Do you want the Z28?

[Matster]

I'm sure this has been pointed out before but if so I'll throw it in again as my 2 cents worth.

Here is the problem as I see it and this is based on a Canadian perspective and pricing.

A Cobra GT 500 pretty much load up runs anywhere from 65K - 75K CAD. Logic would say that for the same hp in the Camaro (Z28) the price range is most likely going to be close. So then the question the consumer has gotta be ask his/herself is do I buy a Z28 or an entry level Vette? From GM's side of things I'm sure that a Camaro and a Vette in the same price range is gonna cause some infighting.

So let say for arguement sake the Z28 gets the green light, how many of you are willing to pay 60K USD?
Yes there are those of US that would jump on it with both feet, but we are the minority. Don't misunderstand me, I want a Z28 with 550hp and am willing(within reason) to pay the price but right now GM has to be looking at the bottom line and what they can and can't sell in mass numbers. If they had labelled the SS the Z28 instead, would we even be having this conversation?

As for the whole logic behind the SS, "in keeping with other GM vehicle lines" well that is just crap. I can hardly wait for the Corvette SS, NOT! So why would anyone who understands the Camaro culture think that this would be OK? Tell me that it is in keeping with the original 1st gen and I can buy that, tradition, heritage, that's cool. Anything else and you are just out of touch with your customer and truly don't understand that the Camaro isn't just another car, it is a legacy with deep rooted heritage.

As for me, I am going with the SS and will void my warrantee in order to get the 550hp....unless GM offers a package from the factory, nudge, nudge.

[boxmonkeyracing]

Originally Posted by Matster

I'm sure this has been pointed out before but if so I'll throw it in again as my 2 cents worth.

Here is the problem as I see it and this is based on a Canadian perspective and pricing.

A Cobra GT 500 pretty much load up runs anywhere from 65K - 75K CAD. Logic would say that for the same hp in the Camaro (Z28) the price range is most likely going to be close. So then the question the consumer has gotta be ask his/herself is do I buy a Z28 or an entry level Vette? From GM's side of things I'm sure that a Camaro and a Vette in the same price range is gonna cause some infighting.

So let say for arguement sake the Z28 gets the green light, how many of you are willing to pay 60K USD?
Yes there are those of US that would jump on it with both feet, but we are the minority. Don't misunderstand me, I want a Z28 with 550hp and am willing(within reason) to pay the price but right now GM has to be looking at the bottom line and what they can and can't sell in mass numbers. If they had labelled the SS the Z28 instead, would we even be having this conversation?

The vette here in the states along with the GT500 is around 42k. The ones that want a 550 hp camaro are willing to pay. I am 2. but the fact of the matter is no one knows what the Z28 will be and therefore don't know if it will be priced that high. but yes it probably would take away from sells of the vette but at the same time if you want a camaro you're going to buy it, not a vette.

As for the whole logic behind the SS, "in keeping with other GM vehicle lines" well that is just crap. I can hardly wait for the Corvette SS, NOT! So why would anyone who understands the Camaro culture think that this would be OK? Tell me that it is in keeping with the original 1st gen and I can buy that, tradition, heritage, that's cool. Anything else and you are just out of touch with your customer and truly don't understand that the Camaro isn't just another car, it is a legacy with deep rooted heritage.

They are marketing this car to more then people that "understand the camaro culture." And honestly they might be worried about confusing everyone. lol.

As for me, I am going with the SS and will void my warrantee in order to get the 550hp....unless GM offers a package from the factory, nudge, nudge.

replies in bold.

[Matster]

Originally Posted by boxmonkeyracing

replies in bold.

Don't get me started on the price differences between here and the US, at least 15K difference on the Vette http://www.corvettecanada.ca/new/inventory08.htm and the GT 500 http://www.buysell.com/root/detail/N..._4_SHELBY.aspx

[boxmonkeyracing]

Originally Posted by Matster

Don't get me started on the price differences between here and the US, at least 15K difference on the Vette http://www.corvettecanada.ca/new/inventory08.htm and the GT 500 http://www.buysell.com/root/detail/N..._4_SHELBY.aspx

I know but you stated 60k US I was just letting you know it's not that high for us.

