Service stability on - Page 2 - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

Powered1le · 01-05-2020, 10:13 AM

So I just pulled the lifters out and they look fine also the rollers spin freely.

Powered1le · 01-05-2020, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Powered1le

So I just pulled the lifters out and they look fine also the rollers spin freely.

Found the problem

HDRDTD · 01-05-2020, 06:25 PM

OK, what am I looking at here ??

InFiD3ViL · 01-05-2020, 06:34 PM

Did you lose the top of that piston or is that an illusion? Just above the top ring, and we are looking at the actual ring with the dot on it? If so, have you felt that cylinder wall for damage?

That sucks, but if the liner is ok you may get off relatively easy here.

Powered1le · 01-11-2020, 06:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by InFiD3ViL

Did you lose the top of that piston or is that an illusion? Just above the top ring, and we are looking at the actual ring with the dot on it? If so, have you felt that cylinder wall for damage?

That sucks, but if the liner is ok you may get off relatively easy here.

.

Yes the top of the piston is gone. I couldn't fell any damage on the cylinder wall.

Powered1le · 01-11-2020, 06:20 AM

Just trying to see what would be the best option at this point. Full tear Down and upgrade bottom or replace block.

JD555 · 01-11-2020, 07:56 AM

Do you know what happened to the missing piece? That is strange to happen just cruising down the road.

CamaroBarb · 01-11-2020, 09:56 AM

Common problem with LS motors lifted a ring land. What actually happened was the ring was not sized right in the bore. The ring expands as it gets hot and has to go some place, eventually after expanding over and over in the ring groove without enough space to grow it POPS part of the ring land off. If it were mine I would replace the piston and ALL the rings with at least .005 more gap than called for. I know some people that run .015 more.This problem usually happens to one of the rear cylinders because they run a bit hotter. I had the exact same thing happen in one of mine. Number 7 cylinder. Unfortunately the pistons are like glass on these engines and break easily.

When you pull it apart you can measure the gap on the old ring and see how tight it is. How many miles and I guess you are out of warranty? The piece is probably out in the exhaust if it didn't get mashed to nothing in the cylinder. Mine went out into the exhaust and was making a hella rapping noise.

If you look closely at your picture you can see the end gap of the ring. It expanded and starting lifting the ring land right at the gap because it tries to over lap, eventually pushing a nice piece off the piston. My experience with this is if you run the stock bottom end hard enough it will happen to most of them. I seen BRAND NEW engines take a few 1/4 runs and pop a ring land. gotta open the ring gaps if you want to seriously flog these engines.

InFiD3ViL · 01-11-2020, 01:51 PM

Damn, that is crazy how symmetrical the break is. That is why i had a hard time seeing it.

I would have the engine disassembled and inspected. Then rebuild it forged if it is in the budget. If not, go with stock pistons and re-ring with wider gap as camarobarb says. Either way have all bearings and wear points replaced.

CamaroBarb · 01-11-2020, 08:54 PM

This happens ALOT in engines that are "tuned" or boosted. Reason being stock tunes take this into consideration and keep things on the safe side. GM likes tight gaps to try and keep the oil in the engine, unfortunately most tuners OR someone adding any kind of boost never think about it. I've seen this happen so many times ask any shop that does LS cars how many ring lands break on them. Try a web search, I think you will be surprised.

I had a hot tune in mine and it ran crazy good. I knew better than to hold it WOT too long on a hot day or flog it over and over. My friends at the local dealer blew mine for me and dumped it in my lap.............try smokin that! Same time they cracked both frt rotors in 6 places, but no one was racing it................I'm getting mad thinking about it.

Powered1le · 01-16-2020, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JD555

Do you know what happened to the missing piece? That is strange to happen just cruising down the road.

Have not found it yet. might have fell out the tailpipe.

Powered1le · 01-16-2020, 06:28 PM

I'm going to forge the bottom end or replace the block with a 418 CI short block. Can't take the chance to just replace the rings and piston with more stock ones. This could have been worse.

Greenhornet2 · 01-16-2020, 06:47 PM

If there is no scoring in the walls you don't need to replace the block. Do you have large power goals? If so now is the time to forge the bottom end and put a stroker crank in it. If you're wanting 900whp or more then start looking into a stronger block. That will be my route if i break something. This is not what i would call a common problem I've only seen a handful of 6.2 engines be replaced in 10 years dealing with 70 GM dealerships. Bad tunes or pushing them to the brink is a little different.

