GM Standards

[Mr. Notorious]

What is up with these 6 speeds? Seriously? I know there's a handful of threads out there on this already but I thought I'd try and pinpoint some questions here. Plus add a LITTLE gripe that has bugged me.

Every vette, CTS-V, and camaro I've driven the gear box is worse than a 70's jeep. It doesn't get anyone else pissed when they hop in a $20,000 civic and shifts a 6 speed smooth as butter? Or say a brand new wrangler? Wranglers are supposed to be one of the least luxurious vehicle out there, and I love how their 6 speeds shift nice and smooth. The tranny's in our GM cars are so notchy it drives me absolutely nuts. Anyone have a clue why that is? It's not a muscle car thing because the SRT8's don't do it. The new 5.0L did it slightly, but it also had an extreme short throw shifter in it.

But anyways down to my issue. I'm trying to get into a camaro this weekend, but it has a factory hurst short throw shifter. Do people find this shifter meshes with the gears any smoother? I figured not since it doesn't feel like a shifter issue. Do people find that over time their trannys "break in" so to speak and allow for smoother shifts between gears 1 and 4? I didn't think so since I've driven plenty of both new and used GM 6spds. Is there any jaw dropping differences with any other fluid out there I can put in? The deal is I put the first 2500 miles on a new SS and the shifting didn't get any better. Obviously from this thread the only biggest complaint I have about these cars is the transmission. What do you guys think?

[Stingr69]

I would go find some Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF and throw 4 quarts in there. Be sure it is the Synthetic ATF version - it WILL NOT be labled on the bottle for our newer cars as it is an older Dexron 3 based formulation. If you are grabbing the Mobil 1 that is labled for newer (2010) automatic spec cars it will not help and it will actually hurt so don't buy that one.

The synchros will work better especially when cold with this fluid. The notchyness will not go away 100% all of the time but this is a real good improvement especially for the $ and effort investment.

-Mark.

[MiSTER]

The Ford and Chrysler guys are having the same issue with the Tremec TR6060 also. Seems more like an issue with Tremec standards...

http://www.allfordmustangs.com/forum...ng-thread.html

http://blogs.insideline.com/roadtest...he-chills.html

[mtcwby]

Originally Posted by Mr. Notorious

What is up with these 6 speeds? Seriously? I know there's a handful of threads out there on this already but I thought I'd try and pinpoint some questions here. Plus add a LITTLE gripe that has bugged me.

Every vette, CTS-V, and camaro I've driven the gear box is worse than a 70's jeep. It doesn't get anyone else pissed when they hop in a $20,000 civic and shifts a 6 speed smooth as butter? Or say a brand new wrangler? Wranglers are supposed to be one of the least luxurious vehicle out there, and I love how their 6 speeds shift nice and smooth. The tranny's in our GM cars are so notchy it drives me absolutely nuts. Anyone have a clue why that is? It's not a muscle car thing because the SRT8's don't do it. The new 5.0L did it slightly, but it also had an extreme short throw shifter in it.

But anyways down to my issue. I'm trying to get into a camaro this weekend, but it has a factory hurst short throw shifter. Do people find this shifter meshes with the gears any smoother? I figured not since it doesn't feel like a shifter issue. Do people find that over time their trannys "break in" so to speak and allow for smoother shifts between gears 1 and 4? I didn't think so since I've driven plenty of both new and used GM 6spds. Is there any jaw dropping differences with any other fluid out there I can put in? The deal is I put the first 2500 miles on a new SS and the shifting didn't get any better. Obviously from this thread the only biggest complaint I have about these cars is the transmission. What do you guys think?

Quit your complaining.....The SRT8's have the same tranny, as well as the Vipers. You can't compare a Wrangler or Civic tranny with the TR6060.
Those vehicles don't have near the heavy duty tranny as the High HP applications of the 6060. Use some Royal Purple Synchromax in it and get used to it. If you still don't like it, sell your Camaro to someone who appreciates it and go buy a Civic.

[DarkObsession]

The factory Hurst is still notchy as you'd imagine.

