New L99 owner--Your bolt on/tune advice would be very welcomed!

[Padre]

Originally Posted by mikeSS

padre, i dont care what BS you give us. dyno, track blah blah blah, its simply NOT possible, the stock ecm can only go so far. any shop here would say the same, but of course they do not want to get into this debate.

Vendors don't dispute it because they know they can't dispute their own numbers. For example, my experience with a Fastlane CAI matches exactly the one reliable CAI study presented by Jannetty. They claim 15.9 hp on the dyno, I claim 19 on the track x 20% drivetrain loss, which is 15.2 hp. It's the same with the other mods.
https://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?...=1&output=html

"The stock ecm can only go so far"



When you get some track time and understand what is involved in tuning, I'm sure you may one day contribute something more useful.

Padre

[Moody'sSS]

For what it's worth I believe..Great journal..

Originally Posted by Padre

Vendors don't dispute it because they know they can't dispute their own numbers. For example, my experience with a Fastlane CAI matches exactly the one reliable CAI study presented by Jannetty. They claim 15.9 hp on the dyno, I claim 19 on the track x 20% drivetrain loss, which is 15.2 hp. It's the same with the other mods.
https://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?...=1&output=html

"The stock ecm can only go so far"



When you get some track time and understand what is involved in tuning, I'm sure you may one day contribute something more useful.

Padre

[brantley847]

Originally Posted by mikeSS

padre, i dont care what BS you give us. dyno, track blah blah blah, its simply NOT possible, the stock ecm can only go so far. any shop here would say the same, but of course they do not want to get into this debate.

so i am going to leave it at that. you have your self totally convinced, so i am not going to bother anymore.

I should have realized earlier it wasn't worth it... he has himself convinced and as long as he is happy, I guess we can let him believe that dyno's never lie and track times are only based on RWHP. He ran a 12.1 ya know?

[Padre]

Originally Posted by brantley847

I should have realized earlier it wasn't worth it... he has himself convinced and as long as he is happy, I guess we can let him believe that dyno's never lie and track times are only based on RWHP. He ran a 12.1 ya know?

It's pretty clear you didn't read the advice given to you in your own thread: http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=161660

Congratulations, you post one question about L99 and Dynos, a few people give general responses, and now you're the expert. What Jannetty posted in your thread contains some wisdom that might help you:

Power on the Dyno will always show up at the track as MPH.
Power to Weight dictates MPH.
MPH dictates Best achievable ET.
You need HP to Reach your ET Goals.
ET is Chassis and Driver.
I have seen 700 hp cars go 13s LOL!

When you have at least one pass in your L99 Camaro at the track, then come lecture us with your "wisdom" about Dynos and track numbers and RWHP.

As you said, "I agree, what this can do on a track should supersede bragging numbers..."

As it is, good luck getting your dyno-queen out of the 13's.

Padre

[cipriank]

im with padre all the way...tried and tested on the track...great journal!

[Supercharged SS]

Originally Posted by upsidedown

jannetty racing is a great place. ted and ALL the staff are knowledable and friendly. its easy to get addicted to them, they got me up to 1200 engine horsepower and i'm sure i'll be back for more.

What else could you possibly need!!!

[2SSRSinBama]

also a new L99 owner..

the route i'm going is Magnaflow Tru X-pipe(resonator delete), Magnaflow 14156 mufflers, just a K&N Drop in, and a Trifecta tune... i've been dealing with turbo cars for years, I'd like to see a tuned K&N drop in compared to the short ram and CAI kits from vendors, because I am telling you with these new air boxes manufacturers are putting out, the gains are VERY LITTLE by switching to a short ram or CAI... and almost all of the gains are in the filter themself NOT the piping, that is true for turbo and s/c cars and I'd love to see this comparison done with these cars... its not 10 years ago, gone are the days of throwing on a CAI and gaining 25whp over stock... the air filter itself is where its at...

as far as my tune, well, in Vince I trust.... the man is a very good tuner

I may add headers on down the road, basically a better sounding exhaust, the better flowing intake, and a damn nice tune is all i'm looking for... the tune to wake the transmission up and get rid of the DOD crap

[Supercharged SS]

Your theory on the cai is incorrect. We tested a k and n drop in, Jannetty and myself, and we gained absolutely nothing.

