Adding auxiliary ground cables: Trunk and engine bay

[TheBrightSide]

After having my starter on my 2010 SS LS3 coupe shit the bed, I’m currently replacing it. Battery age, condition, and voltage are good and seem fine and perfectly normal. Parked the car after driving over an hour in 100+ F ambient temps; went to go start it 2 days later, when replacing my clutch master cylinder, and it wouldn’t crank over at all, not even so much as a single click (after turning the key 50+ times).

I’ve rarely encountered heat-soaked hot starts or “hard” cranking/starting, where it seems like the battery is drained and the starter is dragging along, working super slow. Even in the cold, I rarely notice it (temps barely go below 40 F every few winters), although it’s definitely been there on super cold (cold-starting) and/or hot days (re-starting after being driven).

I ended up seeing Gen5DIY sell these gauge 1/0 welding cables, to be used as grounding cables, around the Camaro SS frame/chassis. I ended figuring I could substitute those for cables with the thickness around 4-gauge, with 3/8” diameter closed, flat “ends” (Walmart calls them “battery to switch”). Excuse my lack of knowledge/terminology; I’m not an electrician, and I sure as hell avoid (more advanced/complicated) wiring like the plague.

I fashioned the first 4-ga cable the same way Gen5DIY has their auxiliary ground cable, going from the battery to the trunk. And then for the second one, I had to be crafty, so I attempted to ground it from the driver side engine valve cover, to the existing smaller ground wire, right where the frame/chassis is, underneath the airbox/intake filter area.

Does anyone know if adding these grounds (of my kind) will help much? I didn’t feel the need to do the jumper cable bypass, for the positive terminal post on the drive side of the engine bay. I’ve seen people use a variety of different gauged wiring for the grounding cables, but use like 0-ga wiring cable for stuff like the positive terminal bypass to the starter. Seems like that adds wear and tear to the starter, at the trade-off of not needing a super strong starter motor, or tons of grounds all around the car.

[gtstorey]

If the starter doesn't even "click", I think you have more of a problem than needing more cables. You have a bad battery, or bad existing wiring/connections, relay issues, or your new starter has failed.

Battery voltage isn't proof of good health. It can have good voltage with no load, but drop dramatically under heavy load. That would be my first step would be to check battery voltage while trying to start it. Big drop, bad battery. No drop, power isn't passing through the starter.

[TheBrightSide]

Originally Posted by gtstorey

If the starter doesn't even "click", I think you have more of a problem than needing more cables. You have a bad battery, or bad existing wiring/connections, relay issues, or your new starter has failed.

Battery voltage isn't proof of good health. It can have good voltage with no load, but drop dramatically under heavy load. That would be my first step would be to check battery voltage while trying to start it. Big drop, bad battery. No drop, power isn't passing through the starter.

Car only has 35k miles and is super clean. Battery is 5 y/o but had good voltage with car off, on, under load, etc. I don’t have a multimeter to check the starter, but I’m also assuming that the “solenoid” or relay, whatever, is probably okay..(not 100% sure)?

I forgot to say that I’m CURRENTLY replacing the OEM starter (motor). I’ve had most situations where the starter is bad, and you have to constantly turn the key to turn over the car, with it clicking once every time, up until it finally catches and turns the engine on. Right now, it’s not clicking once with every turn of the ignition, unfortunately… I’m just hoping that it’s the starter altogether.

I’ll be updating sometime in the next few hours. I’m hopeful…

[RupertPupkin]

OP.. do you have a built car?

[fz4k98]

In relation to the starter, 35k miles is not necessarily low. It's the number of starts and heat that will matter more. After replacing my starter it spun over like a new car again. I took apart the old one and was suprised by all the metal debris built up inside from brush wear.

[TheBrightSide]

Welp…. After like a week and a half of headaches and countless hours outside of work and free time, trying to figure out wtf was going on with my car, causing a no crank/no start condition; I finally found the culprit. It ended up being a broken transponder chip(?) off of the chipset from one of my aftermarket key fobs.

There’s basically like 2 other kinds of styles of GM replica or completely aftermarket designed key fobs, that are to imitate “GM-styled” designs, I guess. But the one that I was using, that basically looked like a wonky version of our factory key fob, basically had the plastic tab to the top buttons’ backing, basically constantly ride up against one of the chips in the chipset/chip board, up until it like broke the soldering connection or cracked the chip itself.