Though I don't think it's as bad as you are describing and I have heard that if you use some higher quality transmission fluid that it goes away completely.

[Ghost-Rider]

All Tremec transmissions have been this way. Go try an old T-5 in a late 80's Mustang and it's probably 100 times worse. This TR6060 has a HUGE job to do: get 426hp to the ground for the complete life of the vehicle. This means that the synchos have to match speeds with big beefy gears and a driver that's revving up close to red line all while speed shifting.

A Civic or a Jeep trans has what?... 1/4 of the power to deal with? You're not fairly comparing apples to apples here.

[SSE 4 2SS]

Originally Posted by mtcwby

Quit your complaining.....The SRT8's have the same tranny, as well as the Vipers. You can't compare a Wrangler or Civic tranny with the TR6060.
Those vehicles don't have near the heavy duty tranny as the High HP applications of the 6060. Use some Royal Purple Synchromax in it and get used to it. If you still don't like it, sell your Camaro to someone who appreciates it and go buy a Civic.

[Amenti]

There was a thread a while back from a forum member who got screwed over by a dealership and they basically threw his tranny in the trunk of his Camaro and refused to work on it.

The only reason I bring this up is because in that thread, the member had a letter supposedly from an authorized Tremec dealer/mechanic that mentioned a problem with some sintered-metal component in the syncros that would fail and start to cause issues, and that this appeared to be happening pretty often. The letter also mentioned a carbon fiber replacement (for the component in question) that vastly improves the feel and reliability of the transmission.

Anyone see this as well? I didn't bookmark it or anything, since I a V6 Auto and I'm not really concerned with the Tremec TR6060.


EDIT:

Found it! http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=138433

Excerpt from one of the posts in that thread:

To Whom it may concern, On December 27 , 2O1O our shop received a transmission for repair from **************** NY for their customer, Anthony Curro, ***********Bellmore, NY 11710. The transmission is a 6 speed Tremec TR6060 from a 2010 Chevrolet Camaro, VIN ******EW3A9187173. The customer complained of grinding shifts in 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and 4th gears.This transmission had been disassembled for Mr. Curro by Paul Conte Chevrolet, in Freeport,NY. Our technicians found that the transmission had been disassembled by a technician who apparently has very little experience with these gear boxes.Upon a thorough cleaning and inspection we found that the original sintered metal synchronizer rings provided by Tremec to GM had failed, which in turn caused the failure ofthe synchronizer assemblies for 1st and second gear, and 3rd and fourth gear. There was also damage to the engagement teeth on the speed gears for 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and 4th gear which is the input. We replaced the damaged parts, and provided the latest design carbon fibersynchronizer rings from Tremec, updated the extension housing with a roller bearing to support the drive shaft yoke and returned the unit to ***** along with thefailed parts. ******* reinstalled the unit into Mr. Curro's Camaro and he is now driving the vehicle.We are the largest Tremec distributor for T56, TR6060, and T56 Magnum transmissions in the world. We rebuild and modify these transmissions for enthusiasts, professional and amateur race teams internationally, and we are the authorized rebuilder on this product for GM Racing.Mr. Curro stated that Paul Conte Chevrolet told him that they would not warranty his transmission because there was an aftermarket shifter installed, even though that was installed in the car when he had purchased it. This is an incorrect statement as the same shifter is still in the car after we rebuilt the transmission and the transmission operates flawlessly, according to Mr. Curro. lt is our professional opinion that the root cause of the transmission failure was the original sintered metal rings provided by Tremec to GM in this transmission. We have replaced hundreds of these rings with the later design carbon fiber and that has solved the shift problems. This unit should have been warranted by the dealer, and returned to Tremec by GM for replacement. The failure rate on the original sintered metal rings is huge. Please have any interested parties contact me at the above phone number for any further discussion

[ckaram]

My factory Hurst is not notchy at all when the trans is close to 180*. The 1-2 shift is like butter when it's fully warmed up.

