sure thats the ONLY thing there (can someone else confirm?). Does your manual also say you have lights for reverse sensors? some of the older manuals apparently said that (mine doesn't), but they never put them in....

[brandotron]

Excellent notes, this is a good example for all of us.

[The Stig]

From the how detailed it looks like you are , I guess I don't have to ask if you got copies of all the service work the was performed on your car.

Actually, as detailed as I have been I don't have copies of the service work. Though I'll be heading off to the dealer shortly to be requesting them. I really don't want it to come to a Lemon Law suit. From the conversations I have had with my serv. rep. it looks like GM wants this whole thing to be over almost as quick as I do.

Thanks for the quick replies.

[clg_98ta]

This is interesting insight into the dealer/GM problem resolution process. Please keep us updated.

[The Stig]

Got a call from my serv rep a little while ago. Informed me that they have assigned me a regional rep who will be talking to the dealership and with me about getting all this fixed. I told her I have a road trip (driving home after the semester ends) on May 10th that is about 5 ish to 6 hours and that I was not comfortable driving my car that long of a period with the transmission and brakes acting up. So essentially that's their due date for a solution, which as it was explained to me will be one of two options. (A) they fix Eleanor (B) They give me a new 2010 camaro that is the same as Eleanor and/or better. It's amazing how nice the customer serv rep people get when you have 2 pages of carefully noted service dates and a dozen or so print outs of the service records. I guess being an obsessive note taker have finally come in handy.

I'll fill you guys in with more as soon as I know what is happening.

[The Stig]

Update:

Yes, I know that this thread is dead but a couple people asked for updates so here it goes.

My regional service rep (elizabeth, very nice girl first off) got me an appointment at my dealers for when the GM regional executive engineer (pretty sure that's not his real title) would be there. He and I are going for a test drive on Thursday, at which point IF I can get the problems to occur while he is in the car then Eleanor is in the shop and hopefully gets fixed. If nothing happens then I will most likely be handing her over to them anyways with full permission to drive her around (reasonably of course) to get the problems to show up.

If/when they find the problems they will attempt to fix/determine what the next course of action is. One of which I've been told is a total inspection/take apart the whole car, double check every part, put back together/or I have to go through a whole bunch of their lemon law legal channels and find some sort of agreement with them.

[nashstat]

Def keep us update on the progress. Thx.

[O2BQIK]

Not to rain on your parade or anything, but have you checked the language of the lemon law in your state/district? In Texas it specifically states the following: "The defect or condition persists and substantially impairs the vehicle's use or market value, or creates a serious safety hazard." While I would be unhappy at having all the problems you've had, I'm not sure that any of them substantially affect its market value or create a serious safety hazard. I haven't checked DC's law, but anyway just something to be aware of.

In any case it sounds like you have GM's ear now so hopefully you will get these issues handled! Good luck!

[The Stig]

Not to rain on your parade or anything, but have you checked the language of the lemon law in your state/district?

Yes I checked, I took my notes out of habit/love for the car and when I started seeing a pattern I looked up all the information (lemon law, TSB, problems other people have seen, etc). The car was bought in Northern Va, but Va none the less, so Va lemon laws apply. Which are:



1. The same nonconformity has been subject to repair three or more times by the manufacturer, its agents or its authorized dealers and the same nonconformity continues to exist;

2. The nonconformity is a serious safety defect and has been subject to repair one or more times by the manufacturer, its agent or its authorized dealer and the same nonconformity continues to exist; or

3. The motor vehicle is out of service due to repair for a cumulative total of thirty calendar days, unless such repairs could not be performed because of conditions beyond the control of the manufacturer, its agents or authorized dealers, including war, invasion, strike, fire, flood or other natural disasters.

I am dropping the car off on Thursday, day 17, and they requested to keep it over the weekend and then some. This will also be the third time she has been in the shop for both the squeaking breaks and the transmission. Personally I find that when a high squeaking sound comes from the brakes to be pretty annoying. My question to you I guess is, would you buy a new car if the brakes squealed during the test drive? If no, then that is considered to have decreased the cars market value. Same logic for the transmission.

Final point in lemon law for Va (and most states) is that the company, GM/Chevrolet, has 15 days upon your notice to them of the problems to make a final repair. If a repair cannot be made and the problems are within reason to be considered to decrease the car in market value then a lemon suit can be filed.

Also, sorry about the length. I didn't mean to rant, but after Chevrolet blew me off for 2 weeks I was pretty motivated to know my rights and what actions I could follow to get my car fixed.

[The Stig]

Had the ride along today. The mechanic wasn't hearing anything pretty much. His determination was that the car was fine and all of my problems are natural for the car.

The brake pad squeaking was nothing to do with the pads or brakes, those are fine. It is apparently coming from water/,moisture being boiled off of the pads throughout the day. I kind of took that information as shenanigans, but I have no real knowledge of brakes/rotors/pads/etc so if someone wants to let me know if his claim is legit thank you in advance.

The lurching forward while going from start to drive is "tightening of the line." To me that just sounds like Pig Latin, so a translation of what he was trying to get at would be nice. The car only lurched a little bit, which is why I think he said it was normal. Now the big lurches that I feel every once in a while are a problem, but he didn't see it so it doesn't exist. Had he seen the big lurches then he said the best plan would be to take the engine and tranny apart, look at them/fix them, and rebuild.

All in all, I'm kind of just giving up on the dealer here and having another one look into this when I get home. All of the mechanics keep telling me "its not a big problem, bring it back when it is." Why would I want to do that? I don't see why fixing a problem before it becomes a serious problem is so foreign to Chevrolet. Again, insight about how/why they won't look into my "small problems" would be great.

[Deerta]

Maybe your just to anal about your car. Its meant to be driven not looked under a microscope.