CamaroBarb · 01-16-2020, 07:26 PM

Well it might not come up as a common problem because most dealers won't dig down this far. I personally have seen this way too many times in stock LS engines going back 20 years. Usually number 7 cylinder. Long time ago I called Texas speed looking for answers on oil usage and oil on some of the plugs 5 & 7. !st thing come out of his mouth was lifted ring lands. He was right, number 7 was gone and 5 was cracked. They told me they see it over and over while doing upgrades on these cars.

01-05-2020, 10:13 AM	#15
Powered1le Drives: 2014 2ss 1le Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Va Posts: 132 View My Garage	So I just pulled the lifters out and they look fine also the rollers spin freely. __________________ 2014 camaro 2ss/rs 1le [muffler & resonator delete, x-pipe , roto fab cai, 305 35 r20 rear tire 285 35 r20 front goodyear f1 supercar,1 7/8" tsp long tube headers with high flow cats, tsp Prc heads, K1 rods, Wisco pistons, 522whp 495tq, dynojet, btr stage3 cam kit, arp head studs and arp bolts.

01-05-2020, 06:34 PM	#18
InFiD3ViL Drives: 2010 CGM 2SS/RS LS3 Swapped A6 Join Date: Sep 2016 Location: Spring Hill, FL Posts: 4,620	Did you lose the top of that piston or is that an illusion? Just above the top ring, and we are looking at the actual ring with the dot on it? If so, have you felt that cylinder wall for damage? That sucks, but if the liner is ok you may get off relatively easy here. __________________ 2010 CGM Camaro 2SS LS3 Swapped A6 - GPI LS3 SS1 .647/.638, (224/237, 112 +4, 7º overlap) on CamMotion 8620 core, BTR Platinum .660" Dual Spring kit w/titanium retainers, CHE bronze trunnion upgrade, stock heads milled @ .015, Melling HV 10296 oil pump, TSP 1-7/8" long tube headers (W/Catless Off-road Pipes), Corsa Xtreme 3" Catback, GPI Ported/Rod Mod Intake, Stage 2 Ported Throttle Body, Vararam OTR CAI, Mike Norris Gen 2 catch can + GM 1LE clean side separator, 160º thermostat - Megan Racing adjustable coilovers (lowered 1.75"), MRR M017 10/11" wheels-Tuned by Ryan @ GPI

01-11-2020, 06:20 AM	#20
Powered1le Drives: 2014 2ss 1le Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Va Posts: 132 View My Garage	Just trying to see what would be the best option at this point. Full tear Down and upgrade bottom or replace block. __________________ 2014 camaro 2ss/rs 1le [muffler & resonator delete, x-pipe , roto fab cai, 305 35 r20 rear tire 285 35 r20 front goodyear f1 supercar,1 7/8" tsp long tube headers with high flow cats, tsp Prc heads, K1 rods, Wisco pistons, 522whp 495tq, dynojet, btr stage3 cam kit, arp head studs and arp bolts.

01-11-2020, 09:56 AM	#22
CamaroBarb Banned Drives: cheby Camaro Join Date: Aug 2019 Location: usa Posts: 575	Common problem with LS motors lifted a ring land. What actually happened was the ring was not sized right in the bore. The ring expands as it gets hot and has to go some place, eventually after expanding over and over in the ring groove without enough space to grow it POPS part of the ring land off. If it were mine I would replace the piston and ALL the rings with at least .005 more gap than called for. I know some people that run .015 more.This problem usually happens to one of the rear cylinders because they run a bit hotter. I had the exact same thing happen in one of mine. Number 7 cylinder. Unfortunately the pistons are like glass on these engines and break easily. When you pull it apart you can measure the gap on the old ring and see how tight it is. How many miles and I guess you are out of warranty? The piece is probably out in the exhaust if it didn't get mashed to nothing in the cylinder. Mine went out into the exhaust and was making a hella rapping noise. If you look closely at your picture you can see the end gap of the ring. It expanded and starting lifting the ring land right at the gap because it tries to over lap, eventually pushing a nice piece off the piston. My experience with this is if you run the stock bottom end hard enough it will happen to most of them. I seen BRAND NEW engines take a few 1/4 runs and pop a ring land. gotta open the ring gaps if you want to seriously flog these engines. Last edited by CamaroBarb; 01-11-2020 at 11:43 AM.

