How much is reasonable now (base price), given the 'Ring times?

[BiggFoot]

Originally Posted by radz28

Personally, I know that $50K isn't going to cut if for this performance. We know there aren't going to be many options, so it's not like we can start at $50K, and have choices to build ZL1 to $58K, say. Maybe we'll only get a suede insert, chunky Chicago Autoshow forged wheels, and MYD as options. I don't know, and make no illusions. I'll start at near $52K for a base price .

I went with the 52.5K base price just because I was pretty much thinking that is where it would be anyway. The track time really doesnt mean that much to me (ducking the tomatoes coming my way ).

As to the options, I tend to agree with Radz, the list wont be too long. I thought about upgrading to the chrome wheels BUt if it will add any significant amount of weight over the stock black wheels, then I will not go for this option. Instead I will sell the stock wheels and replace with a forged lightweight chrome wheel option.

I might be tempted to select the IOM interior (if that is offered as an option) since I am still leaning toward IOM exterior color.

I am beginning to think my original estimate of the 1/4 mile time of 12.1 will be bested. I am now beginning to anticipate a sub 12 sec time (11.8 - 11.9 range).

Time will tell on a lot of things.

[GoldenBear]

The experiment of trying to sell Camaros that are priced beyond their market segment has been run already in 1969 with the 9560 COPO Camaros. They were extremely difficult to sell because there is a limit to how much money one will pay for a Camaro, regardless of its performance. I'm hoping that Chevrolet will not attempt to repeat the same experiment in 2012 with the ZL1.

[blufin]

Initially I was hoping for about 49k starting point. Now that more info is available, I'm starting to bump that figure up. My heart tells me it will be slightly above the GT500 with the SVT package, putting base around 54-55. If this is true, them they have priced me out of the market. I'm a firefighter, I don't make a lot of money. Since I don't have any kids, I have a little more disposable income than others and I'm hoping dearly that I am wrong, and the base is 52k. At that price, I may be able to beg the boss(wife) and convince her that we can still pay our bills, save for retirement and go out once in a while.

[IOMZL1]

Originally Posted by GoldenBear

The experiment of trying to sell Camaros that are priced beyond their market segment has been run already in 1969 with the 9560 COPO Camaros. They were extremely difficult to sell because there is a limit to how much money one will pay for a Camaro, regardless of its performance. I'm hoping that Chevrolet will not attempt to repeat the same experiment in 2012 with the ZL1.

People buy Camaros from SLP, Berger, Nickey, etc. and modify Camaros though Lingenfelter and Hennessey for the equal or greater cost than what we expect to pay for the ZL1. People do this instead of modding the car themselves because they want a higher performance with a ‘factory feel’. They are willing to pay a premium for this. Granted, it may be at a lower volume but I don't expect that when GM offers a car with a factory warranty that out performs these ‘tuner’ cars the market will suddenly vanish. GM has seen this hole in the market and they are cashing in and if anything they are stealing customers from these tuners along with possibly from other brands and models.

That's of course assuming the price is higher than the GT500 by a significant amount. If they don't charge over $60k it will be the best value top-end pony car out there today, perhaps even ever. If the price is too high, the Z28 (if it exists) has an even larger hole to fill in the market and a bigger competitor to take on – the GT500. What if the Z28 beats the GT500 for less money? GM is raising the bar here and more power to them. Maybe they want to lead Ford here, maybe they want to change the game, maybe what has been perceived as ‘catch up’ all along has been something very, very different.

[radz28]

Originally Posted by fbodfather

VERY FEW options........nearly everything is standard.

Hmm... See - if the options were limited close to what we've been told (suede, A6, wheels), then that makes me think between $55-57K, maybe. Hmm... I hope I'm close...

Originally Posted by ShnOmac

This car is making us all crazy......

ESTOY LOCO!!!

Originally Posted by Camaro_Corvette

It doesn't need options cause it's perfect

It's certainly looking that way

Originally Posted by GoldenBear

The experiment of trying to sell Camaros that are priced beyond their market segment has been run already in 1969 with the 9560 COPO Camaros. They were extremely difficult to sell because there is a limit to how much money one will pay for a Camaro, regardless of its performance. I'm hoping that Chevrolet will not attempt to repeat the same experiment in 2012 with the ZL1.

I'm confident GM knows and has learned from this. I just hope they didn't build a car greater than the budget they figured we'd accept.