If you're driving your car to work 5 miles or so one way, you'll be notchy. When I take the long way home and the trans gets nice and warm, no problem. It's the fluid viscosity relative to trans temp. You want notchy? Try driving a V6 M6...

[Mr. Notorious]

I hear you guys, the rant was well over due for me. Plus the SS was my FIRST brand new car, and I do consider myself anal so it just was a really unusual feeling for a brand spanking new car. It's about as bad as my rant against the bumper paint of the summit white not matching the rest of the panels Luckily for me my car will hopefully never see winter for the cold months, otherwise I'd really be complaining to you guys when the tranny is freezing cold. I'll try out the royal purple stuff, I put their oil in at the first 2000 miles. I didn't know if Dealerships get fussy if you change out fluids for different brands for something like tranny fluid (again me not having any first hand experience about how warranties and new cars). I did drive a hurst shifter equipped camaro tonight and it acted as expected. Not a ton better, but a little better drive. Anyone know if it is considered a weighted shifter? I guess I'll look forward to the warmer weather and try out the RP gear lube.

Jease, you guys didn't even catch that the civics are cable shifted

Do you guys feel they get any better or worse from when it's driven off the lot and gets more and more miles on it? I also need to look up getting the skip shift eliminating chip. That drove me nuts too that a manual forced me what gear to pick. I swear I'm done complaining now!

I saw that thread about the tranny being returned in the trunk of the car. Unbelievable. A part of me is wondering if they are changing out the manual tranny in the upcoming year or two. In any case it's better than having an automatic. Thanks for the suggestions, if anyone has any other lubes they swear by I'm all ears.

[IndeedSS1]

Mine is as notchy after a year and 18K miles. But odd as it may seem, the MGW shifter I had installed a couple of days ago has it feeling less notchy imo. But I do NOT have the grinding some have mentioned.

[n116ebo]

Love my auto, shifts great. Sorry for being a smart a$$.

[DarkObsession]

Very slightly off topic: How is the Royal Purple stuff at handling "abuse" ? I drag race AND daily drive my Camaro and I'd like to swap out the fluid but I want to swap it to something that will handle what I throw at it.

[jmaryt]

Originally Posted by Mr. Notorious

What is up with these 6 speeds? Seriously? I know there's a handful of threads out there on this already but I thought I'd try and pinpoint some questions here. Plus add a LITTLE gripe that has bugged me.

Every vette, CTS-V, and camaro I've driven the gear box is worse than a 70's jeep. It doesn't get anyone else pissed when they hop in a $20,000 civic and shifts a 6 speed smooth as butter? Or say a brand new wrangler? Wranglers are supposed to be one of the least luxurious vehicle out there, and I love how their 6 speeds shift nice and smooth. The tranny's in our GM cars are so notchy it drives me absolutely nuts. Anyone have a clue why that is? It's not a muscle car thing because the SRT8's don't do it. The new 5.0L did it slightly, but it also had an extreme short throw shifter in it.

But anyways down to my issue. I'm trying to get into a camaro this weekend, but it has a factory hurst short throw shifter. Do people find this shifter meshes with the gears any smoother? I figured not since it doesn't feel like a shifter issue. Do people find that over time their trannys "break in" so to speak and allow for smoother shifts between gears 1 and 4? I didn't think so since I've driven plenty of both new and used GM 6spds. Is there any jaw dropping differences with any other fluid out there I can put in? The deal is I put the first 2500 miles on a new SS and the shifting didn't get any better. Obviously from this thread the only biggest complaint I have about these cars is the transmission. What do you guys think?

dont know but you are absolutely correct as i have noticed the same thing,and i have been drivin' "direct drive" trannies for over 40 years!
i suspect the 'general" cut some kind of "sweetheart" deal with a foreign transmission supplier,and realized MAYBE that they was shippin' JUNK!..this is just an opinion,and i am referring specifically to the v-6's tranny,and of course,as always.your opinions may differ!..i HAVE noticed after approximately 7,000 miles ,my tranny is now shifting "butter smooth!" so yes, maybe it takes that long for all metal parts to "mesh" so to speak!..just sayin!