How many quarts for manual trans service?

[theflea42]

I changed the fluid in my 2013 camaro today. I've seen other people talk about how the drain plug is right above that crossmember and when you drain it, you make mess. Here is what my drain plug looks like and where it is in relation to that crossmember:

[theflea42]

The OP asked for the amount of fluid. I'd say it was 4 quarts total to do the job.

I forgot to mention the fluid I used!

I'm using Redline mt-85 manual transmission fluid, 75w85 gl-4. Looking for recommended fluids got to be one huge headache.

I got out the manual, and ACDELCO 104033, gm part 88861800, is the recommended fluid. I went to rockauto to buy some, and it was out of stock. Summit racing will have some in October.

A good friend of mine gave me a gallon jug and a 1 quart bottle of that redline mt-85. I used one of those pump things and got most of the gallon jug in there. The tube on the bottom of the pump wasn't wanting to cooperate, so I used a few pumps out of that quart bottle to finish filling the transmission.

[TheBrightSide]

Originally Posted by theflea42

The OP asked for the amount of fluid. I'd say it was 4 quarts total to do the job.

I forgot to mention the fluid I used!

I'm using Redline mt-85 manual transmission fluid, 75w85 gl-4. Looking for recommended fluids got to be one huge headache.

I got out the manual, and ACDELCO 104033, gm part 88861800, is the recommended fluid. I went to rockauto to buy some, and it was out of stock. Summit racing will have some in October.

A good friend of mine gave me a gallon jug and a 1 quart bottle of that redline mt-85. I used one of those pump things and got most of the gallon jug in there. The tube on the bottom of the pump wasn't wanting to cooperate, so I used a few pumps out of that quart bottle to finish filling the transmission.

*long trans fluid/oil rant*


How is it, during cold start driving, warming up the car, etc.? Standard Synchromesh GL-4 formulas are like 75w-80, and they range from like ~9-11 cst (at 100 C degrees). I’ve never been able to run 75w-85 without at least mixing it with some kind of ATF (anywhere from ~6-8 cst) or 75W GL-4 gear oil (around ~6 - 6.5 cst).

I live in CA, and it’s been a super hot summer, ranging from like an average of high 80’s to 100+ F. Cold winters can sometimes go below 40 F, but it usually doesn’t drop below 35 F often. I definitely struggled running straight 75w-85 GL-4 Tremec HP MTL, and gave up as spring came around. It would take like 20-25 mins during winter, of moderate driving/shifting, for my MTF to even hit the mark between 30 and 180 F on my trans temp gauge.

I believe there’s some sort of trans pump inside of the cooling setup, with the trans lines, routed to the factory radiator. Correct me if I’m wrong, bc I’m still trying to do research on the folks that typically do Tremec transmission (T56, TR-6060, etc.) swaps. I don’t think the pump or lines are “strained” per say, but I don’t think I’ve ran anything more than like 75w-90 or 80w-90 (GL-4) gear oil, without diluting the whole trans fill (~4 quarts) by 40-60%.

Right now, I’m currently running a weird mix of Redline MT-90 (2 qts) and Redline D6 (1 qt) and Redline D4 (1 qt). It’s all I had, but I figured I had lots of generally good experiences mixing ATF and MTF of the same brand/manufacturer (ex: mixing Amsoil Synchromesh MTF with Amsoil MV ATF).

My car has around ~38k miles, and I just got a brand new clutch master cylinder and made sure my clutch hydraulics were bled super well. Idk if it’s the heat soak in the engine bay that makes the upper clutch fluid hose (going to my separate clutch fluid/master cylinder reservoir) swell and barely make the clutch pedal a bit softer (not necessarily losing pressure though). My synchronizers shouldn’t be damaged/worn out, although shiftingquality has kinda degraded just a tad, and it’s notchier than the first 1-2k miles of this MTF/ATF mixture.

I might go to either BG Synchroshift II (~7-7.75 cst) or Royal Purple Synchromax (~7.4-7.6 cst). These are probably the two thinner GL-4 choices, with BG being an actual 75w-80 rated gear oil. The Synchromax, I haven’t heard of a whole lot of great things, when it gets hot… There’s also DCT fluids I was skeptical of running, although I’d definitely run it over plain Dexron III/Mercon V ATF. I ran the Ford OEM DCT fluid (forget the parts number), and it was decent, but super costly….