Originally Posted by 2SSRSinBama

also a new L99 owner..

the route i'm going is Magnaflow Tru X-pipe(resonator delete), Magnaflow 14156 mufflers, just a K&N Drop in, and a Trifecta tune... i've been dealing with turbo cars for years, I'd like to see a tuned K&N drop in compared to the short ram and CAI kits from vendors, because I am telling you with these new air boxes manufacturers are putting out, the gains are VERY LITTLE by switching to a short ram or CAI... and almost all of the gains are in the filter themself NOT the piping, that is true for turbo and s/c cars and I'd love to see this comparison done with these cars... its not 10 years ago, gone are the days of throwing on a CAI and gaining 25whp over stock... the air filter itself is where its at...

as far as my tune, well, in Vince I trust.... the man is a very good tuner

I may add headers on down the road, basically a better sounding exhaust, the better flowing intake, and a damn nice tune is all i'm looking for... the tune to wake the transmission up and get rid of the DOD crap

[2SSRSinBama]

...and i'll do my own research when its hit the dyno for tuning

especially once I get the stock air box and look it over... if we have the snorkel coming out of the bottom like the turbo Cobalts do, yeah, let me do a K&N drop in with the "air box mod".. and i'll gladly show the baseline dyno before and after... because on those cars, drop in with the airbox mod was good for about 20whp once tuned... the 'other' CAIs became known as a "sound mod" for the turbo because of the shit results they produced... that ranged from AEM to Injen to Hahn to K&N... all of them gave subpar gains and NONE of them matched the K&N with modded air box mod... ZZP ran the stock air box into 11s on the stock turbo and they were one of the few that ever reached 11s on the stock turbo.... all they while they were selling a "cold air intake" kit

I haven't had the airbox out of the car yet, hell, i've had the car for 7 days... and you may very well be right... but I'll cross that bridge when I get there and I highly suspect with tuning, its going to be damn close... has been on most cars I've seen tuned in the last 5 years or so...

[mcdoogle6969]

I did axle-back exhaust and cold air intake first. Got my tune done after I installed headers...Well, the modding bug just gets worse from there. I'm currently supercharged now and the motor will get forged this winter.

[SGOS252382]

Many factors come into play that affect E.T. and Trap Speeds such as
wheel size, tires, wheel weight, gears, converter stall speed, vehicles weight/weight removal.

Its not just RWHP. I've seen guys run .4 faster and trap several MPH higher by just putting drag wheels and tires on their car. So you need to look at everything (in combination) that is affecting a car's track time (not just rwhp).

About tuning on an L99 A6. A tune does wonders on an L99 A6. The reason is found in the inceased torque, increased shift firmness, and shift speeds.
Even Padre's times (pre-engine tune) where done with the transmission tuned. The tranny tune is the best parts of the "tune" for an L99 A6.

My car picked up between 20-30 ft lb of torque (mid range) and 25 ft lbs peak Torque with a tune. It's this torque that gets the car moving down the track.

And again.
You need to look at the combination of mods a car is running.
My car trapped 114 mph (bolt ons only) with only 31 rwhp over stock. Thats a good 7-8 mph faster than stock with only 31 rwhp. But my car is making about 50 ft lbs more than stock. Combine that with drag radials and some fast shifting (thanks to the tranny tune) and I ran a 12.1 @ 114 mph (pre -converter and on 20" wheels).

[Padre]

Originally Posted by SGOS252382

Many factors come into play that affect E.T. and Trap Speeds such as wheel size, tires, wheel weight, gears, converter stall speed, vehicles weight/weight removal..

I agree. What is important to understand, however, is that with experience, these factors are knowable. That's why you have to track it to understand what's going on when you change these various factors.

With my build, because I've had good baselines and consistent runs, I can see where the changes are coming from. For example, after a good baseline with the tranny tune, we were able to see some amazing results with just the High Flow Cats and later just the Shorties.

I was looking at an old log from my GTO days, from HPP Magazine's shootout that I participated in back in 2007:



From it you can see how I was able to replicate each run to within a very tight margin of error. This enables me to see what changes do (and don't do). Wit the the Camaro, that's why I do seven runs with each mod. Consistency shows results every time.

All it takes is track time. The dyno is useful also for comparison sakes and can be consistent as well if you understand the factors involved.

Padre

[SGOS252382]

Originally Posted by Padre

I agree. What is important to understand, however, is that with experience, these factors are knowable. That's why you have to track it to understand what's going on when you change these various factors.

With my build, because I've had good baselines and consistent runs, I can see where the changes are coming from. For example, after a good baseline with the tranny tune, we were able to see some amazing results with just the High Flow Cats and later just the Shorties.

I was looking at an old log from my GTO days, from HPP Magazine's shootout that I participated in back in 2007:

Attachment 275197



From it you can see how I was able to replicate each run to within a very tight margin of error. This enables me to see what changes do (and don't do). Wit the the Camaro, that's why I do seven runs with each mod. Consistency shows results every time.

All it takes is track time. The dyno is useful also for comparison sakes and can be consistent as well if you understand the factors involved.

Padre

There are days I miss my GTO.:(
There are a bunch of them running around my area. There weren't all that many GTOs sold from 04-06, but I see several everytime I leave the house. The owner of a local performance shop even drives a TT LS2 GTO.