01-11-2020, 01:51 PM	#23
InFiD3ViL Drives: 2010 CGM 2SS/RS LS3 Swapped A6 Join Date: Sep 2016 Location: Spring Hill, FL Posts: 4,620	Damn, that is crazy how symmetrical the break is. That is why i had a hard time seeing it. I would have the engine disassembled and inspected. Then rebuild it forged if it is in the budget. If not, go with stock pistons and re-ring with wider gap as camarobarb says. Either way have all bearings and wear points replaced. __________________ 2010 CGM Camaro 2SS LS3 Swapped A6 - GPI LS3 SS1 .647/.638, (224/237, 112 +4, 7º overlap) on CamMotion 8620 core, BTR Platinum .660" Dual Spring kit w/titanium retainers, CHE bronze trunnion upgrade, stock heads milled @ .015, Melling HV 10296 oil pump, TSP 1-7/8" long tube headers (W/Catless Off-road Pipes), Corsa Xtreme 3" Catback, GPI Ported/Rod Mod Intake, Stage 2 Ported Throttle Body, Vararam OTR CAI, Mike Norris Gen 2 catch can + GM 1LE clean side separator, 160º thermostat - Megan Racing adjustable coilovers (lowered 1.75"), MRR M017 10/11" wheels-Tuned by Ryan @ GPI

01-05-2020, 06:25 PM	#17
HDRDTD Drives: 2013 Triple Black ZL1 Vert M6 ECF Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Trenton, Michigan Posts: 7,047	OK, what am I looking at here ??

01-11-2020, 07:56 AM	#21
JD555 Drives: 2014 2SS RS, 6 sp man Join Date: Feb 2016 Location: Marlton, NJ Posts: 461	Do you know what happened to the missing piece? That is strange to happen just cruising down the road.

01-11-2020, 08:54 PM	#24
CamaroBarb Banned Drives: cheby Camaro Join Date: Aug 2019 Location: usa Posts: 575	This happens ALOT in engines that are "tuned" or boosted. Reason being stock tunes take this into consideration and keep things on the safe side. GM likes tight gaps to try and keep the oil in the engine, unfortunately most tuners OR someone adding any kind of boost never think about it. I've seen this happen so many times ask any shop that does LS cars how many ring lands break on them. Try a web search, I think you will be surprised. I had a hot tune in mine and it ran crazy good. I knew better than to hold it WOT too long on a hot day or flog it over and over. My friends at the local dealer blew mine for me and dumped it in my lap.............try smokin that! Same time they cracked both frt rotors in 6 places, but no one was racing it................I'm getting mad thinking about it.

01-16-2020, 06:28 PM	#26
Powered1le Drives: 2014 2ss 1le Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Va Posts: 132 View My Garage	I'm going to forge the bottom end or replace the block with a 418 CI short block. Can't take the chance to just replace the rings and piston with more stock ones. This could have been worse. __________________ 2014 camaro 2ss/rs 1le [muffler & resonator delete, x-pipe , roto fab cai, 305 35 r20 rear tire 285 35 r20 front goodyear f1 supercar,1 7/8" tsp long tube headers with high flow cats, tsp Prc heads, K1 rods, Wisco pistons, 522whp 495tq, dynojet, btr stage3 cam kit, arp head studs and arp bolts.

01-16-2020, 06:47 PM	#27
Greenhornet2 Drives: 2011 Camaro 2SS LS3 Whipple Join Date: May 2019 Location: Connecticut Posts: 1,925	If there is no scoring in the walls you don't need to replace the block. Do you have large power goals? If so now is the time to forge the bottom end and put a stroker crank in it. If you're wanting 900whp or more then start looking into a stronger block. That will be my route if i break something. This is not what i would call a common problem I've only seen a handful of 6.2 engines be replaced in 10 years dealing with 70 GM dealerships. Bad tunes or pushing them to the brink is a little different. __________________ Whipple 2.9 CAI ID1050x injectors ZL1 Pump JRE FPCM JMS Voltage booster JRE Rough Idle blower cam BTR .660 springs CHE trunnion kit 1 7/8 Speed Engineering Borla Atak JRE scoop 1.5" lowering springs BMR trailing arms and toe links Cradle inserts 704WHP 603WTQ 93 octane

01-16-2020, 07:26 PM	#28
CamaroBarb Banned Drives: cheby Camaro Join Date: Aug 2019 Location: usa Posts: 575	Well it might not come up as a common problem because most dealers won't dig down this far. I personally have seen this way too many times in stock LS engines going back 20 years. Usually number 7 cylinder. Long time ago I called Texas speed looking for answers on oil usage and oil on some of the plugs 5 & 7. !st thing come out of his mouth was lifted ring lands. He was right, number 7 was gone and 5 was cracked. They told me they see it over and over while doing upgrades on these cars.