I’ve also had good experiences running Motul’s Motyl Gear (similar to Gear Power), which is an ester formula GL-4+ (GL-4/5 compatible, safe for yellow metals and synchronizers) gear oil. People have conflicting information on whether to run GL-4+ in synchronized manual gearboxes, but I’ve never personally had any issues; although I do swap my trans fluid/gear oil typically with at least every or every other engine oil change.

[acammer]

Originally Posted by TheBrightSide

*long trans fluid/oil rant*
...
I believe there’s some sort of trans pump inside of the cooling setup, with the trans lines, routed to the factory radiator. Correct me if I’m wrong, bc I’m still trying to do research on the folks that typically do Tremec transmission (T56, TR-6060, etc.) swaps...

I can confirm the TR6060 in a 5th gen Camaro SS has a fluid pump, driven by the counter shaft. You can see it pictured here, on the backside of the front cover/bellhousing.

Straight Redline D4 ATF has always worked well in my TR6060.

[TheBrightSide]

Originally Posted by acammer

I can confirm the TR6060 in a 5th gen Camaro SS has a fluid pump, driven by the counter shaft. You can see it pictured here, on the backside of the front cover/bellhousing.

Straight Redline D4 ATF has always worked well in my TR6060.

How often do you change your trans fluid? I’ve gone anywhere from ~3-8k miles, but a few of my changes have come out with some metallic flakes, and the trans fluid/gear oil is rather metallic-looking. I’ve also ran mixes of ATF/MTF, which basically did the same thing and came out the same way when I drained the mixture.

I ended up changing it (drain and fill) twice, with my most recent change, which I assumed may have been either overworking the synchronizers, from when my clutch master cylinder went out. I didn’t grind and crunch, but I would limp the car a few times, and a little bit before the CMC went out, the shift quality did start getting a bit worse.

I’ve been trying to run GL-4 gear oil lately, as I hear people have been getting better results and less metallic-looking trans fluid changes. I’m not expecting the gear oil to come out completely clean, but as long as there’s no metallic flakes again…

Some people swear that ATF alone wears and tears more than gear oil formulas, but I only have experience mainly with accidentally running full Dexron VI/Mercon LV ATF trans fills, being the one to wear and tear the most, and also have the ATF drained out looking like a metallic mess.

I’ve made sure my clutch hydraulic doesn’t have air and has been bled properly. As mentioned, on super hot days (105-110 F or hotter), I’ve taken my cap off of my clutch fluid reservoir and pumped the clutch pedal a handful of times. This seems to take out some excess “sponginess”, although I don’t think it’s directly air itself that is making itself in; moreso with my belief/theory of the clutch fluid reservoir hose swelling a ton from the high (engine bay) temps.

[CamaroCracka]

Originally Posted by TheBrightSide

Right now, I’m currently running a weird mix of Redline MT-90 (2 qts) and Redline D6 (1 qt) and Redline D4 (1 qt). It’s all I had, but I figured I had lots of generally good experiences mixing ATF and MTF of the same brand/manufacturer (ex: mixing Amsoil Synchromesh MTF with Amsoil MV ATF).

My car has around ~38k miles, and I just got a brand new clutch master cylinder and made sure my clutch hydraulics were bled super well. Idk if it’s the heat soak in the engine bay that makes the upper clutch fluid hose (going to my separate clutch fluid/master cylinder reservoir) swell and barely make the clutch pedal a bit softer (not necessarily losing pressure though). My synchronizers shouldn’t be damaged/worn out, although shifting quality has kinda degraded just a tad, and it’s notchier than the first 1-2k miles of this MTF/ATF mixture.

