Can GM detect a V6 reflash?

[DevilKnightFalcon]

I saw the articles about how GM now has a way of determining the reflash history for V8s. Does anyone know if they have a similar technique for the V6? All of the documents i've seen specifically state that they apply to the V8 only.

[rtcat600man]

It has been reported on other threads that NO, it cannot be detected.

[CamaroSpike23]

Originally Posted by rtcat600man

It has been reported on other threads that NO, it cannot be detected.

its been reported that GM isnt as worried about V6 reflashes and that certain dealers have said they cant check it, but where has GM stepped in and said that they cant scan the reflashes?

[rtcat600man]

Originally Posted by CamaroSpike23

its been reported that GM isnt as worried about V6 reflashes and that certain dealers have said they cant check it, but where has GM stepped in and said that they cant scan the reflashes?

They haven't, that is why I said others have posted that they cannot see the reflash. But I personally don't believe that.

If you’re worried about tuning and being caught then one should not do it in the first place.

[CamaroSpike23]

Originally Posted by rtcat600man

They haven't, that is why I said others have posted that they cannot see the reflash. But I personally don't believe that.

If you’re worried about tuning and being caught then one should not do it in the first place.

thats my whole point . everyone is going off of regurgitated info and spewing it out as gospel.

I can tell you from speaking with GM engineers and the guys who wrote the programming on the V8 and V6 ECM's that if they want to, they can find a reflash. resetting the counter only bypasses the dealer level of comparing the flash counter to the "supposed" # of flashes for the car.

but when you tune these cars, and flash back, you still leave traces of the changes in the memory.

now, do I think a large number of people with v6 cars will have their warranty denied because of a tune? hell no. GM isn't as focused on warranty claims for the V6 dealing with aftermarket tunes. their priorities lay with the SS cars. now, if you blow the motor in the v6 after tuning somehow and GM does an investigation, chances are very high that they'll find that you tuned the car. but, the failure rate on the V6 engine is not significant enough for the majority of v6 owners to worry about voiding their warranty.


but at the end of the day, you gotta pay to play.

which makes me ask the question of aftermarket tuners, why no warranty to back up your product?

nearly every other modification out there has some sort of warranty to cover it if it fails or causes something else to fail... except a tune.

most all the tuners market a variant of a "hidden" tune or just say "flash it back to stock, the dealer will never know" but what happens to the guy who blows his motor 40 miles from home and doesnt have his tuner in the car? flatbed comes and gets the car, do you think the dealer is going to sit there and watch as you flash back to stock?

[rtcat600man]

Originally Posted by CamaroSpike23

thats my whole point . everyone is going off of regurgitated info and spewing it out as gospel.

I can tell you from speaking with GM engineers and the guys who wrote the programming on the V8 and V6 ECM's that if they want to, they can find a reflash. resetting the counter only bypasses the dealer level of comparing the flash counter to the "supposed" # of flashes for the car.

but when you tune these cars, and flash back, you still leave traces of the changes in the memory.

now, do I think a large number of people with v6 cars will have their warranty denied because of a tune? hell no. GM isn't as focused on warranty claims for the V6 dealing with aftermarket tunes. their priorities lay with the SS cars. now, if you blow the motor in the v6 after tuning somehow and GM does an investigation, chances are very high that they'll find that you tuned the car. but, the failure rate on the V6 engine is not significant enough for the majority of v6 owners to worry about voiding their warranty.


but at the end of the day, you gotta pay to play.

which makes me ask the question of aftermarket tuners, why no warranty to back up your product?

nearly every other modification out there has some sort of warranty to cover it if it fails or causes something else to fail... except a tune.

most all the tuners market a variant of a "hidden" tune or just say "flash it back to stock, the dealer will never know" but what happens to the guy who blows his motor 40 miles from home and doesnt have his tuner in the car? flatbed comes and gets the car, do you think the dealer is going to sit there and watch as you flash back to stock?

exactly......

[bee sting]

Wants a tune but I'm scared GM will decline a warranty claim if one came up . Not afraid to admit it .

[The_Blur]

You're asking the wrong question. The real question asks, "Do they care?"

[CamaroSpike23]

Originally Posted by bee sting

Wants a tune but I'm scared GM will decline a warranty claim if one came up . Not afraid to admit it .

the biggest issue is that you would have to sufficiently mess up the engine enough for them to "want" to look into the tuning.

Originally Posted by The_Blur

You're asking the wrong question. The real question asks, "Do they care?"

[bill@hptuners]

Do they care? Probably not

Could they tell if they really wanted to, yes.

I think the whole "can they tell" argument goes back to diesels, with tuning you can add a hundred hp/ftlb and things will simply start breaking. On a non boosted DI motor its not going to add a huge amount of hp/tq so they likely haven't seen much breakage thus far. If it became a problem the bean counters might start looking closer at it to see if its worth their time to investigate further.

[CamaroSpike23]

Originally Posted by bill@hptuners

Do they care? Probably not

Could they tell if they really wanted to, yes.

I think the whole "can they tell" argument goes back to diesels, with tuning you can add a hundred hp/ftlb and things will simply start breaking. On a non boosted DI motor its not going to add a huge amount of hp/tq so they likely haven't seen much breakage thus far. If it became a problem the bean counters might start looking closer at it to see if its worth their time to investigate further.

[camaro1]

all newer GM vehicles have a cvn(calibration verification number) stored in the pcm / tcm , anytime an aftermarket tune is applied to the module the cvn # changes and will no longer match the number that gm has stored in its data-base

if you show up at the dealer with a bad engine or trans the cvn# is required before a major repair or replacement of the engine/trans can be approved by gm,, the dealer has no control over this. if the numbers dont match the warranty is automatically void and the repair and any time the tech has in the vehicle can become the customer responsibility.