I couldn’t repair it, and plus, those GM chipsets are super cheap; where generic key fobs and included chip boards/chipsets for like $12-25 (depending on what key fob style) will do the trick. I have up to like 7 keys registered to my car/ECU(?) right now, so I think the max limit is 9. If I pass that, would anyone know if I have to go to the dealership and get keys manually added and/or removed? I’ve never seen the process done, but I’m sure it’s like a car make dealership specific task.

[TheBrightSide]

Originally Posted by fz4k98

In relation to the starter, 35k miles is not necessarily low. It's the number of starts and heat that will matter more. After replacing my starter it spun over like a new car again. I took apart the old one and was suprised by all the metal debris built up inside from brush wear.

Yeah, you’re absolutely right. Mine was a garage kept collectible, at least up the most recent owner got/drove it, and until like a year or two ago before I got ahold of it. Most of my car’s been well kept, but I’ve had to detail the engine bay and wash out the undercarriage of the car, from where the leaking factory oil cooler, and power steering lines and steering rack lines, were all leaking and gunking up around the car.

Anyhow, the alternator was in good shape (I assume), minus tons of gunk and being 14+ years old. I did unfortunately break off the top plastic tab to that one connector (the one that’s not the positive post connector). I have no idea what that connection is for, but it’s like a clip type connector, and I couldn’t find a way to get that thing out. Ended up using a flathead and needle nose pliers, which only did the job after the connector’s clip, broke off and allowed me to remove the clip-on connector.

[TheBrightSide]

Originally Posted by gtstorey

If the starter doesn't even "click", I think you have more of a problem than needing more cables. You have a bad battery, or bad existing wiring/connections, relay issues, or your new starter has failed.

Battery voltage isn't proof of good health. It can have good voltage with no load, but drop dramatically under heavy load. That would be my first step would be to check battery voltage while trying to start it. Big drop, bad battery. No drop, power isn't passing through the starter.

You can read like a few posts above this reply, to see what ended up being the culprit(s). However, my new starter is working just fine, although it sounds a lot different and I should’ve debated getting a Reman or some remanufactured starter unit. Some people said it needs to “break in”, but I don’t know; I’m just happy it works.

On that note, the extra 4-ga “battery to starter” type power cables I used, to add a ground in the trunk and engine bay; may have possibly done the trick, to aid/prevent hard/hot starts. That, and I did a decent job of using a DEI Mini-Versa heat resistant blanket, on my starter, as well as using like 3 metal zip ties, to really keep it there. I evened installed 2 of the 3 bolts, which hold the factory heat “shield”; what a sad excuse of a “heat shield” that thing is….

[The_bald_eagle_machine]

Typically the engine bay cable goes from the bell housing bolt to one of the threaded holes on the frame. You will have to buy a bolt, and sand around where the head of the bolt touhes the chassis.

[CamaroCracka]

Originally Posted by TheBrightSide

I had to be crafty, so I attempted to ground it from the driver side engine valve cover, to the existing smaller ground wire, right where the frame/chassis is, underneath the airbox/intake filter area.

You can't ground to the valve cover. There is a rubber seal between it and the head that will prevent proper grounding. There are bolt holes in the side and back of the head or even on the block you can ground to.

[TheBrightSide]

Originally Posted by The_bald_eagle_machine

Typically the engine bay cable goes from the bell housing bolt to one of the threaded holes on the frame. You will have to buy a bolt, and sand around where the head of the bolt touhes the chassis.

I think I might go with another option with one of the available threaded holes on the engine head or block…. I feel like removing one of the bell housing bolts, might be a recipe for trouble; whether they’re mounted in a stressed way, that doesn’t allow the bolt to be threaded back in, or whatever the case may be.

[TheBrightSide]

Originally Posted by CamaroCracka

You can't ground to the valve cover. There is a rubber seal between it and the head that will prevent proper grounding. There are bolt holes in the side and back of the head or even on the block you can ground to.

I was initially thinking the same, given that there are rubber valve cover gaskets… Which threaded hole on the engine head or block, do you think is accessible? I’ve seen a few, but have had to figure out the thread pitch sizing myself.

[CamaroCracka]

There are holes on the front and back of the heads as well as by the exhaust ports. Bolt hole is slightly larger than manifold bolt holes. Intake manifold bolts are also grounded; in fact, they are used to ground fuel rails against static spark. For a large ground I use the heads and there is even a boss right on the side of the block.

[1JEWLDSSRS]

Originally Posted by The_bald_eagle_machine

Typically the engine bay cable goes from the bell housing bolt to one of the threaded holes on the frame. You will have to buy a bolt, and sand around where the head of the bolt touhes the chassis.

The above is what I did with mine, along with an extra in the trunk. So far so good!!