I've read a lot of posts about guys trying to come up with some sort of magical ATF combo. I've run factory fluid, D4, Mobile1 and I think I even put Valvoline synthetic in it once. I've been through a few builds, so I have had the need to refill the trans a few times. I never noticed any significant difference in shifting with different fluid. When I did notice a difference was when I had the trans built with full carbon blockers and synchros (as well as a 9310 output shaft) to make sure it could handle a lot of power with sticky tires. Lots of guys have complained since the Gen5 came out about getting rejected from 2nd gear and it seems the permanent solution is synchros and blockers. There were some output shaft failures early on, so I built it because I wanted to make sure it could handle 1000hp. Lots of guys run big numbers on the TR6060 and I would never have spent the money on the build for better shifting.

Others swear by D4, Royal Purple, or Amsoil and say it solved there shifting problems. GL4 and ATF are so far apart, I don't know how anyone runs a 6060 with GL4, but if it works for them, God bless them.

I did have a flex joint on the turbo manifold blow and it was blowing hot exhaust right on the clutch fluid line. It would lose the clutch after a running for a few minutes. I run braided stainless lines on the clutch so after a good flush and exhaust repair, everything was back to normal. I've also had the clutch pedal stick down when racing in the heat. I had some extra Castrol SRF brake fluid after switching to big brakes so I used it in the clutch master and have not had that problem return. I also keep the fluid cleanish.

[acammer]

Originally Posted by TheBrightSide

How often do you change your trans fluid? I’ve gone anywhere from ~3-8k miles, but a few of my changes have come out with some metallic flakes, and the trans fluid/gear oil is rather metallic-looking. I’ve also ran mixes of ATF/MTF, which basically did the same thing and came out the same way when I drained the mixture.

I ended up changing it (drain and fill) twice, with my most recent change, which I assumed may have been either overworking the synchronizers, from when my clutch master cylinder went out. I didn’t grind and crunch, but I would limp the car a few times, and a little bit before the CMC went out, the shift quality did start getting a bit worse.

I’ve been trying to run GL-4 gear oil lately, as I hear people have been getting better results and less metallic-looking trans fluid changes. I’m not expecting the gear oil to come out completely clean, but as long as there’s no metallic flakes again…

Some people swear that ATF alone wears and tears more than gear oil formulas, but I only have experience mainly with accidentally running full Dexron VI/Mercon LV ATF trans fills, being the one to wear and tear the most, and also have the ATF drained out looking like a metallic mess.

I’ve made sure my clutch hydraulic doesn’t have air and has been bled properly. As mentioned, on super hot days (105-110 F or hotter), I’ve taken my cap off of my clutch fluid reservoir and pumped the clutch pedal a handful of times. This seems to take out some excess “sponginess”, although I don’t think it’s directly air itself that is making itself in; moreso with my belief/theory of the clutch fluid reservoir hose swelling a ton from the high (engine bay) temps.

Mine gets changed every 10k or so - whenever I run into another job I have to have it on the rack for anyways I try to run the diff and trans to make my life easy. I have always had some degree of metal in the fluid. When I popped the front of the case off - I was shocked at some of the stuff I found in the case and on the pickup tube. Scary. My trans had awful second gear engagement issues when I first got the car, I'm sure that was a contributing factor.

I did some clutch hydro stuff to help clean up the release, but going from the junk Hurst Billet Two Plus shifter back to stock made a tremendous difference. That and learning not to rush this thing through the shifts has more or less eliminated the problem - but I would really like to get it built with the updated blockers some day and see if it will shift like I really want it to.

[TheBrightSide]

Originally Posted by acammer

Mine gets changed every 10k or so - whenever I run into another job I have to have it on the rack for anyways I try to run the diff and trans to make my life easy. I have always had some degree of metal in the fluid. When I popped the front of the case off - I was shocked at some of the stuff I found in the case and on the pickup tube. Scary. My trans had awful second gear engagement issues when I first got the car, I'm sure that was a contributing factor.

I did some clutch hydro stuff to help clean up the release, but going from the junk Hurst Billet Two Plus shifter back to stock made a tremendous difference. That and learning not to rush this thing through the shifts has more or less eliminated the problem - but I would really like to get it built with the updated blockers some day and see if it will shift like I really want it to.

I have the Hurst billet short shifter, and I lost the rubber dust cover to the bottom of the shifter, which connects to the shift linkage. Thus, I got one of those rubber GM 350 shift boots, and made a few cuts, to put it through the shift linkage before installing the pin and u-clips. It holds and is big enough in place to prevent stuff from coming up into the shifter and bushing area in there. It also tremendously helped all the buzzing and vibrating, since I really didn’t wanna use all the adhesive backed sound deadening.