[pinkcamaro10]

Holy Crap, Captain Awesome, I agree with you on something

[Hylton]

Originally Posted by boxmonkeyracing

I know but you stated 60k US I was just letting you know it's not that high for us.

What Mats is saying is that the car is 75K US here. We have a problem here with GM price gouging Canadians.

[Captain Awesome]

Originally Posted by pinkcamaro10

Holy Crap, Captain Awesome, I agree with you on something

I think we agree on a LOT of things. It's just one thing we went back and forth on that sticks out the most!

I know we both agree that Camaros are #1!

[Kahlis]

I don't blame him though. I too am holding out for a Z28. I personally feel if GM doesn't produce a Z28 a lot of people are going to be dissappointed. Not to mention Z28 is the only badge GM hasn't over slapped on every other model.

Z28 is the icon model of the Camaros.

From all the news we've read and heard about the LSA in the CTS-V, why not put one in a Z28? So yeah, I too will hold out for a H/O Z28 pushing 550 out of a supercharged LSA.

"If all you care about is the letters on the badge then you can always change the SS badge to something you prefer and be content." -- Last I checked, the only drivers that do that are ricers. Cause last I checked there isn't any GT-R factory civics out there.

[BitchinCamaro]

To me the Camaro is the icon.
I am just happy its back, no matter what letters are on it. We very easily could have been speculating today on if the Camaro would be back at all, not just the Z.

[radz28]

Originally Posted by Punk_rider

Well ... first, oil won't go up forever I guess. There was a big crisis these last months. What I find funny is to hear some of my colleagues (I work in an investment bank) speculating on the price still going up or down ... come on guys ... you weren't able to see the last increase in price, you weren't able to see the subprime crisis come and you still speculate?

Second, everything depends on the sales. If the camaro, challenger and so on are a big commercial success, I don't see any reason for the era to stop

Third, the "green era" won't last forever too. Actually, I think their "global warming" bullshits won't work forever. LEt's think about it, green laws don't come from the scientific nor political world: ecological politics have been a big fail since the 70'. Now we are all supposed to be green ... why? because green products are more expensive, because big companies were facing some kinda decrease in demand and created the "green thing" to make the demand go up again. Thus, when everything will be "green", companies won't have interest in it, and will find something else ... like ... PLEASURE! Thus, muscle cars

Fourth, the car industry is pretty competitive ... and the competition is about price, fuel economy, security, etc ... AND prestige! thus, fast muscle cars.

This is the reason why I still think (hope) that a Z28 550+hp will be done quite soon. Maybe not as a wide serie, but at least as a special car to show in magazines.

Fbod told us to keep the faith ... Let's say he doesn't have an interest into looking like a liar here ... or anywhere else.

All that being said, I don't know, nobody knows, maybe even fbod doesn't really knows.

It's funny, but just from the few sources I listen to, it seems like the whole "Green" thing is really non-existant in a way. I mean, first, it seemed one would hear one side saying NO DRILLING ANYWHERE ELSE and now, with gas prices what they were/are those same ones are turning around. It's a green thing when it's convenient however, when times get rough, it's like FORGET IT. I agree with a lot of your post though (not that you needed my validation...)

Originally Posted by Punk_rider

Especially if we all check our tire pressure!

WTF was up with this? Did anyone get that Youtube with the editor and chief of C&D or MT or whatever poopy rag'? I really liked what he had to say and his facts and numbers, and I don't really usually car what he says...

Originally Posted by Matster

I'm sure this has been pointed out before but if so I'll throw it in again as my 2 cents worth.

Here is the problem as I see it and this is based on a Canadian perspective and pricing.

A Cobra GT 500 pretty much load up runs anywhere from 65K - 75K CAD. Logic would say that for the same hp in the Camaro (Z28) the price range is most likely going to be close. So then the question the consumer has gotta be ask his/herself is do I buy a Z28 or an entry level Vette? From GM's side of things I'm sure that a Camaro and a Vette in the same price range is gonna cause some infighting.

So let say for arguement sake the Z28 gets the green light, how many of you are willing to pay 60K USD?
Yes there are those of US that would jump on it with both feet, but we are the minority. Don't misunderstand me, I want a Z28 with 550hp and am willing(within reason) to pay the price but right now GM has to be looking at the bottom line and what they can and can't sell in mass numbers. If they had labelled the SS the Z28 instead, would we even be having this conversation?

