How clean is my oil??? - Page 2 - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

nomadicdogg · 04-10-2011, 03:22 PM

3000 with synthetic is to often, 5 is reasonable
to hell with the oil life moniter. thats like an idiot gauge off a 50's car
you want to trust your motor to that, fine by you. as for me, every 5000

Ivas · 04-10-2011, 08:05 PM

Okay, so it's everyone's best guess. I'd rather err on the low side; for me, it's 3000 miles. The synthetic oil is more than other oil, yet it is hella cheaper than a shitted engine!

nomadicdogg · 04-10-2011, 09:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ivas

Okay, so it's everyone's best guess. I'd rather err on the low side; for me, it's 3000 miles. The synthetic oil is more than other oil, yet it is hella cheaper than a shitted engine!

3 is fine. wont hurt to go 5. wouldnt wait till the computer tells you to....
ever have a gps tell you to go straight on and there happens to be a lake in front of you???
yea. you know what Im talking about lol dont trust computers

NavyDood · 04-10-2011, 10:38 PM

By all means change it so you get that warm fuzzy feeling. There are 2 gallons of oil in our little ol 378ci V8. That is a butt load of oil.

My Dodge/Cummins is a lot more brutal on oil than what our Camaro's are. I go 25,000 miles between oil changes with an oil anaysis at the oil change. I could easily go at least 10,000 more miles, but I don't because I'm not running a bypass filter to reduce the soot levels in the oil.

It's your money and your car. Everyone has their ways.

DangerZL1 · 04-11-2011, 01:07 PM

I wouldn't change any synthetic below 5-7k miles, except for the first change. Synthetic oil will go much longer than regular petrol-based oils before beginning to break down. Any sooner is wasting a lot of money and is based on marketing from oil change places, old habits, and less advanced oil technology before synthetic oil usage became widespread. As pointed out above, the SS holds almost twice as much oil as the last gen Camaro, which also contributes to a longer oil life.

canadian ss · 04-11-2011, 01:34 PM

OLM's are for the manufacturer to get around a loop hole in the EPA laws to help vehicles meet low environmental impact on use of oil. Same with fuel demand. Laws are made frequently in this area to challenge manufacturers to meet the EPA standards.
The less times you change your oil a year, the less amount of oil is bought therefore drilled for and used up keeping our demand for crude lower and waste oil being illegally dumped or picked up for refinement.
The OLM works basically like a timer according to miles driven. It also states in the owners manual to change it more frequently in dustier climates just like your air filter.
It doesn't know between hot or cold weather driving or driving habits. (track use).
The manufacturer gets environmental credits when it meets or exceeds these areas.

Russell James · 04-11-2011, 01:55 PM

The OLM is an algorithm with two inputs - engine revolutions and engine temperature. 100% starts out with XXX,XXXX,XXXX,XXX... revolutions (whatever the number is they guestimated oil lasts under ideal engine temperatures). Each revolution decrements that number. Engine temperatures away from ideal also decrement the number. Basically a simple countdown counter that goes faster or slower based on two inputs.

You could drive 0 Miles, and the calculation would still count down from 100% to 0%.

One of the biggest assumptions though is that the oil is always full. Run low on oil, forget that calculation being accurate.

NavyDood · 04-11-2011, 03:50 PM

The algorithm was developed over the course of many years by several lubrication experts at GM Fuels and Lubes, spearheaded by Doctor Shirley Schwartz who holds the patents (with GM) for the algorithm and the oil life montitor. Each engine in GM vehicles has different programming requirements. The GM engine oil life monitor counts engine revolutions and accumulates the number for the basis of the oil life calculation. It then adds deterioration factors for operating temperature, start up temperature, soak times, ambient, coolant temperature, etc... There are a LOT of factors that "adjust" or affect the slope of the deterioration (not just a couple of parameters), but the fundamental deterioration is traced back to ZDDP depletion that is inescapable with engine revolutions. During testing the specific rate of ZDDP depletion was measured repeatedly for any given engine that utilizes the oil life monitor system. ZDDP is the fundamental item that is first calibrated for the oil life algorithm to tailor it specifically to that engine.

And food for thought... In a not so distant future a real time oil anaysis system may make it's way to new vehicles near you.

Russell James · 04-11-2011, 04:52 PM

Yes there are a lot of factors that go into the calculation, but unless they changed something recently - it's all based on two engine data inputs - revolutions and engine temperature. Every owner's manual and service manual has said the same thing for years that it is based on those two things. Engine temperature accounts for all the - cold start, ambient, load... factors.

TheHorse13 · 04-12-2011, 08:48 AM

Can anyone provide a documented source of information from GM? Link? The info in this thread goes from the simple to the complex with no real documented sources of information on the topic.

Thanks.

TOMS1SS · 04-12-2011, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheHorse13

Can anyone provide a documented source of information from GM? Link? The info in this thread goes from the simple to the complex with no real documented sources of information on the topic.

Thanks.

Try the manual in the glove box.

TheHorse13 · 04-12-2011, 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fearer2010SS

Try the manual in the glove box.

I mean for the other claims outside of what is mentioned in the manual.

TOMS1SS · 04-12-2011, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ivas

Okay, so it's everyone's best guess. I'd rather err on the low side; for me, it's 3000 miles. The synthetic oil is more than other oil, yet it is hella cheaper than a shitted engine!

Read the manual all the information you need is there.....

TOMS1SS · 04-12-2011, 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheHorse13

I mean for the other claims outside of what is mentioned in the manual.