It didn’t take me long to get used to the short shifter. If anything, my shift quality probably degraded from either the heat soak causing my clutch pedal to get soft; and the clutch master cylinder, during the time that it begins to fail. I never pushed the car to where it would grind, but during the time that the CMC failed, I would have it crunch sometimes if I absolutely had to downshift.

I feel like I’m driving the car appropriately, double clutching and rev matching when I skip gears. I know all gears are synchronized, but sometimes, I have the habit of going into a gear before going into reverse, to make it easier. I think 2nd gear in my experience, doesn’t like really high downshifts when being single clutch downshifted, so I usually double clutch downshift if the revs are high up there (4.5-5k+).

I might go back to running a thicker ATF, or at least something 7.5-8 cst, since 75w-80 GL-4 gear oils seem to be way too thick, being around 9-10 cst. During the winter, I can only imagine that it would be like shifting through bricks during the first 30-40 minutes, if I had 75w-80 in there. I was planning to run Redline High Temp ATF, which had like about a 9 cst (@ 100 C) viscosity rating, but decided it might be better to stick under 9 cst, if I wanted a really good cold start trans fluid. I try to prevent rushing, but it occasionally happens, so I just wanna have an ATF that will heat up a bit quicker and still hold up well.

I did have an interest in the MGW short shifter assembly, so I may install that in the future. But for now, I think the Hurst short shifter seems to be fine. Shifting super quick or shifting at higher revs when the trans is cold, or is under the 75 F mark on the trans temp gauge, will usually cause the synchronizers and blockers to knick and crunch; going past 5k+ and shifting quick will most likely cause a full grind..

I typically baby the car, but the stock clutch also doesn’t like riding/slipping, so it’s typically a pretty consistent engagement. I usually don’t let the revs drop too much before shifting, or I’ll blip the throttle back up so the synchronizers don’t crunch or feel notchy. Having the AC on causes the revs to drop quickly when the clutch is dipped, so I also try to shift quickly and watch my revs during those times.

Aside from that, I may try a mix of 75W GL/4 gear oil and some Synchromesh (75w-80 GL-4). It’s more fitting to mix GL-4 gear oils, rather than combining some concoctions like ATF and gear oil/MTF, or maybe even throwing DCT fluid into the mix. I might also stick to DCT fluids if those work out decently. I know some Tremec T56 and TR-6060 owners saying it works well, as well the guys who drive Mustang GT’s with the Getrag MT-82. BMW and Ford DCT fluids cost a ton, so I might go with either Valvoline, Motul, or some other aftermarket brand like Amalie or Triax.

[hcch]

Thanks to all of you I just changed bot tranny and diff oils and the shifts feel so very smooth I used Amsoil for both, I choose the signature series’s I wish to know if is worth the extra money or is just marketing.

AMSOIL SIGNATURE SERIES MULTI-VEHICLE 100% SYNTHETIC AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSION FLUID

And

AMSOIL SEVERE GEAR® 75W-90 100% SYNTHETIC GEAR LUBE

I see most people use red line.

[acammer]

Originally Posted by hcch

Thanks to all of you I just changed bot tranny and diff oils and the shifts feel so very smooth I used Amsoil for both, I choose the signature series’s I wish to know if is worth the extra money or is just marketing.

AMSOIL SIGNATURE SERIES MULTI-VEHICLE 100% SYNTHETIC AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSION FLUID

And

AMSOIL SEVERE GEAR® 75W-90 100% SYNTHETIC GEAR LUBE

I see most people use red line.

On the whole Amsoil makes great stuff - I'm sure you'll be good with it.

[oldman14ss]

tremec has their own fluid also. i took about a 4ft piece of home air conditioner hose and chose clamped it to a funnel drilled a hole up the lip of the funnel for a piece of wire. i route the hose down thru the driver side of motor hang the wire some place on the hood to support funnel route hose into side of trans and bingo ! no lying on my back to install fluid after about 3.5 quarts i start checking level