Originally Posted by IOMZL1

People buy Camaros from SLP, Berger, Nickey, etc and modify Camaros though Lingenfelter and Hennessey for the equal or greater cost than what we expect to pay for the ZL1. This may be at a lower volume but I don't expect when GM offers a car with a factory warranty that out performs these cars the market will suddenly vanish. GM has seen this hole and they are cashing in. That's of course if the price is higher than the GT500. If they don't charge that much it will be the best value top-end pony car out there today

Chevy's always been about value. I'd find it tough to see it otherwise. We're going to find out though

[GoldenBear]

Originally Posted by IOMZL1

People buy Camaros from SLP, Berger, Nickey, etc and modify Camaros though Lingenfelter and Hennessey for the equal or greater cost than what we expect to pay for the ZL1. This may be at a lower volume but I don't expect when GM offers a car with a factory warranty that out performs these cars the market will suddenly vanish. GM has seen this hole and they are cashing in. That's of course if the price is higher than the GT500. If they don't charge that much it will be the best value top-end pony car out there today

True, but those tuner vehicles sales make up a tiny fraction of total Camaro sales. Chevrolet can't produce the small number of vehicles that those tuner manufacturers produce and still make a profit. Chevrolet needs to sell vehicles in large numbers in order to stay in business. If Chevrolet prices the ZL1 so that they can only sell 69 of them, they will be in trouble.

[JoshBobGuptaMarley]

This is gonna be a 60k $ car.

[lbls1]

I saw a clue.....look up^

[JoshBobGuptaMarley]

They are just not gonna sell a 580hp car for less than 60k.

[IOMZL1]

Originally Posted by GoldenBear

True, but those tuner vehicles sales make up a tiny fraction of total Camaro sales. Chevrolet can't produce the small number of vehicles that those tuner manufacturers produce and still make a profit. Chevrolet needs to sell vehicles in large numbers in order to stay in business. If Chevrolet prices the ZL1 so that they can only sell 69 of them, they will be in trouble.

Agreed, and I don't know the total numbers for all of these tuner sales but it is more than 69. It is probably closer to 1000 or more including all of the tuners out there. Or if you just ask who has spent $60,000 or more on a 5th gen Camaro no matter if it was modded or purchased that way.

If the ZL1 uses much of the same technology and tuning as found the Z28 (if it exists), the cost is spread over two cars and now you have a Z28 to help make profits back. Plus this could be considered the ‘test mule’ for the Gen III MR suspension. Lots of ways to spread the cost, there might be more than meets the eye here.

The ZL1 is making news and catching peoples interest. It is a halo car by definition. The better the ZL1 performs, the more people buy Camaros. Look at it as an advertizing program – instead of throwing the money away on a billboard you have learned how to make a 4000 pound car own the ‘ring and in essence created your own advertising program. That knowledge can be used across the board at GM. Paying people for advertising? Bah! Just tweet the ‘ring time and watch it spread like wildfire. That’s money well spent whether the ZL1 turns a profit or not.

If it is unaffordable, some may opt for the Mustang, but many will still buy a Camaro, be it the RS, SS, or Z28 (if it exists).

My only point is here to look beyond the raw dollars and cents spent in the [ZL1 Box], rather think of it as money spent in the [GM, ZL1, Z28, Gen III MR, Camaro, Advertizing, Brand Recognition, Marketing] box. Sell 10 ZL1s and it has already made its money back.

(Just my opinion based on no facts.)

[Brad02SS]

I'm starting to think $55-60k. I've got some saving to do. What's a kidney going for on the black market?

[Z4me]

All this conversation about the MSRP starting price for the ZL1 kinda gave me a flash back of sorts. Back in 1987 when I bought my Buick Grand National the price was more in line for what were paying for SS camaro.
But at the time they offered a more powerful and faster version called the
GNX. Wow sweet car for the time but was way out of my budget, with
starting a family and a new house. So I came back to reality and bought
the more massed produced Grand national. I don't know the final official
numbers of how many GNX's were sold but it was not alot.

I decided to just go with the grand national and as I had the money I
modded the car over the next few years.

I kinda see a similarity here between the SS and the new ZL1. Depending
where you are in your life and what you can afford will be a deciding
factor for many of the viewers of this forums. I'm hoping that the price
will remain reasonable for most but that candle light is starting to look
a bit dimmer.

[fiascoes1]

Originally Posted by fbodfather

VERY FEW options........nearly everything is standard.

Oh no! Are you giving us a hint? Did you guys see that the FBODFATHER picked 57,500 as his reasonable price? WE BETTER START SAVING, DONATE BLOOD, SELL A KIDNEY, ETC...

[BoostedX2]

Originally Posted by fiascoes1

Oh no! Are you giving us a hint? Did you guys see that the FBODFATHER picked 57,500 as his reasonable price? WE BETTER START SAVING, DONATE BLOOD, SELL A KIDNEY, ETC...

I see that, bad news!