Gotcha, sorry I keep seeing a bunch of this change your oil after 3,000 miles stuff throughout this forum and its driving me nuts. I took my DD to the dealership yesterday for a free oil change and tire rotation. The tech servicing my car didn't even know what the oil life monitor indicator light looked like.

The lack of real knowledge on this topic amazes me. You'd swear cars were built out of sheer voodoo and myth by some of the threads I see on this forum....

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04-10-2011, 03:22 PM	#15
nomadicdogg Drives: '10 2SS/RS Cyber Grey Camaro (sold) Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Western, PA Posts: 1,737 View My Garage	3000 with synthetic is to often, 5 is reasonable to hell with the oil life moniter. thats like an idiot gauge off a 50's car you want to trust your motor to that, fine by you. as for me, every 5000

04-10-2011, 08:05 PM	#16
Ivas el Ruco Drives: 2010 Camaro SS (now runnin' TENS ) Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Fontana, CA Posts: 7,388	Okay, so it's everyone's best guess. I'd rather err on the low side; for me, it's 3000 miles. The synthetic oil is more than other oil, yet it is hella cheaper than a shitted engine!

04-10-2011, 10:38 PM	#18
NavyDood Retired Navy Drives: 2010 2SS/RS Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: NW of DFW Posts: 915	By all means change it so you get that warm fuzzy feeling. There are 2 gallons of oil in our little ol 378ci V8. That is a butt load of oil. My Dodge/Cummins is a lot more brutal on oil than what our Camaro's are. I go 25,000 miles between oil changes with an oil anaysis at the oil change. I could easily go at least 10,000 more miles, but I don't because I'm not running a bypass filter to reduce the soot levels in the oil. It's your money and your car. Everyone has their ways.

04-11-2011, 01:07 PM	#19
DangerZL1 Drives: 2023 Black ZL1 Auto Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: FEMA Region 4 Posts: 2,936	I wouldn't change any synthetic below 5-7k miles, except for the first change. Synthetic oil will go much longer than regular petrol-based oils before beginning to break down. Any sooner is wasting a lot of money and is based on marketing from oil change places, old habits, and less advanced oil technology before synthetic oil usage became widespread. As pointed out above, the SS holds almost twice as much oil as the last gen Camaro, which also contributes to a longer oil life.

04-11-2011, 01:34 PM	#20
canadian ss Psycho on day pass Drives: 2010 yellow 1ss m6 -GM tech Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: grimsby, ont. Posts: 487 View My Garage	OLM's are for the manufacturer to get around a loop hole in the EPA laws to help vehicles meet low environmental impact on use of oil. Same with fuel demand. Laws are made frequently in this area to challenge manufacturers to meet the EPA standards. The less times you change your oil a year, the less amount of oil is bought therefore drilled for and used up keeping our demand for crude lower and waste oil being illegally dumped or picked up for refinement. The OLM works basically like a timer according to miles driven. It also states in the owners manual to change it more frequently in dustier climates just like your air filter. It doesn't know between hot or cold weather driving or driving habits. (track use). The manufacturer gets environmental credits when it meets or exceeds these areas.

04-11-2011, 01:55 PM	#21
Russell James Drives: '15 SS 1LE, '69 Z28 drag car Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Mich Posts: 4,482	The OLM is an algorithm with two inputs - engine revolutions and engine temperature. 100% starts out with XXX,XXXX,XXXX,XXX... revolutions (whatever the number is they guestimated oil lasts under ideal engine temperatures). Each revolution decrements that number. Engine temperatures away from ideal also decrement the number. Basically a simple countdown counter that goes faster or slower based on two inputs. You could drive 0 Miles, and the calculation would still count down from 100% to 0%. One of the biggest assumptions though is that the oil is always full. Run low on oil, forget that calculation being accurate.

04-11-2011, 03:50 PM	#22
NavyDood Retired Navy Drives: 2010 2SS/RS Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: NW of DFW Posts: 915	The algorithm was developed over the course of many years by several lubrication experts at GM Fuels and Lubes, spearheaded by Doctor Shirley Schwartz who holds the patents (with GM) for the algorithm and the oil life montitor. Each engine in GM vehicles has different programming requirements. The GM engine oil life monitor counts engine revolutions and accumulates the number for the basis of the oil life calculation. It then adds deterioration factors for operating temperature, start up temperature, soak times, ambient, coolant temperature, etc... There are a LOT of factors that "adjust" or affect the slope of the deterioration (not just a couple of parameters), but the fundamental deterioration is traced back to ZDDP depletion that is inescapable with engine revolutions. During testing the specific rate of ZDDP depletion was measured repeatedly for any given engine that utilizes the oil life monitor system. ZDDP is the fundamental item that is first calibrated for the oil life algorithm to tailor it specifically to that engine. And food for thought... In a not so distant future a real time oil anaysis system may make it's way to new vehicles near you.

04-11-2011, 04:52 PM	#23
Russell James Drives: '15 SS 1LE, '69 Z28 drag car Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Mich Posts: 4,482	Yes there are a lot of factors that go into the calculation, but unless they changed something recently - it's all based on two engine data inputs - revolutions and engine temperature. Every owner's manual and service manual has said the same thing for years that it is based on those two things. Engine temperature accounts for all the - cold start, ambient, load... factors.

04-12-2011, 08:48 AM	#24
TheHorse13 Drives: 2011 Black SS M6 Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Harpers Ferry, WV Posts: 1,116	Can anyone provide a documented source of information from GM? Link? The info in this thread goes from the simple to the complex with no real documented sources of information on the topic. Thanks.