'15 L99 AFM/DOD delete advice for cam

[Cameron The Camaro]

To provide some details, I have a '15 Camaro 2SS with a list of mods (in my sig) and dyno tuned. Sadly, one of my AFM lifters collapsed and did a number to my cam. That being said, I've decided to completely eliminate DOD (R&R cylinder heads, change lifters, remove DOD solenoids, plus oil holes, remove DOD program, etc.). Obviously aside from all of that, I am leaning towards going with a new cam instead of just simply replacing my stock cam with a new stock cam. That is where I'm at right now, and I'm looking for advice from you guys. I'm not planning on adding a supercharger or anything in the near future at all as this is still a daily driver for me. Additionally, I know that i'll likely need to upgrade my torque converter as well if I go with a new cam (because if not i'd imagine my options would be limited).

Thanks!

[2015FLCamaroSS]

I am in the middle of a similar story and will be installing this cam with no need for a new stall converter.
https://cammotion.com/camshafts/ls3-...220-230-117-4/

[mcbuff52]

Check with GPI, or TSP to find a VVT cam thet doesn't require a converter change. There are plenty of optional cams for a daily, that will increase performance.

[2015FLCamaroSS]

I would highly recommend removing all VVT components and going with the non VVT cam I recommended. It was very difficult, actually not possible to find a tuner that has the knowledge to properly tune with VVT.

[Rob Russell]

I upgraded to GPI's VVT SS1 cam. You don't have to change the stall for this cam but I did. It has great driveability, doesn't kill your valvetrain, and still made 440rwhp. I did put a 3600 triple disc converter in and the car feels like it makes an extra 30hp with it.

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[Cameron The Camaro]

Originally Posted by 2015FLCamaroSS

I would highly recommend removing all VVT components and going with the non VVT cam I recommended. It was very difficult, actually not possible to find a tuner that has the knowledge to properly tune with VVT.

Ideally, I was looking to keep VVT because it seems the pros outweigh the cons if you can find a proper tuner. Thanks to another member on here who happens to be local to me, I seemed to have found one of the best tuners in my area for the LS platform. However, thank you for your suggestion - if I end up changing my stance on that then I'll definitely go the route you suggested.

[Cameron The Camaro]

Originally Posted by Rob Russell

I upgraded to GPI's VVT SS1 cam. You don't have to change the stall for this cam but I did. It has great driveability, doesn't kill your valvetrain, and still made 440rwhp. I did put a 3600 triple disc converter in and the car feels like it makes an extra 30hp with it.

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This was the exact cam I was looking at surprisingly. Seems to have pretty good benefits, but I would likely do what you did with changing the stall. Did you get yours from GPI as well?

[InFiD3ViL]

Originally Posted by Rob Russell

I upgraded to GPI's VVT SS1 cam. You don't have to change the stall for this cam but I did. It has great driveability, doesn't kill your valvetrain, and still made 440rwhp. I did put a 3600 triple disc converter in and the car feels like it makes an extra 30hp with it.

I bet it feels awesome. I can't wait to get a convertor in mine.

Originally Posted by Cameron The Camaro

Ideally, I was looking to keep VVT because it seems the pros outweigh the cons if you can find a proper tuner. Thanks to another member on here who happens to be local to me, I seemed to have found one of the best tuners in my area for the LS platform. However, thank you for your suggestion - if I end up changing my stance on that then I'll definitely go the route you suggested.

That's usually the main reason people go with the LS3 conversion. You rarely hear of VVT phaser failures, although they do happen of course. There are just too few good VVT tuners available locally, no matter your location. Too many stubborn tuners refuse to learn something 'new', even though the tech has been in GM engines for over a decade now and even longer in other brands. They are only handicapping themselves as VVT is going to be in nearly all high performance engine options going forward. This is likely one of the reasons that Ryan at GPI is so popular, as he is considered one of the authoritative names in VVT cam tuning.

But some people refuse to settle for a remote tune and I can understand that. You want that instant gratification of getting a dyno number afterwards, but that limits your choices when few of the local dyno tuners can deal with VVT. I didn't have to consider VVT as I swapped in an LS3 when I blew my L99. But when I rebuild my L99 I am fairly certain that I will be keeping VVT in it.

It's just a shame that so many people are deleting VVT because they can't find a viable tuning solution locally. You have tuners telling people that it is less reliable instead of telling them 'I don't know how to tune VVT'.

[Rob Russell]

No I actually got the stall from a guy who had it on his truck locally (Houston). There's a lot of built trucks down here and he didn't want it anymore so I got it from him half the price with no damage. He got it directly from Circle D. I was going to do the LS3 conversion but the more I read the VVT has a greater advantage over the LS3 torque curve so that's why I kept it that way

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[1JEWLDSSRS]

Originally Posted by InFiD3ViL

I bet it feels awesome. I can't wait to get a convertor in mine.



That's usually the main reason people go with the LS3 conversion. You rarely hear of VVT phaser failures, although they do happen of course. There are just too few good VVT tuners available locally, no matter your location. Too many stubborn tuners refuse to learn something 'new', even though the tech has been in GM engines for over a decade now and even longer in other brands. They are only handicapping themselves as VVT is going to be in nearly all high performance engine options going forward. This is likely one of the reasons that Ryan at GPI is so popular, as he is considered one of the authoritative names in VVT cam tuning.