As for the whole logic behind the SS, "in keeping with other GM vehicle lines" well that is just crap. I can hardly wait for the Corvette SS, NOT! So why would anyone who understands the Camaro culture think that this would be OK? Tell me that it is in keeping with the original 1st gen and I can buy that, tradition, heritage, that's cool. Anything else and you are just out of touch with your customer and truly don't understand that the Camaro isn't just another car, it is a legacy with deep rooted heritage.

As for me, I am going with the SS and will void my warrantee in order to get the 550hp....unless GM offers a package from the factory, nudge, nudge.

Are you sheeting me?! Wow! That's crazy. Forgive me, but is your currency worth more than ours, or standard of living higher to make it that much more? That's just crazy...

Originally Posted by Hylton

What Mats is saying is that the car is 75K US here. We have a problem here with GM price gouging Canadians.

Can't you come down here to buy your cars without penalties?

[shadowed_Stranger]

Originally Posted by BitchinCamaro

To me the Camaro is the icon.
I am just happy its back, no matter what letters are on it. We very easily could have been speculating today on if the Camaro would be back at all, not just the Z.

exactly, I am just glad it's back.

[GTAHVIT]

Originally Posted by radz282003

That's what many of us are optimic for. I just cross my fingers we get something along those lines or I'll have to have to eat a lot of crow.

+1:(

[pinkcamaro10]

Originally Posted by Captain Awesome

I think we agree on a LOT of things. It's just one thing we went back and forth on that sticks out the most!

I know we both agree that Camaros are #1!

That's for sure!

[The_Blur]

Originally Posted by Kahlis

I don't blame him though. I too am holding out for a Z28. I personally feel if GM doesn't produce a Z28 a lot of people are going to be dissappointed. Not to mention Z28 is the only badge GM hasn't over slapped on every other model.

Z28 is the icon model of the Camaros.

From all the news we've read and heard about the LSA in the CTS-V, why not put one in a Z28? So yeah, I too will hold out for a H/O Z28 pushing 550 out of a supercharged LSA.

"If all you care about is the letters on the badge then you can always change the SS badge to something you prefer and be content." -- Last I checked, the only drivers that do that are ricers. Cause last I checked there isn't any GT-R factory civics out there.

In 1966, when Chevrolet released information about the first Camaro, there was no information about the Z28, nor was there any intention to build one. There wasn't even a Z28 RPO code to order.

How do you know it will have the LSA? That's great speculation, but there is not any evidence that the LSA will go into a Camaro of any kind at any time in the future. If it doesn't have the LSA under the hood, will it not really be a Z28? In the past, has GM been known to call LS[insert letter here] motors Z[insert 2-digit number here]? As far as I know, there is no trend to suggest an association relating the LSA and the Camaro at all. It would be a great car, but it is imagination for now.

How long are you willing to wait? GM wants you to buy a fast Camaro. Is the SS not fast enough? If GM skips this generation's Z28, will you just not get a Camaro even though it outperforms the competition, looks better than the competition, and has better, longer-lasting components? Are you going to buy something that you know is inferior just because it isn't a Z28? Why is that the best options?

I hate to bring people down over the Z28, but there's no reason to hold out for something that will cost $10k more when the car you drive today is not good enough to keep. Most of us here—especially me—want the Camaro to replace our current ride. If I were a member of the Z28 lobby, I'm not sure I'd be willing to hold out indefinitely while driving my beater and watching brand new, beautiful Camaros pulling up next to me at stop lights. It could be years before we see any performance Camaros due to the current market for oil, V8s, and GM stock conditions.

We're phenomenally lucky to have a car that has been tested by enthusiasts and guided by fbodfather to production. To wait for something better borders on disrespect for the near-perfect machine that we all wanted. While it might have fog lights a little further out, a gas cap on the side, and reverse lights that are legal, other features look so much like the concept that it just amazes me. I just can't understand why that isn't good enough. Will someone explain it to me without using the phrase "Z28 heritage?" I know that there's a huge calling for the Z28's return, and I support it, but why is a nonexistent Z28 superior to a concept gone production?