But some people refuse to settle for a remote tune and I can understand that. You want that instant gratification of getting a dyno number afterwards, but that limits your choices when few of the local dyno tuners can deal with VVT. I didn't have to consider VVT as I swapped in an LS3 when I blew my L99. But when I rebuild my L99 I am fairly certain that I will be keeping VVT in it.

It's just a shame that so many people are deleting VVT because they can't find a viable tuning solution locally. You have tuners telling people that it is less reliable instead of telling them 'I don't know how to tune VVT'.

^^^^^ This is exactly why my tuner suggested a non-VVT cam in my build and did the LS3 conversion and AFM/DOD delete. Sid they were not reliable and hard to tune and he wasn't quite comfortable doing a tune on a VVT Cam. At least he was honest about it. But knowing what I know now, would of kept it for the nice TQ curve they are able to produce.

[InFiD3ViL]

Originally Posted by 1JEWLDSSRS

^^^^^ This is exactly why my tuner suggested a non-VVT cam in my build and did the LS3 conversion and AFM/DOD delete. Sid they were not reliable and hard to tune and he wasn't quite comfortable doing a tune on a VVT Cam. At least he was honest about it. But knowing what I know now, would of kept it for the nice TQ curve they are able to produce.

As you said, at least he was honest about it. I have read a few posts of people who had their VVT cams tuned horribly. I would rather the tuner turn down my request than have them fake it till they make it, making poor power and driveability, or worse, engine failure.

There's a good video that touches somewhat on this topic on Cleetus McFarland's channel. He just started an interview type show called 'The Wheelman'. He interviewed tuner Jeremy Formatto last week and was discussing times where he made tuning mistakes on customers cars that were bad enough to destroy the engine. He also discussed at what point he is responsible and how he takes care of it.

I don't envy these tuners as they really need to be on top of their game knowledge wise. The stress of dealing with such high dollar components, people's sometimes ridiculous demands and expectations, crazy time crunches, and just the fact that these cars are so important to people - that when something goes wrong, people can go ballistic. It's not a career for the faint of heart. It kinda helps to show why tunes can be so expensive.

Cameron The Camaro, Sorry for taking your thread a bit off-topic.

[Cameron The Camaro]

Originally Posted by InFiD3ViL

As you said, at least he was honest about it. I have read a few posts of people who had their VVT cams tuned horribly. I would rather the tuner turn down my request than have them fake it till they make it, making poor power and driveability, or worse, engine failure.

There's a good video that touches somewhat on this topic on Cleetus McFarland's channel. He just started an interview type show called 'The Wheelman'. He interviewed tuner Jeremy Formatto last week and was discussing times where he made tuning mistakes on customers cars that were bad enough to destroy the engine. He also discussed at what point he is responsible and how he takes care of it.

I don't envy these tuners as they really need to be on top of their game knowledge wise. The stress of dealing with such high dollar components, people's sometimes ridiculous demands and expectations, crazy time crunches, and just the fact that these cars are so important to people - that when something goes wrong, people can go ballistic. It's not a career for the faint of heart. It kinda helps to show why tunes can be so expensive.

Cameron The Camaro, Sorry for taking your thread a bit off-topic.

I don't mind at all - It's actually given me a bit more insight on a topic I had been wondering about and will definitely be a discussion piece with my tuner, which would ultimately have a role in the decision I make about the cam. If he's able to do a proper VVT tune (which I believe he can as he's got some of the best reputation in my tri-state area) then I'll likely get the VVT cam mentioned earlier. In addition, I'll more than likely upgrade the stall converter just because I'll have gutted the entire engine at this point anyways - it'll definitely have a nice benefit. Sadly for me, I don't think I'll come across anyone selling one here locally - so I'll look at the options Circle D has to offer and see if it'll fit in the budget for this entire thing. If all goes well, I should likely have the entire thing put back together in the next week or two - however, if you have more advice on the topic or have had similar work done, please don't hesitate to keep the input coming.

[TheFlyingBananaSS]

Your not getting a cirle D converter any sooner than 3 to 4 weeks. I'm waiting 2 weeks currently on mine. They custom build each to spec. Weight of car, type of cam, power level, etc it's all factored in.
A converter will set you back $900 to $1300 depending on single or triple disc. I got a billet triple coming. 245mm I think lol.


Pm me who you went with as a tuner, mine will be dynoed but the tuner said he does plenty of vvt.so not worried. Most good tuners of vvt in our area are out of state. A couple in jersey, a couple in philly, and one I know of in Connecticut.

I'm putting in GPI SS2 VVT cam.

[1JEWLDSSRS]

Another note of info for you, when you do decide to get a TQ converter depending on what HP range you will be making at the tires you won't need a triple disc, as said they are quite expensive and as I have talked with Chris at Circle D, over kill for most street cars. At the moment I have a Precision 3200 stall with the TSP Stage 3 cam and am at 475rwhp and 486rwtq and it has been fine for 2 years except that my cam wants more stall, so I have a Circle D 5C 4000-4200 sitting here waiting to be installed. And yes as mentioned it took me about 4 weeks to get mine as they do build them to your car and cam specs.When you order they will ask for all that info. I ordered mine thru Chris at Circle D over the phone, great guy to talk with. Good luck with your build sir.